What do you like most about the '04?

What do you like most about the '04?

Good (better) luck on this one.

Wish I could vote for three out of four. I like everything but the cosmetics, and those are acceptably understated as far as I am concerned. And they should have called it a Pontiac Monaro GTO.

I finaly got to drive on last week, and loved it. I understand all the complaints. It sure does not look anything like my 69. and it is not a Pontiyac motor. But hello it has been 40 years since the 64, and 30 or so since the Pontiyak V8. It is one nice car, and a blast to drive.

I picked all of the above.

but a I ask Goathead a simple , but serious question - If the GTO was not called a GTO, but everything else was exactly the same what would its sales figures be ?

and would you have bought one? http://forums.performanceyears.com/g.../icon_wink.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
What do you like most about the '04? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_1436/article.html
Australian HSV GTO upgraded to 285 KW since this article, read it and weap.

I ask Goathead a simple , but serious question - If the GTO was not called a GTO, but everything else was exactly the same what would its sales figures be ?

My opinion, just an opinion, is the same as the survey say's, the cosmetics suck, so no, I would not have even taken a second look in the showroom if it had not been labeled a GTO, and I
sure would not have driven one, they are ugly... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...n_rolleyes.gif

Not to beat a dead horse but you really think it is Ugly? I mean i understand bland but ugly? The Aztek is ugly, would you rate it the same?

IMHO trucks are ugly but the sheep buy them in droves. i can remember back in the "glory" days of the GTO. you wouldn't be caught dead driving a truck. style is subjective and cyclicle

While I feel it's unanimous that none of us like every thing about this car, I think we all like at least something about it. Instead of constant bickering about its failures and virtues we should be purchasing and enjoying this car. We should be applauding Pontiac for its efforts to even make an attempt at quenching our thirst for an affordable V8 powered rear wheel drive coupe. If we continue to bash this car Pontiac may abandon their efforts and return front-wheel-drive v6's. We need to show our support by promoting this car for what it is and hopefully motivate Pontiac into building what we really want. Of all the current Pontiacs available, this is the only one I would purchase. I would consider the GXP but it is FWD.

well said.

Very

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by svede1212:
IMHO trucks are ugly but the sheep buy them in droves. i can remember back in the "glory" days of the GTO. you wouldn't be caught dead driving a truck. style is subjective and cyclicle <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So is performance - nevermind the new dodge 500 hp v10 or the ford lightning, the last couple of years I've been seeing 6000 lb 4wd diesel trucks running 12's at the strip.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>So is performance - nevermind the new dodge 500 hp v10 or the ford lightning, the last couple of years I've been seeing 6000 lb 4wd diesel trucks running 12's at the strip. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Humbler, wait until next generation Lightning. It is going to have 700hp, what then? Street truck running in the 11's ? http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...s/icon_eek.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by stonebreaker:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by svede1212:
IMHO trucks are ugly but the sheep buy them in droves. i can remember back in the "glory" days of the GTO. you wouldn't be caught dead driving a truck. style is subjective and cyclicle <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So is performance - nevermind the new dodge 500 hp v10 or the ford lightning, the last couple of years I've been seeing 6000 lb 4wd diesel trucks running 12's at the strip. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

...and so will you see '04 GTOs doing the same but straight line is very one dimensional. performance-wise this car does it all.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>So is performance - nevermind the new dodge 500 hp v10 or the ford lightning, the last couple of years I've been seeing 6000 lb 4wd diesel trucks running 12's at the strip. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Humbler, wait until next generation Lightning. It is going to have 700hp, what then? Street truck running in the 11's ? http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...s/icon_eek.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not my post, but 700hp, is that official?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by humbler:

Not my post, but 700hp, is that official? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL , thats quite funny how goathead doesn't really quote who he is replying , or will highlight it in [B] without quoting who he is answering... and often gets confused, "who was i talking to ? http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif"

oh yeah back to the subject: "700hp lightnings" :rotfl:

Go back and read the whole post real slowely, maybe you will get it... :rolleyes

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>quote from stonebreaker, for those with ADD..
http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...s/icon_eek.gifSo is performance - nevermind the new dodge 500 hp v10 or the ford lightning, the last couple of years I've been seeing 6000 lb 4wd diesel trucks running 12's at the strip <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

For those who watch speedvision, this was released on a special about trucks and the high performance market. Chevy is coming out with a "lightning type" truck, but Ford, once again, is way ahead of the game. Remember when that was Pontiacs position in the market....ah, the good old days... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_frown.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> oh yeah back to the subject: "700hp lightnings" :rotfl: <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Alright, you opened your self up again. As soon as I hear back from Speed TV, I will post a new topic call "One again Down Under fails to listen"...hope you are ready... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif

