[Jrcarz]

Hi

Looking for 1969 GTO Ram III WS Block with Ram III Heads and Exhaust Manifolds Should Be # 48 on the heads. Date Coded pre December 1969, Don't need the Intake or Carb. Motor does not need to be done/ running.
Also need 1969 M20 Trans.
Trying to stay in the IL area Chicago and suburbs.
Please P.M. me or Call me at 847-401-1332.
Any help is appreciated.
Thanks

[fiedlerh]

I have A139 #48 heads, but that is probably too early for you.

[poncho-mike]

Are you needing a 1969 or a 1970 WS?

A December 1969 cast motor would be used in a 1970 car, and would carry #12 heads. A 1969 GTO would use a December 1968 cast date engine with #48s.

I have a K159 WS 400 4-bolt main bare block.

[Jrcarz]

Hi
Thanks for replying.

My 70 Judge is an early production car produced December 10th of 1969 and delivered December 22nd 1969. I am told # 48's would be for a 1969 and 12's were for a 1970.

[ponyakr]

"...Looking for 1969 GTO Ram III WS Block with Ram III Heads and Exhaust Manifolds Should Be # 48 on the heads. Date Coded pre December 1969..."


"...A December 1969 cast motor would be used in a 1970 car, and would carry #12 heads. A 1969 GTO would use a December 1968 cast date engine with #48s..."


"...My 70 Judge is an early production car produced December 10th of 1969..."


Well, with all this info in mind, looks like you need a WS code casting # 9799914 block and #12 heads, all date coded before Dec 10, 1969.

http://www.wallaceracing.com/enginesearch4.htm

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1970-GTO-TRA...pWaLAZ&vxp=mtr

If you can live with a WS 400 block from another year(since the block won't be original to your car anyhow), you can use one from any year '67 thru '73. The '71-'73 WS #481988 blocks may be cheaper and easier to find, but will have the WS code, for all to see.

An Ebay seller has '68 and '69 WS shortblocks. Don't know about their quality.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-GTO-...-/191763091141

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-1969...dTdRUo&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-1969...1RCCFK&vxp=mtr


"...Trying to stay in the IL area Chicago and suburbs..."


Now THAT might be next to impossible. There are probably very few of these left, in the entire country, let alone in just your local area.

[poncho-mike]

There is a difference between the calendar year and the automotive production year. I believe the 1970 Pontiacs were on the showroom floors and available for sale around the 3rd week of September or so.

The factory started making parts for the 1970 production year sometime during the late spring and early summer of 1969. I'm more into the Firebirds, and I've owned a 71 T/A built in early September 1970 with June 1970 cast dates.

In general, I think you want your engine produced about a 3 - 4 weeks before the car was built.

Mike

[Jrcarz]

Thanks everyone for your help. I agree with everything except the Heads which I am hearing that # 48 should be the correct heads.

[tom s]

If your really looking for a 100% WS block,check the vin.I have one in my garage now.When I ran the vin I got proof it was a restamp as it came out of a 69 GP.Tom

[Jrcarz]

Thanks everyone for the great help and knowledge.

[tom s]

48s are correct for a 69 WS.Tom

[poncho-mike]

It's not clear whether he's working on a 69 or a 70. There is an earlier post where he's asking for a 69 cast date WS for a 70 Judge.

[tom s]

a 69 block will be a 2 bolt main and 70 block will be a 4 bolt main.Big diff in my mind!Tom

[Tellyshavilli]

48s are not correct for a 1970 no way no how

[Matt Meaney]

Originally Posted by Jrcarz

Thanks everyone for your help. I agree with everything except the Heads which I am hearing that # 48 should be the correct heads.

what you are hearing is incorrect. stop listening.

A 1970 model year ram air III 4 speed judge, which was available for purchase from about late September 1969 to about early august 1970, will have #12 heads.

the #48 heads were for the 1969 model year, and are used on both ram air III and NON ram air III, 4 speed equipped cars.

[tom s]

the title on this thread is 69 WS engine wanted!Tom

[Jrcarz]

Sorry for any confusion

My Judge is a 70 4 speed built on December 10th of 1969. I am looking for a 1969 WS block with the correct 1969 Ram Air III heads that would be dated before December 10th of 1969. I hope this helps. Please tell me which heads I would need also 12's or 48's. I am told 48's are the correct heads for a 69 WS motor.
Thanks

[poncho-mike]

Read this from my earlier post:

Originally Posted by poncho-mike

There is a difference between the calendar year and the automotive production year. I believe the 1970 Pontiacs were on the showroom floors and available for sale around the 3rd week of September 1969 or so.

The factory started making parts for the 1970 production year sometime during the late spring and early summer of 1969. I'm more into the Firebirds, and I've owned a 71 T/A built in early September 1970 with June 1970 cast dates.

In general, I think you want your engine produced about a 3 - 4 weeks before the car was built.

Mike

If you have a 1970 Judge built on December 10, 1969, you need a 1970 WS 4-bolt main block with "12" heads dated 3 - 6 weeks before the December 10 1969 build date.

You are mixing the calendar year dates with the production year dates. The 1970 production year started about 5 months before the 1970 calendar year, and parts production started 2 - 3 months before the new car introduction date.

[Matt Meaney]

Originally Posted by Jrcarz

Sorry for any confusion

My Judge is a 70 4 speed built on December 10th of 1969. I am looking for a 1969 WS block with the correct 1969 Ram Air III heads that would be dated before December 10th of 1969. I hope this helps. Please tell me which heads I would need also 12's or 48's. I am told 48's are the correct heads for a 69 WS motor.
Thanks

I think some of the confusion is coming from the difference between the MODEL YEAR and CASTING DATES.

what you are looking for is a 1970 MODEL YEAR WS block and heads (#12's) with a casting date of 1969.

your car was built the second week of Dec. 1969 for the 1970 MODEL YEAR.
the engine will need to be cast (built) about early Nov. 1969 for the 1970 MODEL YEAR. the engine will have the casting numbers that are used for the 1970 MODEL YEAR not 1969 MODEL YEAR.

[Matt Meaney]

Mike looks like you posted when I was typing (slow)

Maybe it's easiest to just say 1970 MODEL YEAR vehicles use 1970 MODEL YEAR casting numbers no matter what the casting date is.

[tom s]

You cant even fake those blocks!Tom