GTO Failure from the Goat's mouth...

[Mr_GTO]

Rich, sorry but you have posted ZERO facts all refuted...so they aren't facts.

[Stuckinda60s]

Yeah, ok. You're right. It was a rousing success. They could have sold 10's of thousands more. It was an instant classic and you can't buy one for less than 30k, when you can find one for sale. They're a great investment and you'll double your money in 3-years. Are those facts?

One quick question. Didn't Bob Lutz say that they were planning to make it in the States after the 3-years if it was well enough received?

My facts were refuted by whom? I've seen no one refute them, just say that I was wrong. Why don't you post some facts to refute them? You see, that's how it's done. You don't just emotionally say that someone is wrong and that makes it so. You need to show just where they are saying something that's untrue with some facts of your own.

Rich

[Stuckinda60s]

Here's a link to some FACTS. See, that's how it's done. Refute them, if you can.

http://news.windingroad.com/videos/b...ac-gto-failed/

[disc0monkey]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

Uh? Pontiac still does that...they sell TONS of G6/Grand Prix, etc. The GTO didn't "fail". It was never MEANT to be a high volume car. You're only right in your own mind..nothing else.

yeah this is statement is a prize. lutz gave multiple reasons of why the GTO failed. yet YOU still can't accept it. tisk tisk

and your starting to sound like micheal jackson from "the jeffersons" south park episode

[disc0monkey]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

It's too bad the old ****s didn't embrace the car because, oh god forbid, it doesn't look exactly like a old one. Well neither does the Corvette. Plenty of people who drove one knew it lived up to everythign the old one did and more. This car actually can handle.

few things need to be said. Lutz himself said the "old ****s" as you called them were not supposed to be buying the car, i believe it was the young BMW 3-series/infinity crowd


if your bragging about the GTO's handling, your ignorant

[red70goat]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

It's too bad the old ****s didn't embrace the car because, oh god forbid, it doesn't look exactly like a old one.

Mr_Gee_I_Don't_Know still doesn't get it. Those of us who didn't embrace the car didn't care so much that it didn't look like the orginal GTO but rather GMs half assed attempt to revive what looks likes every other car out there....then they tried to screw the public by trying to cash in on the name by overpricing it.. Beavis and Lutzhead Logic 101.

[Stuckinda60s]

Still waiting for some kind of statement which actually refutes my FACTS. If they're not posted I guess I can assume they're right?

Chirp, chirp, chirp.............................

Rich

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by Stuckinda60s

Still waiting for some kind of statement which actually refutes my FACTS. If they're not posted I guess I can assume they're right?

Chirp, chirp, chirp.............................

Rich

Rich, you didn't post facts, sorry. Lutz did say it was overprice, but even it had been at $20K, they STILL would have only been able to sell 18K per year MAX due to two things. The UAW and the plant capacity.

[Stuckinda60s]

And the initial plans to build it in the States after the initial 3-year Australian run? No one plans a failure.

Rich

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by Stuckinda60s

And the initial plans to build it in the States after the initial 3-year Australian run? No one plans a failure.

Rich

Did you follow what GM when through in 2004-2005? Lots of things were not set in stone. In fact things even from 2006 to now have changed. There will be another GTO built along side the Camaro eventually. And who cares where it is built? Not me. Holden=GM
Pontiac=GM

[dancolkate]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

There will be another GTO built along side the Camaro eventually.

Is this a fact, or something seen in your crystal ball? If it's a fact, approximately when is "eventually"?

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by dancolkate

Is this a fact, or something seen in your crystal ball? If it's a fact, approximately when is "eventually"?

Well Lutz said another GTO is in the works.

