[KCTurbo]

Had an interesting conversation over what my next handgun purchase will be the other day. The person that I was talking to is a recently retired Missouri Highway Patrol officer. He made some very good points that I did not think to consider. One of the questions was when do you think you would need it the most. He made the statement that if something was going to happen or if you came across a situation when you would need it, what would be around. If you encountered a situation where an officer was involved in a shooting or something like that, what would you do? He went on to say that 90 to 95% of officers in our state carry either a Glock 22 or Glock 23 in .40 S&W, so that would be a smart option. That way if things were bad, like an officer down situation, there would be available magazines and extra ammunition available. Just some of the things that I never considered and made a lot of sense to me. What do you guys think?

[69goatboy]

I just bought my first handgun a couple of weeks ago. A Springfield XD in .45 ACP caliber.
Awesome weapon, but finding .45 ammo local is like looking for hens teeth. I trip over boxes and boxes of 9mm and .40 at Walmart, Meijers, etc. before finding the empty shelf where the .45's are kept. The JHP's are plentiful, but expensive for target shooting. Many of the online stores are out of stock on the .45's too.

I almost wish I would have gotten the .40 for this reason, but the .45 does make a nice big bang.

[Stu Norman]

You might try this place for ammo.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/

My wife purchased a Sig Sauer P229 in .40 S&W when I went to Afghanistan, then decided she likes shooting. For a personal weapon, I am looking at a Taurus Judge, It is a 5 shot revolver that shoots .45 Long Colt or .410 shotgun shells. I figure the first 2 in shots should be buckshot, which will scare the bejeebers out of anyone (especially at night). If not, the last 3 shots will be .45 to stop them. Only problem with this is I can't fire it at my local range, no shotgun shells and .44 Mag is the largest caliber allowed. Still considering that purchase.

I spoke with a few LEOs who steered us away from 9mm guns with discussions of multiple shots to stop someone and inability to penetrate windshields with any reliability.

[Cobrabill]

.45-the 40 is one of those calibers that i don't know why it exists.THe fact that a lot of departments carry it has nothing to do with logic,but has more to do with politics and the fact that it "normally" is a simpler weapon with less kick.

Same reason a lot of departments switched to the 9MM but later found out that it was a huge mistake.

Stu-mu niece picked up a Judge for $200 and then asked her husband:"Did i get a good deal"?

[Stu Norman]

$200? Dang...I need to keep my eyes open for a deal like that.

[mike nixon]

Originally Posted by Stu Norman

You might try this place for ammo.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/



I spoke with a few LEOs who steered us away from 9mm guns with discussions of multiple shots to stop someone and inability to penetrate windshields with any reliability.

Exactly why I carry a .357 mag. Ammo is kinda tough to find right now tho.I got lucky and bought 350 rounds off of a gun shop looking to move them to make space for more comon inventory.

BTW, A 40cal will be my next handgun purchase.

Mike

[bigunde]

Got my wife this for "home protection" with the 6" barrel in stainless:



http://www.chuckhawks.com/taurus_judge.htm

[KCTurbo]

I also have been looking at the Judge, and already have a .357 GP100. I was looking more at the autos for the next purchase. This would be a carry weapon so the logic in my first post really made sense to me. I understand what everyone has posted about calibers and what not. For most engagements the .40 S&W is a good choice, easy to handle and provides with a quick follow up and in a given situation like above would seem to be a logical choice. After 8 years in the Army and the last 4 in SOCOM, I don't have much problem with handling most any caliber.

[Jim Scites]

Originally Posted by Cobrabill

.45-the 40 is one of those calibers that i don't know why it exists.THe fact that a lot of departments carry it has nothing to do with logic,but has more to do with politics and the fact that it "normally" is a simpler weapon with less kick.

Same reason a lot of departments switched to the 9MM but later found out that it was a huge mistake.

I remember reading a story in one of the gun magazines about the origins of the .40. The FBI started using the 9mm which turned out to be a disaster, some agents for killed in Fla. They did some tests using the 10MM 9MM 45 ACP and .38 Special. After the tests they determined that the 10MM was only slightly better than the .45 ACP. So they took the .45 and 10MM and had another round of tests and the 10MM came out slightly better than the .45 again. They then determined that the 10MM had too much recoil and too much muzzle flash so they shortened the round and came up with the .40 Smith. The first loading for the .40 was an 185gr Silvertip that had the same ballistics as the .45 180gr Silvertip.
So the .40, to me is just a bunch of politics to end the .45 vs 9MM controversy.

