[Doug1]

Dumb move on my part... I put my motor back together and set it on the break in stand. It is all hooked up and I realized that I forgot to put a new dipstick tube in the block before I put the pan on it.

I know the hole is tapered to accept the tube only from the inside so I know this is a long shot but has anyone here ever come up with a way of attaching a tube to the block without pulling the pan back off?

Worst case scenario is that I will temporarily plug the hole, break in the engine and then put it back on an engine stand and flip it back over and pull the pan back off.
Though I am not even sure of the best route to plug the hole temporarily. Any ideas there would also be appreciated.

[wts69bird]

you need to take the pan off regardless, you are also missing the lower tube.

[steve25]

besides the block tube, their are 2 differnet lower tube set ups( early and late) on one the tube is captured by the windage tray, the latter one is bolted down to a main cap.

[Ollie]

Originally Posted by steve25

besides the block tube, their are 2 differnet lower tube set ups( early and late) on one the tube is captured by the windage tray, the latter one is bolted down to a main cap.

You are correct in that there are two different tubs. How ever there is not an early and a late set up. The tube that bolts to the main cap is for engins without a windage tray. The tube with out the bolt tab is held in place by the windage tray.

[johnsma22]

I posted this info in another thread, but I'll post it here again for your viewing pleasure. Hey Mods, I still think this post needs to made a sticky. I researched this out and it has helped many people understand the crazy Pontiac dipstick deal that continues to plague people.

There are two lower tubes. One for use with a windage tray. It wedges into the opening in the block and a hole in the windage tray. The other is for motors without windage trays. It also wedges into the opening in the block, but bolts to a main cap. Then there is the main dip stick tube. It must be installed from the inside out, then the lower tube is inserted into it. Finally, if you have A/C, there will be an extension tube that inserts into the main tube and mounts to the A/C compressor bracket. There are only two different dip sticks. One for A/C cars, the other for non-A/C cars.

Here you go. These are available from our host here at PY.



Item: GME157 Description: 67-79 DIP STICK TUBE
PRESS FIT FROM INSIDE BLOCK. PROTRUDES OUT. USE GME157C FOR EXTENSION. FITS ALL 67-79 PONTIAC V8'S
__________________________________________________



Item: GME157A Description: 69-79 TUBE- DIPSTICK (BOTTOM)
USED ON MOTORS W/O WINDAGE TRAY. GOES INSIDE THE OIL PAN. Technically only for 1972-1979 but will work on 1965-1968. For correct 1965-68 use GME157R
__________________________________________________



Item: GME157B Description: 67-79 TUBE- BOTTOM W/O BRKT
USED ON MOTORS WITH WINDAGE TRAYS. presses into the inside of the block and runs through the windage tray. This part is now an excellent stainless steel repro at a better price.
__________________________________________________



Item: GME157C Description: TUBE-DIP STICK UPPER W/AC
This upper tube requires sanding and a little grinding to fit in GME157. Fits 1970 AND LATER V8 EXCEPT RAM AIR OR 455 HO, MIGHT WORK ON 68, 69 ?? HAS BRACKET THAT ATTACHES TO FRONT COMPRESSOR.
_________________________________________________



Item: GME158 Description: 67-78 DIP STICK- W/AC
WILL WORK ON ALL PONTIAC V8 BUT NOT CORRECT FOR EARLIER CARS
_________________________________________________

Item: GME159 Description: 67-78 DIP STICK W/O AC
WILL WORK ON ALL PONTIAC V-8 BUT NOT CORRECT FOR EARLIER CARS

[Fat Cat]

Nice dipstick info John, I was looking into this a little with my motor and beginning to wonder if I should ask people about it....now I don't!

[vidguy]

I vote to--- MAKE THAT POST STICKY too..

[Sirrotica]

Not that it makes any difference, but there's just one minor fact that is incorrect in this dipstick post. The oil capacity on 67 V8 Pontiacs was 6 quarts W/O filter, not 5 W/O filter, as the year before (66) and the year following (68). The only reason I know this is, I worked at a Pontiac dealer in 69 on the lube rack and 67 was the only year V8 that took more oil. I did verify it too as I was fairly certain, but you never know if you remember correctly from 39 years ago. Being that the pan and everything else in the lower part of the engine is identical the dipstick gauging on 67 only has to be marked 1 Qt. different than any other sticks. If I had access to a GM parts book I could verify that the 67 sticks had a different part #. Anyone have access to a Pontiac parts book that can verify this? It probably will never affect anything but I just wanted to keep the record straight.

