BUTLER PERFORMANCE

[triathlonx13]

I had the recent good fortune to have a part break on an easy road test. Good fortune being that I wasn't on the track / WOT.

The p/n: BPI-CDR Crankshaft Drive Mandrel-drilled for 3 or 4 bolt balancers - 5/8" shaft with pulley for my EVAC system broke off !! The steel shaft that is (or was) welded to the "hub" failed - causing the shaft, pulley, and belt to fall out while I was driving my TA about 40 mph. I found the belt. The hub stayed bolted to the lower crank pulley - but the shaft and pulley bounced off (could'nt find it).
http://jbp-pontiac.com/images/EvacPumpKit/EvacParts-MORKit031.jpg

I consider myself lucky that nothing on the car/motor/radiator was damaged. I called Butler this morning about what happened. They said that they have had some failures with these pulley/shaft/hub assemblies and that they can replace it free of charge. However they did not have any in stock? I told them I needed something over nighted - because I'm leaving for Pontiacs In The Park this Thursday ! He said he'd see what can be done??

This was the kit that I bought last spring:

http://jbp-pontiac.com/images/EvacPumpKit/91020020.JPG
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[triathlonx13]

Good News !! The guys at Butler Performance were able to get the Hub/shaft/pulley assembly out this morning for an over night shipment. I'll get the part tomorrow and installed in time for the PITP event.


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[Scott Roberts]

Sounds like good service. I see where they admitted having problems and took care of it no questions asked. You can't ask for anything better. Glad to see they "fixed" you up in time for you to make it to VMP. Have a safe trip down and I hope to see you there.
Scott

[triathlonx13]

Sounds like good service. I see where they admitted having problems and took care of it no questions asked. You can't ask for anything better. Glad to see they "fixed" you up in time for you to make it to VMP. Have a safe trip down and I hope to see you there.
Scott

Thanks.

Tonight after work I'm putting in a new transmission in my TA (having the converter flushed today also). I lost 3rd (drive). Nothing like last minute stuff !!!

Pray for good weather !
It'll be myself (Chris Hunt), girlfriend, Dad, my friend Mike Moak (gray 65 GTO) and his wife. Two truck campers with trailers and a tent.

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[Scott Roberts]

Thanks.

Tonight after work I'm putting in a new transmission in my TA (having the converter flushed today also). I lost 3rd (drive). Nothing like last minute stuff !!!

Pray for good weather !
It'll be myself (Chris Hunt), girlfriend, Dad, my friend Mike Moak (gray 65 GTO) and his wife. Two truck campers with trailers and a tent.

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Good lord man! You will look like a ban of gypsies comming down the road.LOL. Looks like weather will be good. I think the only chance of rain is late Sunday. Temps should be in the low to mid 80's all weekend.

[triathlonx13]

Good lord man! You will look like a ban of gypsies comming down the road.LOL. Looks like weather will be good. I think the only chance of rain is late Sunday. Temps should be in the low to mid 80's all weekend.

LOL ! I have to laugh too. I'm really happy that my Dad is going. He's 67 and a retired teamster of 35 + years. He loves to travel and really knows how to do it. He went with us out to Norwalk last year and had a great time. He's a character and a really great man. This might be his last trip cause my Mom is very ill and is restricted to a wheel chair most of the time.

Yup - we'll look like "something" going down the trail. :)

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[triathlonx13]

If you see my Dad - be sure to say Hi.. Here is last year at Norwalk in his glory!

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[triathlonx13]

Scott (Drunk'nInjun) -

Thanks for stopping over and saying Hi. We had a good time... even though I had some electrical issues... and then the tranny going out on me.:cool:

I have the transmission out and will be getting it checked out/repaired tonight.

We'll be going to Norwalk this year !!! Hope you can make it. What's the status of your car??

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[Scott Roberts]

Scott (Drunk'nInjun) -

Thanks for stopping over and saying Hi. We had a good time... even though I had some electrical issues... and then the tranny going out on me.:cool:

I have the transmission out and will be getting it checked out/repaired tonight.

We'll be going to Norwalk this year !!! Hope you can make it. What's the status of your car??

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Good to see you aswell Chris! Very nice car by the way (love those TA's). I didn't get to see many cars go down the track fri or sat because i was busy running my mouth and socializing. Car should be done for Norwalk and plan on being there. You might need to build a stronger trans....................... big HP tends to break stuff!:) Hope you come back next year, this was an off year for car count. About 100 car down I believe.