[69goatboy]

Originally Posted by Stu Norman

You might try this place for ammo.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/

I've found better prices at Natchez.

http://www.natchezss.com/

[Cobrabill]

Originally Posted by Jim Scites

I remember reading a story in one of the gun magazines about the origins of the .40. The FBI started using the 9mm which turned out to be a disaster, some agents for killed in Fla. They did some tests using the 10MM 9MM 45 ACP and .38 Special. After the tests they determined that the 10MM was only slightly better than the .45 ACP. So they took the .45 and 10MM and had another round of tests and the 10MM came out slightly better than the .45 again. They then determined that the 10MM had too much recoil and too much muzzle flash so they shortened the round and came up with the .40 Smith. The first loading for the .40 was an 185gr Silvertip that had the same ballistics as the .45 180gr Silvertip.
So the .40, to me is just a bunch of politics to end the .45 vs 9MM controversy.

Jim-thanks.That was so long ago, i had forgotten the details.Muzzle flash?,they have a valid point.But as far as being easier to handle,the .40 was a compromise so they could have a handgun that females could handle and still have reasonable stopping power.

Bottom line?The .45 ACP was KING,is KING and always will be KING.

[JLHarper]

Originally Posted by KCTurbo

Had an interesting conversation over what my next handgun purchase will be the other day. The person that I was talking to is a recently retired Missouri Highway Patrol officer. He made some very good points that I did not think to consider. One of the questions was when do you think you would need it the most. He made the statement that if something was going to happen or if you came across a situation when you would need it, what would be around. If you encountered a situation where an officer was involved in a shooting or something like that, what would you do? He went on to say that 90 to 95% of officers in our state carry either a Glock 22 or Glock 23 in .40 S&W, so that would be a smart option. That way if things were bad, like an officer down situation, there would be available magazines and extra ammunition available. Just some of the things that I never considered and made a lot of sense to me. What do you guys think?

I think there must be a contest to sell GLOCKS. I cant beleive he told you that.

Seriously, I would question how many passerbys ever have to come to the aid of a LEO?
It does happen but the numbers HAVE TO be small in the course of a day across America.

I take it he meant coming to the aid of a downed officer?

I would buy what you feel comfortable with, and like to shoot. Dont be swayed by these hypotheticals.....there are many.

Jeff

[KCTurbo]

I took it more like this, and yes he was refering to aiding a LEO if needed. When the stuff hits the fan what is going to be around and availible for use. Also stated above it is also easier for a female to use, I.E. my wife. I wasn't looking to start a debate about what is better or what is best, just a point of view that I had not considered. Take it FWIW....

[T A 70]

Ahh, the debate over ammo never seems to end LOL...I love the 9mm at the range...really easy to stay on target. Personally, my carry weapon is a 40, although on a hike in the woods I'll carry a 45.
The funny thing about 9mm is the local LEO departments were frustrated that perp's who were hit weren't dead or dying; just a nice clean hole put through whatever member was hit lol.
Anyway, the snap of a 40 is more comfortable for me rather than the "push" of a 45..better to be more accurate with a more comfortable weapon IMO. As for the debate over 9mm and having to shoot multiple rounds to put someone down, who's gonna fire just one round anyway?

[David Jones]

.45ACP is too damn big. Great stopping power, no doubt. KING? Based on size alone maybe. I'm sure there are more powerful handgun rounds than 45ACP out there for those that think only the most powerful round will do the job. Desert Eagle VII in 44mag? Why settle for a measly 45?

[T A 70]

Howz about this 454?

[69goatboy]

Originally Posted by David Jones

.45ACP is too damn big. Great stopping power, no doubt. KING? Based on size alone maybe. I'm sure there are more powerful handgun rounds than 45ACP out there for those that think only the most powerful round will do the job. Desert Eagle VII in 44mag? Why settle for a measly 45?

Ironically, I think my XD45 has more 'kick' than my friends' DE-44 mag. I guess all of that mass of metal that the DE has vs the polymer frame of the XD helps a bit.

[Region Warrior]

50AE.
Little big for conseal carry though.

[Stu Norman]

Originally Posted by T A 70

Howz about this 454?

Did you find that in the dictionary under "RECOIL"?

[uforacing]

I load for all my guns. I would not be able to afford my 38 super habit if I had to buy ammo.