#21  
Old 11-09-2018, 07:17 PM
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Thanks for the feedback. What is the ‘SP’ cam.

Also, I’m assuming that if I go the cam swap route, I will need new springs as well. I’ve never actually done that. Is it difficult? Do the heads have to come off the engine?


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SP = stump puller, as Tom noted the smaller SD cam

  #22  
Old 11-10-2018, 06:24 PM
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How do I determine this? This weekend I will go through the photos of my 400 build. I’m pretty sure these pistons have valve reliefs, but not a dish. I believe i misspoke earlier in the thread - they are likely at zero-deck. I do remember when the shop built my 1967 HO engine, they used a dished piston, but that was done more recently than this motor.


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CR calculator

http://www.wallaceracing.com/cr_test2.php

  #23  
Old 11-21-2018, 12:14 PM
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A couple more questIons:
If I go with the SP roller-hydraulic, can i use stock rocker arms? If not, should i go with a different ratio?
Can I use stock pushrods or do I have to measure for new ones?
Which valve springs match this cam (or do I just ask Dave at SDP)?

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  #24  
Old 11-21-2018, 02:04 PM
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A couple more questIons:
If I go with the SP roller-hydraulic, can i use stock rocker arms? If not, should i go with a different ratio?
Can I use stock pushrods or do I have to measure for new ones?
Which valve springs match this cam (or do I just ask Dave at SDP)?
If you're going to buy your cam from SD, would work with them directly on related component advice. As I recall there are several threads in the "Street" forum on spring choices for the SP and other SDP cams.

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Old 11-21-2018, 07:01 PM
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If you're going to buy your cam from SD, would work with them directly on related component advice. As I recall there are several threads in the "Street" forum on spring choices for the SP and other SDP cams.
Tom has mentioned previously you will need the entire kit, if your heads they may also need work to accommodate the higher lift

  #26  
Old 06-01-2019, 01:41 PM
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So I’m leaning towards trying the Crower 60243 swap for now (cheaper than the HR route). I know the recommendation is to run Rhoads lifters with this. Can I use stock pushrods and what about valve springs? I didn’t see any ‘kits’ that had both the cam and springs.

Thanks.


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Old 06-01-2019, 03:22 PM
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The 60243 would not have too have rhoads in a 400 up close to 10:1 SCR IMHO. But the vmaxs rhoads leave a lot of room for tuning and they are a nice high quality lifter. You do have to make your valve terrain adjustable to run them, and switching to a set of 7/16 rocker studs would be a good idea too. I do not run the original rhoads, I do not care for them as much, I would rather run a regular lifter personally over an original rhoads. Others like them though, I just feel the vmaxs made them obsolete. If you do not like the vmaxs you can adjust them so they act like a normal lifter or if you like what they do you can make it idle smoother, add some vacuum and some bottom end torque. Originals what they do they do, people like them or hate them. The valve springs are a must with that 60243 cam, it is way past coil bind on the exhaust lift.. Stock push rods will work fine.

This is link below is about the best book cam I know of if your trying to keep stock valve springs and pushrods. But I still prefer that 60243 though if you have the compression up near 10. Jay

https://www.lunatipower.com/street-m...8-276-286.html

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Old 10-14-2019, 09:48 PM
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Hi Jay
Sorry for falling off the map for a bit. You mentioned that if I went with the Crower 60243 cam I would have to upgrade my springs. Is there a specific set that matched that cam?

Frank


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Old 10-14-2019, 10:02 PM
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Lol, no worries. My project get pushed back all the time to.

Crower 68404 springs would a good choice for the stock installed height for a Pontiac D port and a hft cam.

I have noticed Crower has gotten kind of pricey on their cams lately.


Last edited by Jay S; 10-14-2019 at 10:13 PM.
  #30  
Old 10-14-2019, 10:14 PM
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Thanks! Is this something I can do myself? Swapping the springs? Or should I pull the heads and have a machine shop do it?


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  #31  
Old 10-14-2019, 10:44 PM
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Thanks! Is this something I can do myself? Swapping the springs? Or should I pull the heads and have a machine shop do it?


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That is up to you, can certainly be done in the car.

You need one of these spring removal tools, or something similar:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/oes-25064/

Only thing it takes to do it is make sure each piston is about all the way up toward tdc as you work your way around changing the springs. Some people pull a plug out and stuff a rag in the cylinder to help hold the valve up. Other people use compressed air through the spark plug. On many double springs the inner spring is removed and the cam is broke in with out it, then put back in after the brake in. So a person gets to pull the springs off twice. Probably optional on that cam, but if you talked to a crower rep they would tell you it needs to be done.


Last edited by Jay S; 10-14-2019 at 10:47 PM. Reason: Edit
  #32  
Old 03-02-2020, 02:41 PM
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I'm reviving this thread since I just ordered my parts and have some install questions. I decided to go with the HFT cam. Here is what I ordered:
  • Crower 60243 cam
  • Crower 68404-16 springs
  • Crower 86072-16 seals
  • Crower 87048-16 retainers

I also ordered a set of Johnson Hy-Lift lifters from Paul K on this website.

I was wondering if I will need to replace the following parts as well:
  • New valve keepers (or can I reuse the ones I have)
  • Timing chain set (engine has between 1000-2000 miles on it)
  • Pushrods

Would you also recommend installing the BBC 7/16 rocker studs? What about roller rockers?