[jeffhhs76]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

Did you follow what GM when through in 2004-2005? Lots of things were not set in stone. In fact things even from 2006 to now have changed. There will be another GTO built along side the Camaro eventually. And who cares where it is built? Not me. Holden=GM
Pontiac=GM

A GTO built on the same platform as the Camaro????? I don't think so.. However it does offer a seamless introduction of the new 69' Firebird!! This is far more likely to happen than a GTO built on the Camaro chassis. Personally I don't think you'll see another GTO. I thought it was wrong to bring back the name on a car that physically had no ties to any of the 64-74 GTO's and worse yet, resembled a damn Camry!!!!! What happened to creativity at GM???? Why didn't they call the 04' GTO something like the GT-38 or G7 Sprint?? Probably would have sold out of these puppies in 4 months!!!! Every time I think of GM lately I just shake my head. They've completely lost it!!! The original concept of the new Camaro was unreal!!! It was a ringer!! Like the new Challenger to the old Challenger, so was the new Camaro. Then some pinhead says "Looks too much like the 69' Camaro, we need to change it up"!!!!! And it morphed into what we see today at the Auto shows. Not a bad looking car but WTF???? They had a golden opportunity to hit it out of the park and ended up stroking a double....Lutz is WAY overrated as a "car" guy.

[HUMBLER]

I really think a G8 coup as a GTO will be here in 2009 as a 2010, we'll see. We've already seen a shortened mule to that effect.

[jeffhhs76]

Originally Posted by HUMBLER

I really think a G8 coup as a GTO will be here in 2009 as a 2010, we'll see. We've already seen a shortened mule to that effect.

They should NOT do that....Leave the G8 as a G8...do NOT offer a GTO option on the G8.. Unless they can do it the right way they should let the name RIP..

[HUMBLER]

Seeing as we are saying the same thing, I agree... I never said anything about it being an option, it would be all GTO and only GTO.

[rolling money pits]

wow! lots o luv here between the two camps.

i didnt read/listen to the original post, this only my opinion, and that opinion is based on this "." amount of knowledge when it comes to the economics of bringing a car to market.

gm missed the boat for the same reason ford, albeit in the opposite direction, scored a bullseye with the new mustang.

as a person with the means and desire, to buy the 04 gto, i couldnt do it because of how it looked. it mattered not what continent it came from. pontiac's gto is an american automotive icon, just like a rustang. the 04 gto, from the right angle, looked like a dodge neon from the front fender forward. no scoops, fucntional or otherwise, and no duals. shame on GM for that.

everything old was becoming new again, the mustang showed that, when it came to car buying. however, that fad/trend will pass in time.

where i wander off, on this saga, is why GM chose the monaro platform. caddilac had/has a RWD, V8 platform, that could have been used. IMO. it could have been reskinned in a more GTO-esque style.

had that happened, there might have been a groundswell of folks crying, "boo hoo, its a caddy!" nonsense. ford did that with the stinkin' lincoln LS and the jag S-type. identical drivetrains, but vastly different skins. i dont look at an LS and think jaguar.

earlier in this thread the corvette was mentioned in comparison. thats not accurate. the vette, also an icon, is in a different category. the GTO nameplate was on hiatus for 20+ years, the vette, save for the 1983 model year, has been an ongoing evolution since 1953.

i hope GM brings the GTO back, at some point, and i hope theyve learned their lesson by that point. it'll probably never be the "mass seller" the mustang, however, that being said, if it looks right, and its priced in the ballpark, it has the potential to be quite a seller for them.

[red70goat]

Originally Posted by jeffhhs76

They should NOT do that....Leave the G8 as a G8...do NOT offer a GTO option on the G8.. Unless they can do it the right way they should let the name RIP..

Per one of my original posts in 2004: Due to Beavis and Lutzhead f**k**g up what could have been a legitimate modern era GTO, the GTO will no longer be a entity of it's own but rather a performance option on the G6 or G8.

[gto4door]

Originally Posted by jeffhhs76

Unless they can do it the right way they should let the name RIP..

You are talking about a car company that brought the Grand Am name back twice with the last time selling a boat load to rental car companies. And let us not forget what they did to the Lemans name plate in early 90's (see attached pic.........ughh!).

[lrosen]

The fact that they called this car a GTO wasn't a factor at all while looking for a brand new muscle car. I was looking for a V8 manual sporty car (actually I wanted something like a G6 GTP w/manual but they didn't exist). I don't like the 'stangs at all and didn't even consider one. That left only TWO other cars on the market at the time for ~$30K. A used C5 would have worked, but only two seats. One seven minute test drive in the GTO and I didn't care, I had to have it. I beats the pants off any Mustang Iv'e sat in.

Plus it's nice not seeing another goat go by every 13 seconds.