#1  
Old 10-20-2015, 10:13 AM
DeanRM DeanRM is offline
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Default Honeycomb Wheel Wobble

After 20 years, I am putting my original Honeycomb wheels for my '73 Trans Am back on. I just finished painting them, put tires on, and when I got them balanced, I noticed that one of the wheels seemed to wobble on the balancer. It looks like the polycast rubber maybe the issue, as it seems like it oozed thru the gaps in the steel wheel and is not allowing the wheel to sit flat against the hub on the balancer.

Does anyone else experience this, and is it an issue when mounted on the car?

What is the solution, remove the excess polycast?

Thanks!

  #2  
Old 10-20-2015, 10:55 AM
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http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...comb+balancing

Need a balancer with the lug adapters it appears unless centers are in spec.

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Old 10-20-2015, 11:05 AM
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X2

You cannot balance a honeycomb via the center hole since it is only a free standing metal cone that is set in the injected urethane in the general area of the wheel's center. The people balancing the wheel have to use a five lug adapter to mount to the balancing machine via the lug nut holes. Otherwise you are wasting your money.

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Old 10-20-2015, 01:00 PM
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Thanks guys! I will try to find a shop that has the 5-Lug adapter for their balancer.

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Old 10-21-2015, 12:00 AM
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I cone them from the back via the center hole with great results.

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Old 10-21-2015, 06:16 AM
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I remember doing my brother's 73 TA with a cone from the back side about 25 years ago with no problems.

I don't remember what machine brand we used, but maybe we were lucky.

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Old 10-21-2015, 11:43 AM
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If you cone them from the back, is a cone also used thru the front side where the center cap goes? If that is the case, and the center cap hole is not concentric with the wheel, won't the wheel wobble on the balancer giving poor results? Thanks!

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Old 10-22-2015, 07:00 PM
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The lug centric tool I posted in one of my pics is the correct method aside from on car spin balancing we used to do at the Pontiac dealership. The center can be non concentric. Keep in mind your car only uses the lug studs for rotation, balancing them that way is natural to hour cars design. Lug centric can be used on any wheel..

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Old 10-22-2015, 07:25 PM
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A big problem with honeys is back in the day the popular tire machine was the Coats 20/20 machine and if you weren't careful the machine would make the outer hole where the center cap goes egg shape. Then the outer cone was out of the question AND you couldn't put the center cap back on...the wheel is pretty much junk after that.

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Old 10-22-2015, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankieT/A View Post
A big problem with honeys is back in the day the popular tire machine was the Coats 20/20 machine and if you weren't careful the machine would make the outer hole where the center cap goes egg shape. Then the outer cone was out of the question AND you couldn't put the center cap back on...the wheel is pretty much junk after that.
The hole where the center cap goes on a couple of my wheels were egg shaped, just as you suggested. I was able to use an exhaust pipe expander and get them pretty round again, good enough that the center caps now fit fine.

Interesting history to learn how those centers became egg shaped! Thanks!

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Old 10-22-2015, 10:18 PM
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Balancing. This tool has curves "slots" which allow it to go to almost any stud diameter and number of studs. The Honeycomb Wheel sits on the studs for balancing
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Lug Centric.jpg
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Old 10-23-2015, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepi View Post
I remember doing my brother's 73 TA with a cone from the back side about 25 years ago with no problems.

I don't remember what machine brand we used, but maybe we were lucky.
I assume you mean one of the old bubble type balancers where you placed the wheel flat (face up) on the mounting cone and then placed the weights in the desired position(s) to get the bubble level? That is called static balancing (versus dynamic on a machine) and is easily done on a honeycomb regardless of the front side's off center position.

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Old 10-23-2015, 12:38 PM
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If I'm understanding the Lugcentric balancer correctly, the back of the wheel is supported by a cone on the balancer, the threaded shaft goes thru the center cap hole, but does not touch it, and the Lugcentric tool, attached to the threaded shaft, applies the pressure back holding the wheel against the cone in the back of the wheel, while also supporting the wheel concentric via the 5-lug holes?

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Old 10-23-2015, 01:28 PM
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Sort of. The five, mini-cones only engage with the five lug holes. That's all that is engaging with the wheel. Depending on the machine a center pilot may be used to retain the wheel to the five pilot adapter.

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Old 10-23-2015, 01:50 PM
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On formulabruces photo, shouldn't the adaptor plate be on mounted on the backside of the wheel tight against the back face of the wheel?

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Old 10-23-2015, 03:50 PM
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No. There are different types of lug-centric adapters. Some of the more modern units work as you mentioned, from behind the wheel, but some of the adapters for older machines are operated as in the photo.

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Old 10-23-2015, 04:09 PM
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Sounds good. I will have to find a shop that can do lug-centric balancing, sounds like the best solution for the honeycomb wheels. Thanks for all your help guy's, I never knew about lug-centric balancing until I asked here!

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Old 10-23-2015, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by njsteve View Post
I assume you mean one of the old bubble type balancers where you placed the wheel flat (face up) on the mounting cone and then placed the weights in the desired position(s) to get the bubble level? That is called static balancing (versus dynamic on a machine) and is easily done on a honeycomb regardless of the front side's off center position.
No, it wasn't a bubble type, it was a spin balancer. We had different size cones the fit the center hole, then the rim would go on, then a cup that was attached to the big "wing-nut" that held the tire in place.

We had maybe 5 different size cones, and sometimes I know we doubled up cones and or would take the cup off the retaining nut.

His were the only honeycombs I ever did, but never had him complain about the balance. Maybe his centers were good and I just lucked out.

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  #19  
Old 10-26-2015, 11:02 AM
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Tires Plus has an adjustable lug-centric plate, so I think that I am going to take my wheels there to get balanced. Thanks!

  #20  
Old 10-27-2015, 12:14 PM
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I got my wheels rebalanced using the lug-centric method. They put the wheels on the balancer with the weights from the previous hub-centric balancing, and one was pretty close, two were quite a bit off, and one was way off! It seemed like the lug-centric method used less weight to balance, which makes sense as the wheel should be closer to balance on the balancer if rotated about it's true axis.

I put them on the car and it is a huge improvement! No more shaking at 70 mph!

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