I'm assuming for the most part, the cam swap is done with the engine in the car, but I noticed that I have an oil leak when I leave the car parked (assuming rear main seal). Ugh. I was considering just pulling the engine when the cam parts arrive, so I can take care of that at the same time, unless that can also be done with engine in car.

I just ordered the parts today, so I will probably come up with 20 more questions before the parts actually arrive.

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Old 03-02-2020, 06:35 PM
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Easier to do the cam swap out of the car if your working on a oil leak anyway.

As long as the new retainers are 7*, you can reuse the old 7 degree keepers.

I would go to 7/16 studs.

As for rockers, you really do not need roller rockers. But if you want to go that route, there is a good chance you will need a little longer push rod if you go roller. A melling Ram air 4 11/32 push rods might work, they are about halve the price of other aftermarkets. More a trial and error check, then see how the contact patterns are on the valve. I would try the OEMs you have first. Narrower pattern the better. I think most 1.5s rollers run 1.52ish actual. You might be able to run a 1.6 ratio. The 1.65 will make the intake pushrods hit the head with that cam. It happens at about max lift. A 1.6 roller rocker will be close to hitting with that cam. Depends on the brand of rocker, and how they have the fulcrum positioned.

The other possibility other than stock 1.5s is a set of melling 1.65 ram air 4 rockers. You could probably use the stock pushrods yet. But it would be a good idea to up grade them to a compcams hi-tech. I would install 1.65s on the exhausts. Then test fit them on the intake to see if the push rod hits the head. If they hit the head just run the original 1.5s and the on the intake and 1.65s on the exhaust. The ram air 4 rocker run just over 1.6 on the ratio. The aftermarket 1.65s make the intake push rods hit on the head and it takes a bunch of grinding to clear.


Last edited by Jay S; 03-02-2020 at 06:48 PM. Reason: Edit
  #34  
Old 03-02-2020, 09:59 PM
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Thanks Jay. I guess I should also order a cam degree kit as well, right?

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Old 03-03-2020, 09:05 AM
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Yes to do it right you need to degree the cam in. It needs to be 108-109 ICL.

FWIW...You can use just a degree wheel and a dial indicator if you don’t want to get a kit. Probably save about $100. You just thread a 3” x 5/8 fine threaded bolt into the crank. Then use a 5/8 nut to tighten the degree wheel to the nose of the crank. Then use some wire or coat hanger to make a pointer.

I suggest lining the timing marks up on the dampener and front cover. Usually pull the dampener off first, then slide it back on to align the TDC dampner mark with of the TDC timing cover mark. Pulling every thing off the front of the engine without rotating it. Install the new cam and timing set. Put the degree wheel on, the engine should be close to tdc yet. Tighten the jam nut down to lock the degree wheel down. Then put the pointer (most use a coat hanger or wire) set it to zero. Check to make sure it zeros at tdc with number 1 pistons. Some guys make a tdc tool from a spark plug. Lots of methods for tdc tools. Make sure the tdc tool stops the pistons at the same degree in both side of tdc, adjust if necessary. Your ready to degree it in.

If you have a stock type melling timing set, most of the time a Mr. gasket 2 degree key is needed to get it to 108-109. A 2 degree offset key moves it 4. The aftermarket double roller sets have ret/abv keys and marks. There is a 3 position and an 8 position. Adjusting the timing depends on what timing set you have.

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Old 03-05-2020, 07:40 PM
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Thanks Jay. My home shop is going to be sheetocked next week and then I will start the teardown. Should I also consider pulling the heads just to see what pistons are in the rebuild? I don't remember there being dishes cut in them like I had for my 1967 GTO 400. Also, there's no way to pull the engine without removing the hood, right?

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  #37  
Old 03-05-2020, 09:47 PM
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Thanks Jay. My home shop is going to be sheetocked next week and then I will start the teardown. Should I also consider pulling the heads just to see what pistons are in the rebuild? I don't remember there being dishes cut in them like I had for my 1967 GTO 400. Also, there's no way to pull the engine without removing the hood, right?
If you don't want to pull the hood, you can get the car up real high on a lift, then cut the frame leaving the engine/trans in place and drop out from the bottom?

Gotta pull the hood.

I saw the mention of 7/16" rocker arm studs. I use the ARP Big Block 7/16" rocker arm studs and you will need a set of matching poly locks. This will make your valve train adjustable. There are a few different sizes on the ARP studs and can't recall what size I went with. Maybe another member can recommend the part number and the poly lock to use.


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Old 03-05-2020, 09:56 PM
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You can usually see if it has a dished piston by looking down a spark plug hole and shining a light down the cylinder.

The poly’s depend the stud length and what rocker arm you end up using.


Last edited by Jay S; 03-05-2020 at 09:59 PM. Reason: Edit
  #39  
Old 04-23-2020, 07:40 PM
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So my Crower parts arrived last week (cam and springs) and I bought a set of Johnson lifters from a fellow forum member. I thought my rear main was leaking, so I figured I’d pull the motor, so the cam swap on the stand, and put it one of the BOP one piece rear main seals. In looking under the car today, I’m not so sure that I have a rear main leak. Looks like I might have an oil pan and oil plug leak (as well as my recently installed power steering). Can you guys take a look at these photos and see if it’s a rear main, and if not, should I just do cam swap in the car? Can it still be degrees that way? Or would you just pull it out anyway.










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  #40  
Old 04-23-2020, 07:53 PM
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Default camshaft swap, head swap, or just build a new 'play' motor

Every single oil pan bolt was loose. I wonder if my rear main is fine. There are less than 2000 miles on this engine


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