I was disappointed after receiving this dash chrome from Potomac Pontiac. The description was "Slight Pitting". Well take a look at this pic http://www.geocities.com/pmdmuscle/DSC00047.JPG of the ash tray bezel and you decide. There is missing chrome all over this piece. Potomac's response was "try to find a nicer piece for that price", no refunds. I just think they misrepresent the condition of their parts. Maybe it’s just me, but if I were to sell this piece, I certainly would not describe it as “slight pitting”. I’m sure PP has many satisfied customers as I have seen there name before in some Pontiac publications. Please be careful and get what you feel is an accurate description from PP before buying.

I was disappointed after receiving this dash chrome from Potomac Pontiac. The description was "Slight Pitting". Well take a look at this pic http://www.geocities.com/pmdmuscle/DSC00047.JPG of the ash tray bezel and you decide. There is missing chrome all over this piece. Potomac's response was "try to find a nicer piece for that price", no refunds. I just think they misrepresent the condition of their parts. Maybe it’s just me, but if I were to sell this piece, I certainly would not describe it as “slight pitting”. I’m sure PP has many satisfied customers as I have seen there name before in some Pontiac publications. Please be careful and get what you feel is an accurate description from PP before buying.

The picture of the pieces in question are not available anymore. I looked at them when they were posted on ebay. Pitting means that the chrome is missing. Potomac Pontiac always accurately describes all parts and stands behind them 100%.

Sorry, if you try the link in a new browser (cut and paste of type it in) it will work (yahoo does not allow link from other pages. Anyway, I guess my idea of slight and theirs are two different things. There policy directed to me was "no refunds".

I'm surprised. I have dealt with Ron for a few years and he has always been very good. I had him send me a tilt col. last year that looked fine outside, but when I went to pull the lock cylinder it was full of rust. Potomac credited me back no problem. He is also a wealth of info.

[img]www.geocities.com/pmdmuscle/DSC00047.JPG[/img]

[This message has been edited by Rashionality (edited 10-23-2001).]

http://www.geocities.com/pmdmuscle/DSC00047.JPG

Well...that didn't work.

The problem may stem from the fact that the proprietor of Potomac did his apprenticeship under the owner of Sonic Motors.

Same attitude towards the customer.

cut the .jpg off the address it will open and that piece is bad it should of said pitting needs rechroming

Have you ever dealt with this company Rash? If not then I don't think your needed in this post. Misus, Ron did not serve an apprenticeship under Barry Martin and is alot better with his customers. Have you dealt with him on any parts? If not then you are also not needed here in this post.

I have known, traded parts to, sold to, & bought parts off Ron many times over the last 14 years. Never had a problem with him or his parts & would buy off him again.

Everyone has an idea in their head as to what "nice" used potmetal is... same with "minimal pitting." Some pieces have always been in mediocre shape used & in the very best shape show some flaws. Even NOS potmetal in the sealed GM box can often exhibit pitting. Had my share...for a concours car, they were all cores for expensive potmetal plating.

Tripower, I do not know what to tell you, was this an e-Bay auction or outright deal?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim Zeek:
Have you ever dealt with this company Rash?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

NO...your point being?


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim Zeek:
I don't think your needed in this post.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

There you go thinking again Jim...what did the Doctor tell you about that? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]


By the way FYFI all I did was put the picture on the site for everyone to form their own decision.

Jim: The apprenticeship thing is a joke. He learned from Barely Marginal, just as you learned from Ron.

Since I've never bought anything from him, I supppose I'm not allowed to talk about those who I DO know that have gotten boned by him.

Leave me out, I suppose.

Knowing alot about the parts business, and especially about the early years, I'd call that 64-5 ashtray fascia a piece that is suitable for a weekend/daily driver, but not a show quality piece. I've sold several in that condition for $10-$20.
Nicer ones are not super hard to find, but cost will go up. I got beat out on a NOS one on ebay at $75.
I would describe that piece as having some pinpoint pits, that would not be a distraction at normal viewing range. IE- If it was mounted on your dash ashtray, and I looked into your car, I wouldn't notice it as a hideously deformed hunk of pot metal.

I've also known Ron for many years, and am somewhat surprised that he would not refund your money.



