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Jim Hand
12-24-1999, 12:21 PM
Here are two formula from SuperFlow Corp concerning airflow. The first is used to estimate possible peak HP of an engine based only on used airflow. It is not related to displacement nor rpm. Multiply the airflow (as measured at 28") entering the cylinders by the factor of .257. That will be the max possible HP generated by one cylinder. Multiply by the number of cylinders for total possible power. (For same information using flow at 10" pressure, multiply by the factor of .43)

Example: The airflow through the entire intake tract of air cleaner, carb, manifold, and head ports is 220 cfm @ 28". 220 X .257 = 56.54 HP per cylinder. Multiply by eight cylinders, and the engine could develop as much as 452 peak HP. Whether it would depends on intake and exhaust tuning, cam selection, carb operation, correct selection of intake, and so on. I will post some measured values of flow through the entire intake system in a separate post.

At what rpm would the above predicted peak HP occur? It depends primarily on the size/displacement of the engine. SuperFlow provides two formula for this one: Depending on the efficiency of the engine, the rpm changes. Highly developed race engines will peak at lower rpm, whereas our stock type will not use as much air and a given amount will force the rpm higher. For an all out good race engine use this formula:

Peak HP will occur at: A factor of 1196 divided by the displacement of one cylinder: Multiply that result by the cfm airflow entering the cylinder at 28" pressure. (Again, if using 10", use a factor of 2000 rather then 1196). Example: Using the values of above for a highly developed 462 race engine, we have: One cylinder displacement equals 57.75. Dividing 57.75 into the factor of 1196 (for 28" pressure), the result is 20.71. Multiply that result of 20.71 times the airflow @ 28 of 220, and the result is 4556 rpm. This tells us that the nominal peak HP will occur close to 4556.

What if we used the same heads/flow on a 406? The displacement of one cylinder of a 406 is 50.75. Dividing 50.75 into the 1196 factor, we get 23.57, and multiplying that by 220 cfm flow, the answer is 5185 rpm. The same amount of airflow that finds it’s way into the cylinders will raise the peak HP rpm by over 600 rpm!

For a less developed engine more like our street engines, the formula changes to these values: Divide the displacement of one cylinder into a factor of 1316. Using the same flow of 220@28" and a 462, the result is: 1316 divided by 57.75 = 22.79. Multiply 22.79 by the 220 cfm flow equals 5015 rpm. In other words, our less developed engines (less VE) will peak at a higher rpm with the same flow!

The 405 shows the same - 1316 divided by 50.75 (one cylinder ci) equals 25.93, and that value times the 220 cfm flow equals 5704 rpm!

This formula clearly shows the differences in operation of different displacement engines.

What about using heads that flow 300 cfm of air through the ports. A highly efficient intake system can allow as much as 98 percent of the head flow capability through the entire system and into the cylinder, so we can use an airflow value of 300X.98= 294 cfm actually entering the cylinder. Using the formula for a top notch 462 race engine, we find that the engine will peak HP at this value: 1196 divided by 57.75 = 21.71, and multiplying that value by 294, we find the race engine will peak in the area of 6380 rpm. In order to use the peak HP effectively, the engine should be shifted at some higher rpm.

Again, these values will be affected by cam selection, and other aspects of engines efficiency, but by using these formula to compare the effects of flow values on identical size and developed engines, we begin to get an idea of what is needed in the area of flow values, or what kind or rpm is required to use given amounts of airflow. Jim

Jim Hand
12-24-1999, 12:21 PM
Here are two formula from SuperFlow Corp concerning airflow. The first is used to estimate possible peak HP of an engine based only on used airflow. It is not related to displacement nor rpm. Multiply the airflow (as measured at 28") entering the cylinders by the factor of .257. That will be the max possible HP generated by one cylinder. Multiply by the number of cylinders for total possible power. (For same information using flow at 10" pressure, multiply by the factor of .43)

Example: The airflow through the entire intake tract of air cleaner, carb, manifold, and head ports is 220 cfm @ 28". 220 X .257 = 56.54 HP per cylinder. Multiply by eight cylinders, and the engine could develop as much as 452 peak HP. Whether it would depends on intake and exhaust tuning, cam selection, carb operation, correct selection of intake, and so on. I will post some measured values of flow through the entire intake system in a separate post.

At what rpm would the above predicted peak HP occur? It depends primarily on the size/displacement of the engine. SuperFlow provides two formula for this one: Depending on the efficiency of the engine, the rpm changes. Highly developed race engines will peak at lower rpm, whereas our stock type will not use as much air and a given amount will force the rpm higher. For an all out good race engine use this formula:

Peak HP will occur at: A factor of 1196 divided by the displacement of one cylinder: Multiply that result by the cfm airflow entering the cylinder at 28" pressure. (Again, if using 10", use a factor of 2000 rather then 1196). Example: Using the values of above for a highly developed 462 race engine, we have: One cylinder displacement equals 57.75. Dividing 57.75 into the factor of 1196 (for 28" pressure), the result is 20.71. Multiply that result of 20.71 times the airflow @ 28 of 220, and the result is 4556 rpm. This tells us that the nominal peak HP will occur close to 4556.

What if we used the same heads/flow on a 406? The displacement of one cylinder of a 406 is 50.75. Dividing 50.75 into the 1196 factor, we get 23.57, and multiplying that by 220 cfm flow, the answer is 5185 rpm. The same amount of airflow that finds it’s way into the cylinders will raise the peak HP rpm by over 600 rpm!