[Jack Ferris]

I feel pretty good now since I have one of these on my bracket car. Did they see a reason for the failure? Did you replace it with an identical unit? Now I'm nervous. I'm not so thrilled with the mandrel anyway as it looks like a swamp cooler part.

[BVR421]

check out the drive mandrel Tin Indian makes and sells, its an inch or so diameter and very versatile with the spacers you can run 2-3 accessories off it. Very beefy. I dont own one but I have closely examined the parts and watched Jim install his with no hassles.

http://tinindianperformance.com/Tin%20Indian%20Performance%20Pontiac%20crank%20man drel%20drive%20systems.htm

[triathlonx13]

I feel pretty good now since I have one of these on my bracket car. Did they see a reason for the failure? Did you replace it with an identical unit? Now I'm nervous. I'm not so thrilled with the mandrel anyway as it looks like a swamp cooler part.

The "new design" (which happens to be the 3rd design) of the Butler's steel two piece mandrel now is welded from the back side (as the original one was) and welded were the shaft comes out of the hub in the front. Also, they changed the pulley diameter (I believe to reduce rotating mass/weight).

I'm using it now.... but I would NEVER buy it again for $549. Pump "looks" cheap, racket for the pump is alittle close to the lower radiator hose, and the mandrel assembly is not a great design.... Very heavy and using lock-tite set screws to hold the pulley on is not the best thing in the world. My buddy bought the pump/mandrel set-up from Tin Indian for like $750. His kit looks great and is lighter.... worth the extra $150 + dollars all day long.

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[triathlonx13]

Good to see you aswell Chris! Very nice car by the way (love those TA's). I didn't get to see many cars go down the track fri or sat because i was busy running my mouth and socializing. Car should be done for Norwalk and plan on being there. You might need to build a stronger trans....................... big HP tends to break stuff!:) Hope you come back next year, this was an off year for car count. About 100 car down I believe.

Thanks.

I thought the event was great - and will go again. The way the track time was set up allowed for runs all day long!

We'll be at Norwalk. We hope to get there early so we can pit near the staging lanes.

We'll have to hook up and have a couple beers and talk cars.

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[Jack Ferris]

check out the drive mandrel Tin Indian makes and sells, its an inch or so diameter and very versatile with the spacers you can run 2-3 accessories off it. Very beefy. I dont own one but I have closely examined the parts and watched Jim install his with no hassles.

http://tinindianperformance.com/Tin%20Indian%20Performance%20Pontiac%20crank%20man drel%20drive%20systems.htm


I think if that set up will put the pully in the same place as the one I have now I'm going to buy it. As it sits now my pully is all the way against the base of the mandrel.

[Jack Ferris]

I'm using it now.... but I would NEVER buy it again for $549. Pump "looks" cheap, racket for the pump is alittle close to the lower radiator hose, and the mandrel assembly is not a great design.... Very heavy and using lock-tite set screws to hold the pulley on is not the best thing in the world. My buddy bought the pump/mandrel set-up from Tin Indian for like $750. His kit looks great and is lighter.... worth the extra $150 + dollars all day long.


Looks cheap is an under statment. But I have seen several of these that run belt driven fuel pumps too. So whan yours came apart did the shaft simply pull out of the base?

[triathlonx13]

I'm using it now.... but I would NEVER buy it again for $549. Pump "looks" cheap, racket for the pump is alittle close to the lower radiator hose, and the mandrel assembly is not a great design.... Very heavy and using lock-tite set screws to hold the pulley on is not the best thing in the world. My buddy bought the pump/mandrel set-up from Tin Indian for like $750. His kit looks great and is lighter.... worth the extra $150 + dollars all day long.


Looks cheap is an under statment. But I have seen several of these that run belt driven fuel pumps too. So whan yours came apart did the shaft simply pull out of the base?

Yes. You know how the mandrel/shaft fits inside the hub...and then is welded from the back side right - the weld failed/broke and allowed the shaft to walk out of the hub and fell off. The new design of the hub to mandrel/shaft is the same except they weld the shaft in the back like before and also weld the shaft in the front where is comes out of the hub.

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[triathlonx13]

I think if that set up will put the pully in the same place as the one I have now I'm going to buy it. As it sits now my pully is all the way against the base of the mandrel.

Do you have your mandrel's pulley with the pulley's hub/set-screw boss facing the radiator of the crank pulley?


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[Jack Ferris]

I will look tonight.

[Jack Ferris]

Do you have your mandrel's pulley with the pulley's hub/set-screw boss facing the radiator of the crank pulley?


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It appears to face the radiator. Its set as far back on the mandrel as it can go.