I like the GTO emblem they put on this ugly car.
Actually, that's about all I like about it.
(cosmetically).

you've made your points. i think it looks good. a lot of poeple i've run into think it looks good. you think it's ugly. i really wish this forum could lose the grumps and get on with '04 GTO support

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>i really wish this forum could lose the grumps and get on with '04 GTO support
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Post a thread of you own called "Dreamers United".... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...on_biggrin.gif

svede1212 wrote "you've made your points. i think it looks good. a lot of poeple i've run into think it looks good. you think it's ugly. i really wish this forum could lose the grumps and get on with '04 GTO support"

Couldn't have said it better myself..... the negativity for the 04 GTO on this forum is almost a cult.
Take a look at the poll results everybody!
Then go out and drive one ... this car out performs any stock GTO from previous years.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ozzy:
svede1212 wrote
Take a look at the poll results everybody!
Then go out and drive one ... this car out performs any stock GTO from previous years. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Except for sales

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Except for sales <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.performanceyears.com/g.../icon_razz.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 70455RA:
Except for sales <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Insightful stuff... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...n_rolleyes.gif

I guess the GTO haters have plenty of time their hands.. http://forums.performanceyears.com/g.../icon_wink.gif.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ozzy:
Then go out and drive one ... this car out performs any stock GTO from previous years. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Who buys a car simply because it's fast?
For $31k+, it better look good AND perform.
Why do people say "drive it then decide".
Is it going to look any different AFTER I drive it? The reason it's not selling has more to do with how it looks than performance.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RamAirJohn:

Who buys a car simply because it's fast?
For $31k+, it better look good AND perform.
Why do people say "drive it then decide".
Is it going to look any different AFTER I drive it? The reason it's not selling has more to do with how it looks than performance. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


That is your opinion. I have heard many stories of dealers not allowing people to take test drives. I wouldn't consider buying a car if I couldn't test drive it first. Would you?

Dealer attitude has some small part to play, no doubt. You've heard the "stories" because people spread bad news, seldom do they go out of their way to post or spread normal experiences in car buying. Don't blame the "GTO's" poor sales on the dealers. They catch on pretty quick when a car doesn't leave the lot. Floor plans cost money. People interested in this car realize what kind of performance to expect from its small block Chevy. Put that engine in a mail truck and it would perform. Its becoming plain to everyone but a small minority that GM missed the mark with this car. Maybe they can polish this turd next year with some scoops and another dose of horsepower, that remains to be seen. My opinion says they can't. Following GM's past history, if they do somehow manage to make it so more than a few people want it, they'll kill it off.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
Go back and read the whole post real slowely, maybe you will get it... :rolleyes

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>quote from stonebreaker, for those with ADD..
http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...s/icon_eek.gifSo is performance - nevermind the new dodge 500 hp v10 or the ford lightning, the last couple of years I've been seeing 6000 lb 4wd diesel trucks running 12's at the strip <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

For those who watch speedvision, this was released on a special about trucks and the high performance market. Chevy is coming out with a "lightning type" truck, but Ford, once again, is way ahead of the game. Remember when that was Pontiacs position in the market....ah, the good old days... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_frown.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> oh yeah back to the subject: "700hp lightnings" :rotfl: <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Alright, you opened your self up again. As soon as I hear back from Speed TV, I will post a new topic call "One again Down Under fails to listen"...hope you are ready... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'll wait till I hear back from Ford. Can't imagine a 700hp truck in production though, not saying it won't happen but that would be something. Who would have thought we'd say that Viper monster. Still can't fit a family in a truck though unless it's a quad cab, now that would be something!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr_GTO:
I wouldn't consider buying a car if I couldn't test drive it first. Would you? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course not. But I also wouldn't buy a car simply because I drove it. If it does not appeal to me (exterior/interior + performance), I wouldn't buy it. Apparently, there are a lot of people making this same decision.

In case any of you didn't know yet... Holdens rule, old and new http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif

http://www.fullboost.com.au/content/...04_07_044b.jpg

http://www.fullboost.com.au/content/...04_07_045b.jpg

http://www.fullboost.com.au/content/...04_07_013b.jpg

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> In case any of you didn't know yet... Holdens rule, old and new
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Stock, right? http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...on_biggrin.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by David Jones:
Dealer attitude has some small part to play, no doubt. You've heard the "stories" because people spread bad news, seldom do they go out of their way to post or spread normal experiences in car buying. Don't blame the "GTO's" poor sales on the dealers. They catch on pretty quick when a car doesn't leave the lot. Floor plans cost money. People interested in this car realize what kind of performance to expect from its small block Chevy. Put that engine in a mail truck and it would perform. Its becoming plain to everyone but a small minority that GM missed the mark with this car. Maybe they can polish this turd next year with some scoops and another dose of horsepower, that remains to be seen. My opinion says they can't. Following GM's past history, if they do somehow manage to make it so more than a few people want it, they'll kill it off. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, seeing as "some" dealers still have LOA's listed, are prohibiting test drives, and making false claims on Ebay, they don't catch on quick.