For a less developed engine more like our street engines, the formula changes to these values: Divide the displacement of one cylinder into a factor of 1316. Using the same flow of 220@28" and a 462, the result is: 1316 divided by 57.75 = 22.79. Multiply 22.79 by the 220 cfm flow equals 5015 rpm. In other words, our less developed engines (less VE) will peak at a higher rpm with the same flow!

The 405 shows the same - 1316 divided by 50.75 (one cylinder ci) equals 25.93, and that value times the 220 cfm flow equals 5704 rpm!

This formula clearly shows the differences in operation of different displacement engines.

What about using heads that flow 300 cfm of air through the ports. A highly efficient intake system can allow as much as 98 percent of the head flow capability through the entire system and into the cylinder, so we can use an airflow value of 300X.98= 294 cfm actually entering the cylinder. Using the formula for a top notch 462 race engine, we find that the engine will peak HP at this value: 1196 divided by 57.75 = 21.71, and multiplying that value by 294, we find the race engine will peak in the area of 6380 rpm. In order to use the peak HP effectively, the engine should be shifted at some higher rpm.

Again, these values will be affected by cam selection, and other aspects of engines efficiency, but by using these formula to compare the effects of flow values on identical size and developed engines, we begin to get an idea of what is needed in the area of flow values, or what kind or rpm is required to use given amounts of airflow. Jim

77TA
12-25-1999, 09:48 PM
Wow !
Good information
I was wondering if anyone could explain how the new 5.3 liter Corporate motors can produce 340 NET ! that would be about 400 gross right. They are so smooth and nice mannered. It seems like they do not play by the same rules as I read this Post.

KEV
12-26-1999, 11:42 AM
** NOTE: Jim i posted this here as well as under another thread. One thing i dont like about the new boards is that you cant reply to a reply if you know what i mean. you are really only replying to the main thread and unless you watch the number count next to the thread its hard to know if someone commented on your reply. at any rate this is under the thread i started about flow #s for 670s.

hey Jim! first thanks for the formula on flow and thanks for the examples. Your
examples hit home as im going to build a 406 here shortly.

i think im getting this but i have a few more questions...

the way i calc it (and you did as well) to make 450 HP i need about 219 ish flow at
28". that gives me a peak HP @ 5185 shift @ 10% above that gives me approx
5700 rpm. i understand all that. what i dont understand is why porting would not
help or show a benefit at the same RPM?

here is my goal, a 450 hp motor on pump gas running a '66 Tripower. i posted on
the old board as to the flow coeff of a '66 Trips and did not get any info. i have
heard it is not that great an intake. im guessing high 80s???

here is what i dont understand. im going to make the assumption that i am not
running at 100% VE and i am not fully filling the cylinder. if my heads are flowing
212 (stock) and my tripower intake is only flowing 89% then my total flow would
only be 188 (which would calc out to max HP of 386 HP). now if i port the head to
240 and i run 89% im now flowing 213. so by porting the heads i compensate the
poor flow of the intake. the unfortunate part is that im still shy of my 220 mark i
need. how do i know if i am totally filling the cylinder and need more flow with a
test such as yours?

now lets say i use the 220 flow and an intake that flows 92% (think that is what
your other post stated) that give me 202 flow. now im looking at the issue of PHR
that has your car in it. im using 3900 lbs (think im a little low on your weight but
will suffice for what im trying to explain) and the 11.880 1/4 time and 112.34 mph.
i calc you at 462 HP. 462 HP should need 462/.257/8 = 224 cfm (im assuming that
this is a TOTAL flow calculation not just head flow) that is a 22 cfm diff which is
about an 11% diff from what the formula "says" you need and what you are
actually running with intake attached. this may even be less with the carb and air
cleaner on. why the large difference???

i re-read my Pete McCarthy book where he posts some flow #s for a set of 96
heads. they were measured at 10" and were 120 @ .500 if i conver that i get 200
cfm. im confused by the fact that this car was running in the 120 MPH range.
Another set of 96 heads measured at 10" 131 cfm at .500. converted gives me
218. these heads were on a car running 10.38 at 128 mph. i dont know the weight
of the car but the flow #s dont seem to add up. i would have expected these
numbers to be much higher. hmmmmmm.... maybe that is the point your trying to
get me to understand.

just trying to get a better understanding. i already have a set of 670 that are
supposed to flow in the low 220 range, maybe i dont need much port work???

thanks again for your help!
(sorr so long)

------------------
Kevin Swaney
Gold '66 GTO, 389 4 spd with Trips
13.042 @ 106.64 mph

Jim Moshier
12-26-1999, 08:42 PM
What is the prefered method of an intake alignment? I never really thought about it, I just thought that the intake bolts would align the intake and then you would tighten up the water pump/intake bolt! Should the water pump/intake be done first?
Jim

KEV
12-26-1999, 09:26 PM
Hey Jim M! most racers will cut the water passage off the intake for two reasons. one is to eliminate the water issues when swaping intakes. the other is to help with alignment. i just got some info from jim hand on this. he said if you don't want to cut the water cross over off, torque the intake and use some washers (with sealer) between the intake and the back of the timing cover to limit the amount of movement. aparently it is possible to move the intake toward the front of the motor when you torque the timing cover bolt.

hope this helps some.

------------------
Kevin Swaney
Gold '66 GTO, 389 4 spd with Trips
13.042 @ 106.64 mph