[This message has been edited by Andre (edited 10-25-2001).]

tripower,I feel for you but I must say that Ron Johnson has been very fair to me over the years.He even refunded my money on a high ticket item after one year.I agree with some posts about pot metal items,you really need to get a detailed description as pitting is in the eye of the beholder.I am not being critical,just passing on advise after being disappointed in some pot metal purchases,and they weren't Ron's pieces.I would try to talk to him again.All the best bigpop

This type of situation has existed with used parts vendors since dirt. It is compounded by the fact that Ron's parts usually come at a high price. Therefore, a higher expectation of the part yields a lower satisfaction level when the part is received. As far as no refunds......? well that may be true, but Ron is not here to defend himself and we don't know the full situation.

*******
I do know that he was taking care of his ill father for the last year until he finally passed away last week. Maybe you caught him on a bad day.

In this age of cheap digital cameras, any vendor of worth should own one. AND he should be willing to send you a pic of the part in question. If not, move on.

Misus, you are blabbing about 2nd hand information which usually gets twisted around the more times it is told. This particular incident was an Ebay auction. There was a picture posted. It was not the only piece that was bought. It was all three pieces that were sold together for a total of about $40.00! This person never contacted Ron that he was not happy with what he got. Ron would have gladly given him his money back. $40.00 for all three pieces is a good deal, not for a show car as was stated in the auction. All he did was post negative feedback without calling or e-mailing anyone. Any person who knows anything about any car should know that your not going to get a perfect part for nothing. Did he think it was going to be like new? Andre says he gets $10-$20 for a piece like that. This guy got the whole setup for $40.00. So before you know the whole story and have any personal (i.e., YOU, YOURSELF) experience with anyone or anything you should just shut your face!

Zeek: (May I call you "Jim?")

I don't recall my making any reference to this particular item, do you?

And I think I know enough not to make statements about things unless I know the facts. Second hand information from close friends? Who cares? It's reliable in my book.

Please don't act like a schoolyard bully.

Thank you.

They have some hard to find parts which is great. Only thing is their return policy,among other things:
I order a set of alternator brackets for my 67 bird(but has a 72 455 motor). We agreed $85 with tax for the set. I get the brackets but for a 67 firebird, when I really asked for the later model brackets, and the kicker was they charged me $94 on my card!! I was pissed. I called them up and told them the product was wrong, and I was overcharged..."Ron" denied aggreeing to $94. He wasn't even the guy I spoke to that day! Well he claimed I could send them back within 30 days for a refund. I sent them back within that time frame only to find out that an additional 15% refund penalty fee was assessed- so I recieved a refund of $79.90! Pretty shady. But for $14( and return shipping)I just let it go!
-Chris

I visit this site often to see what is going on but have never registered till now, this whole issue is getting really blown out of proportion and kind of pissed me off, so here is my view of it for what it is worth.
I have bought and sold on e-bay for the past several years, pictures dont always show all the details, but are a huge help. Ive been dissapointed in some e-bay cases and e-mailed the seller even if they have a no return policy and usually come out satisfied, MOST people are fair on e-bay. As far as Ron Johnson goes, he has to be one of the best. Ive dealt with him for several years and never been "shafted" or dissapointed. In one instance I bought several items on a whim and returned two of them after completion of the restoration, a year and a half later he gladly refunded my money , no questions asked. Bottom line is did you ever ask for a refund, or just drop negative feedback. Negative feedback with out a cause can burn alot of bridges on e-bay, nobody wants to have it and usually will resolve most issues before it comes down to it. If you read e-bays feedback forum, it clearly states that you have exhausted all other avenues of resloving the proposed problem. And lastly, if you got all 3 peices for $40 or so, you did good if all parts are as decent as the ash tray peice. Hopefully we get Rons side of the story and can all put this to rest! One more thing to take into consideration here is that most of us do this for a hobby, Ron and even Barry (Barley Marginal) do this for a living and help all of us with thier knowlege and suply of correct parts, so cut them a break or spend countless hours and money calling and driving all over the place to find that peice, or call a guy that has basicly devoted his life to helping us restore our dreams!!!!1

It's "Barely Marginal."

Thanks Mr "spell check"

If the name's getting around, it should be pronounced correctly. After all, "Barley Marginal" is the name of a cheap Baltimore beer.

...I hope Barry Martin understands the nickname; Barely Marginal is used in an endearing light.

However, Minus is a bit different...

I've dealt with Ron for over 20 years without a single problem. Being in business for over 20 years should say something in itself.

Buying & selling parts for the last 17 years I have met & dealt with a lot of people. One being Ron for the last 10 years without any issues! I have trusted Ron as a referral to my customers when I could not help them. Ron will always rectify any situation that may occur. Ron has put a lot of effort into his business & takes pride in what he sells. Any situation on EBAY can be rectified but as usual it takes one person to blow it out of proportion. If you have ever dealt with Ron on a personal level you would respect his knowledge, ability & his dedication to the Pontiac hobby. You be the judge!