A lot more to the performance of this car than a chebby power plant. Go check out the pics from the Nat's. Ain't no mail truck gonna do that.

That small minority will hopefully be enough to keep it alive for many years to come. I also suspect some of the few faithful will lose intrest when they do go to scoops unless of course they're functional. The car looks good the way it is, I hope Pontiac doesn't Aztek it. The only thing that will make it any better for me is to fix that ridiculous back seat entry.

More stellar reviews on the 04 Monaro. Car Craft, September issue, P.84. Only mention of the Monaro that participated in the Hotchkiss shootout was a pic of the butt ugly rearend and a note that 'while the car "ran well" (whatever that means) it could only average 14.20's on the 2 dragstrip tests'. Your standards would have to be pretty lax to call those times "running well".
Dont shoot the messenger here. Just reporting what was said by guys testing the car.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tom McQueen:
More stellar reviews on the 04 Monaro. Car Craft, September issue, P.84. Only mention of the Monaro that participated in the Hotchkiss shootout was a pic of the butt ugly rearend and a note that 'while the car "ran well" (whatever that means) it could only average 14.20's on the 2 dragstrip tests'. Your standards would have to be pretty lax to call those times "running well".
Dont shoot the messenger here. Just reporting what was said by guys testing the car. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The day wasn't all about drag racing.

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthr...light=Hotchkis

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthr...light=Hotchkis

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthr...light=Hotchkis

I love this job..... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...on_biggrin.gif

"The day wasn't all about drag racing."

Youre right. But the ONLY mention it got was the crappy quarter mile times leaving one to assume it didnt exactly shine in any of the other performance events either.

The thread topic is "What do I like" about the '04 GTO? Well, if you have to know..... I like the fact that it isn't selling well. Maybe Pontiac will drop it or rename it something else. Maybe they will lose a bunch of money on it too. Maybe Pontiac will follow Oldsmobiles path. They seem to be headed that way. GM would get along fine with just Chebby for entry level and performance, Buick for the old farts and Caddy for the 21 century Yuppies. We'll see. Steve (owner of every year of Real GTO 1964-74) www.pontiacheaven.org

what you guys don't understand, is even if the GTO only sold 100 cars this year.

They still wont discontinue it, even if it sold poorly for '05 they still wont discontinue it.

the car , the name GTO is locked in for atleast another 3 years Guaranteed.

so sit back relax , all you bitches will have a lot more complaining to do.

http://forums.performanceyears.com/g.../icon_wink.gif

Bitches? Complaining? You must be reading a different thread. The last sentence of your reply was amazingly childish. Opinions are being expressed on both sides of this issue and responses such as yours do nothing but point out how where your head is. http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by David Jones:
Bitches? Complaining? You must be reading a different thread. The last sentence of your reply was amazingly childish. Opinions are being expressed on both sides of this issue and responses such as yours do nothing but point out how where your head is. http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'ts obvious where his head is.........down under http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...on_biggrin.gif

hey im happy with life, regardless if GTO does good or bad, I don't see what all this bickerring is achieving, just ruining this part of a good forum.
http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...icon_smile.gif

Personal attatcks are always used when you dont have any substantive arguement to make. Expect more of it.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tom McQueen:
"The day wasn't all about drag racing."

Youre right. But the ONLY mention it got was the crappy quarter mile times leaving one to assume it didnt exactly shine in any of the other performance events either. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't think the article mentioned any other 1/4 mile times did it? So who is to say it wasn't one of the quicker times or that it went better in other catagories?

We know in the right condtions they can run real low 13's.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Alright, you opened your self up again. As soon as I hear back from Speed TV, I will post a new topic call "One again Down Under fails to listen"...hope you are ready...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's gonna be a real shame when a Cadilliac whopp's your ass.... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...n_rolleyes.gif


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>700 hp at 5200 rpm and 740 pound-feet at 4600 rpm. That's more than the 493-hp Mercedes S600, the 550-hp Saleen S7, and the 650-hp Ferrari Enzo Ferrari.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Humbler, read this. Here is one of them... http://forums.performanceyears.com/g.../icon_cool.gif

http://www.caranddriver.com/article....rticle_id=6860

some old-school car folk aren't as bitter about the new car as others i happen to know ...

http://www.micro-op.com.au/execls1/gtos1.jpg

http://www.micro-op.com.au/execls1/gtos2.jpg

http://www.micro-op.com.au/execls1/gtos3.jpg