[bnorris_74]

Just thinking out loud here, but... the dipstick and tube wouldn't necessarily need to be different between a 6 qt and 5 qt oil pan. I would imagine that the 6qt had a deeper sump and the full and add levels should be the same as a 5 qt. (at least in my of way of reasoning).

[Sirrotica]

The pan is the same, as stated I the first post. I know this is correct as I have worked on many of these year of engines. For some reason the engineers decided they wanted an extra quart in 67 engines and I am fairly certain they just moved the marks on the 67 stick. I just wanted to verify that theory is all, and keep the facts straight. Few people know of that one year difference in crankcase capacity.

[bnorris_74]

Sorry, I started thinking before I finished reading your post.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by bnorris_74

Sorry, I started thinking before I finished reading your post.

No Problem..........

[screamingchief]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news,but I've never found a good way to replace the block tube from the top side...

Matter of fact,IIRC one of the main caps has to come off to get the new tube to slip into place from the bottom side as well.



Best way to temporarily plug the hole?

I would use some of "the right stuff" and let it cure overnight,should stay put long enough to break the engine in.

[1967Clone]

OK, I was looking to put my non windage tray lower dipstick in my block today, and what's this, no threaded holes on the main cap. I look, and it is on the 2 caps adjacent, but not on the one where the lower tube bracket bolts too.
At first, I thought the mains were mixed up, but they are number sequentially, correct?

This is not only my first Pontiac build, it's also my first engine build period, so be gentle.

[johnta1]

The caps were made for the windage tray, which held the tube.

The non-tray block used the middle cap to hold the tube.

Without the tray, you'll have to make a bracket to bolt it to one of the other caps.

[1967Clone]

Originally Posted by johnta1

The caps were made for the windage tray, which held the tube.

The non-tray block used the middle cap to hold the tube.

Without the tray, you'll have to make a bracket to bolt it to one of the other caps.

Thanks, I knew it wouldn't be as easy as swapping caps. Any tips on how to make this bracket, and which cap to go to?

[Doug1]

I would order the right part. Just call our host here or Pontiac Dude or one of the other vendors and get a lower tube for a non windage tray setup. It has the bracket that bolts to the cap. I wouldn't make my own being that it is down in the bottom of the motor and can wreak havoc if it falls apart. It is one of those inexpensive parts that you don't won't to skimp on.

[MandevilleBird]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

The pan is the same, as stated I the first post. I know this is correct as I have worked on many of these year of engines. For some reason the engineers decided they wanted an extra quart in 67 engines and I am fairly certain they just moved the marks on the 67 stick. I just wanted to verify that theory is all, and keep the facts straight. Few people know of that one year difference in crankcase capacity.

So, the '67 block I just rebuilt should take 7 qt.s, including the filter? ...and the pan is the same as my '68 block? So, that would imply that it is ok to run these engines with an extra qt of oil.

Am I incorrect?...

[johnta1]

Doug1 the non-tray tube uses the 3rd main cap, which his isn't drilled.

[gtofreek]

Originally Posted by Doug1

I would order the right part. Just call our host here or Pontiac Dude or one of the other vendors and get a lower tube for a non windage tray setup. It has the bracket that bolts to the cap. I wouldn't make my own being that it is down in the bottom of the motor and can wreak havoc if it falls apart. It is one of those inexpensive parts that you don't won't to skimp on.

As he stated, he has the correct tube with bracket, the problem is he has an early engine that takes a windage tray. These engines did not have threaded holes in the #3 main cap. Only #2 & #4 were threaded. He will either have to grind a flat and tap the #3 cap for the bracket or he has to put a windage tray on it. One or the other.

Also, the person who stated that early engines had windage trays and later did not, was correct. From around 72 or 73 Pontiac quit using windage trays and went to the bracket that bolts to the #3 main cap. Only these later engines have the #3 main cap threaded. The earlier engines did not. So, I would call them early and late engines also.

1967Clone, DO NOT switch main caps. They cannot be moved around. They need to stay in the same position they were align bored/honed in. Switching them around will result in main bearing failure if the crank even turns at all. If you need a windage tray, I have many to choose from.

I was always under the impression that all older Pontiacs[all but the 265 and 301] held 6 quarts of oil. 5 for the pan and 1 for the filter. This was going off of my 1967 LeMans 326 though which was the only Pontiac I had with the original engine in it. Just assumed they were all that way since they all took the same oil pan.