HAVE KNOWN RON FOR MANY YEARS. HE HAS BOUGHT TONS OF PARTS FROM ME BOTH SITE UNSEEN AND AT GTO NATIONALS. I HAVE SENT HIM UP TO $1000. WORTH OF PARTS BEFORE HE PAID FOR THEM AND HAVE NEVER HAD A PROBLEM GETTING PAID OR HIM PAYING A VERY FAIR PRICE FOR THE PARTS. HE IS AS STRAIGHT A SHOOTER AS YOU WILL FIND.

Any reputable dealer that sells used parts by mail order wouldn't have a "no refund policy". There should be a 2 or 3 day after receipt right to return with full refund. Return shipping to be paid my buyer. Anything less is asking for problems.

Why hasnt the original poster replied to this post? Did you ever call and ask for a refund or did yo just post negative feedback?

I have known Ron Johnson for over 10 years.His reputation is A1.
Being on the POCI board since 1988 and past POCI president,I get the misfortune of hearing the complaints of members who got beat.Ron Johnson has never been one of them.
I know several people in the Boston area who buy parts from Ron on a regular basis,who are very satisfied.The parts are always as described for the going rate.We need more vendors like Ron who supply quality hard to find parts in a timely manner at a fair price.

Amen J. Z. Has this issue ever been resolved? Or is this just another form of negative feedback??

As a Pontiac parts vendor, I have personally done business with Ron on numerous occasions. Without doubt he is very honest and tries very hard to accurately describe his parts. I have seen what Ron pays for his inventory and his prices only represent a fair return for the money he has invested. In many cases he should charge more, but he tries to keep prices reasonable while trying to make a living. Based on a price of $40 for the three dash trim pieces, I would expect that they would have significant pitting and be driver quality at best. Ebay auctions are a contract and the buyer should always ask questions if they are unsure of the quality of a part, because they are obligated to buy the part if they win the auction.

------------------

I have dealt with Ron for the last 9 years, on a few occasions.... He was always on the money.

This topic is good for the hobby.(except Misus' posts) Maybe in the future buyers will ask more questions. Maybe next time Vendors will explain items a little better.

Well the consensus here seems to be is that Potomac Pontiac is a reputable business with very satisfied customers. I certainly did not intend this post as a bash against them, but more of a “buyer beware” notice. Obviously my experience with them was an isolated incident that perhaps could have been cleared up with further e-mails. Their policy was explicit on Ebay “ALL SALES ARE FINAL”, the seller, not Ebay, added this so therefore I determined this was the reason e-mail(s) went unanswered. My issue was never about the price I paid for the parts. Weather I paid $2 or $200, the description as I interpreted it, was not consistent with the condition and description of other bezels of the same type for sale on EBay. But then again, everyone has their own idea of what “slight pitting” means to them. Anyway, it is good to know that the majority of Potomac’s customers are satisfied and continue to deal with them as this was my first bad experience with a Pontiac parts vendor.

Ron Johnson here. This posting was brought to my attention last week by Chris C. but I have not had the time or energy to reply due the passing away of my father 2 1/2 weeks ago after a long illness. If any members have lost a family loved one, you know how painful it is. However, this has nothing to do with the issue at hand. This is my first posting to this BB and I will add my contribution for the record.
I have been involved in the Pontiac only parts business for almost 28 years. I started as a collector, it went to a hobby and progressed to a full time business 16 years ago. I have gone to all 4 corners of the country and everywhere in between to bring high quality nos and used parts to the east coast where most of it is bad. I am on the road 70-90 days a year with the exception of this past year. Enough of that.
The facts of this transaction are as follows:
1) This was an ebay auction. Those of you who wish to view the original auction with the photo look at #594486993. It is still there as of today.
2) It appears to be represented that the ashtray piece was the only item in the auction when indeed it was all 3 pieces of chrome across the dash. Whether anyone agrees or not, $46.00 was a great deal for these pieces. Regardless, I am bound to sell for this price, even though it is worth much more.
3) To the best of my knowledege, the high bidder, Norm Johnson of Orland Park, Il, ebay user name pmd70, never asked any questions prior to bidding. In addition, Mr Johnson and I have had no futher communication whatsover other than the exchange of information right after auction end. The only time I knew there was a problem when he hit me with an unjustified negative feedback.
4) None of these ribbed parts digitally photogragh very well compared to other parts. Bidders need to keep that in mind and ask questions for further evaluation if necessary.
5) I realize that the auction stated "all sales final", but it does not hurt to ask. The worst that can happen is a refusal, which never happened in this case. I used this phrase for protection against dishonest buyers, and they are out there, for a while, but discovered it was a bad business decision and ceased using it after a short time. I am not aware of Norm J. emailing me requesting a return or refund. This is contrary to his statement. I answer every email, especially when it comes to ebay auctions specifically to AVOID a negative feedback.
I sincerely am sorry that this transaction had to end up being a subject of controversy on the BB and Mr N. Johnson was a disappointed customer. As most of you can see from the other posts, I try very hard to represent my parts honestly. I make enough without having to take advantage of anyone and certainly DO NOT want to end up with a moniker like "Barely Marginal" I feel Andre Rayman described it best. I think that if you ask any 64-65 A-body owner if his dash chrome is totally pit-free I feel that you would get an overwhelming NO! I think this crappy potmetal stuff was pitted from the time it was new. I stand by my description of this item 100% and believe I truly represented this item honestly. If you Norm J. would like to return this item, I will GLADLY refund your money, including freight. I would have then and will now. Contact me at sd7369@aol. com if you want to do so.
My return policy for my business, past, present, and future is any item is returnable within 30 days as long as it is in the same condition as received.
The following is my opinion:
I get the impression from your actions that you are probably a good guy but a newcomer to the hobby. No problem, everyone has to start somewhere. You have chosen a highly desireable but expensive to restore model as almost every 65 owner needs the same expensive hard to find parts, (i.e. taillamp bezels, center panel, other potmetal). You will find as you pursue parts for this car that it is not as easy as most people think. Anyone who has done this for 10 years or more knows how hard parts are getting to find. I truly wish you luck and good fortune in your project.
Lastly, I would like to thank all of my friends and loyal customers for their support by taking the time to post a message on this board, be it good or bad. Like Chris C. stated, maybe we all can learn from this issue. I know I have!

I find it perplexing how the response goes from "Try to find a nicer piece for the price. No refunds" to "I will gladly refund your money, including freight", when the complaint is made public.

Unless "tripower" is lying about this initial statement by "sd7369", then the succession of events here proves that this "Unofficial BBB" serves its purpose well.

PS

BwaaaaHaaHaaHaaHaHa

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Scott Misus:
I find it perplexing how the response goes from "Try to find a nicer piece for the price. No refunds" to "I will gladly refund your money, including freight", when the complaint is made public.

Unless "tripower" is lying about this initial statement by "sd7369", then the succession of events here proves that this "Unofficial BBB" serves its purpose well. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

First, I'll start by saying that Ron is a stand-up guy. The reason I can say this with confidence is that I have dealt with Ron on both the buying and selling end. My experience is therefore first-hand and not second-hand as in "heard from a friend"!

Secondly, since Ron is in business he does have business phone/fax numbers which could have been requested since this guy was e-mailing him. Why not request that number and resolve this by phone before leaving negative feedback and coming here to blast him on PY's forum. Unfortunately, I think this backfired on the poster as there were far more positive posts(i.e. satisfied Potomac customers) than negative posts! Kind of makes you wonder what his real motive was with regards to this issue! Was he really trying to save us from a similar fate or were there sour grapes? You be the judge!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ccass:
This topic is good for the hobby.(except Misus' posts) Maybe in the future buyers will ask more questions. Maybe next time Vendors will explain items a little better.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ccass-Why not visit:www.ragingbull.com for a neat feature this stock message board utilizes when an obnoxious poster(commonly referred to as a basher) posts negative or false information about certain stocks. It's called an "Ignore Poster" option and is really quite a nice feature! Just go to any stock category and click on a posters response and look to the upper left of the box and you will see this option. I know I would have used this feature on many ocassions when it pertains to a select group of posters on this site! Just for your consideration!

Just to follow up, I did receive a full refund from Ron (including shipping) for this dash chrome. Like I mentioned before, my intent was not to "bash" Potomac Pontiac, in fact, after noticing the positive responses on this thread, I requested CCASS remove this posting as to not offend anyone else. However, CCASS informed me "this is good for the hobby" (I guess they like a little controversy). Anyway, alls well that ends well.

I used him one time a few years ago. I was satisfied on the parts and service. He was recommended by another pontiacker.