Option Question
 

did any judges have vinyl tops

YES, rare & undesirable......... to most.

in pricing & value a non vinyl top will be worth more & more people will want it.

MOST judges with the vinyl tops are often considered fakes but so are most non regular colored judges aswell.

Thanks

have a triple black ram ir 4 car sitting in the weeds 5 mile from my house

triple black Judge would be a cool thing in my opinion, about the only way you could get away with a vinyl top on a Judge and still retain absolute value. Vinyl top does knock some $$ off a traditional color car. Lately I don't seem to mind looking at black vinyl top on a Carousel Red 69, especially an automatic car... getting old maybe? I've heard of a White 69 Judge with automatic and Green vinyl top and Green interior. I've seen pics of a Goldenrod Yellow 69 Judge with black vinyl top which looks good.

Here are a couple of Judges with Vinyl Tops. I for one love Judges with Vinyl Tops and am looking for any colored 69 Judge with a Vinyl Top

About ten years ago at a car show in Springfield Missouri I saw a Carousel
Red Hardtop Judge with parchment interior and black vinyl top. It was a true Judge
and was built that way from the factory. To me. the combo was gorgeous. It had a crowd around it all day.

What about two tone paint for judges? I've seen a few of the vinyl top ones, but can't remember ever seeing a two tone car except mine. By the way, my name is Erik and this is my first post. I have been lying in the weeds for years happily taking everyones free advice which I thank you all very much for.

You may be better off in the weeds than on this forum but glad you made it anyway, Eric. What color is yours and is it a 71? I've also got a friend who owns a 'two-tone' Judge , but his is Cardinal Red top and bottom, with the chrome trim in between, a factory goof or somebody liked that chrome trim but not two different colors.

Yes, mine is a 71 that is tropical lime on the bottom with a white painted top. There seem to be a couple of other odd things about the car. All 71's were supposed to have blacked out grills but mine doesn't. They all came with 12 bolt rear ends but mine is a 10 bolt posi. It also has an auto on the column. I have owned the car for 20 years and have talked to the previous owners and none of them changed the rear end or the front grills. The second owner hated the white top and had it painted green. The third owner was the one who replaced the original engine and transmission, but I was able to find a 71 455ho service replacement block and a close to correct transmission.

Welcome to the Board Eric,

You HAVE to post a picture or at least send me one via E-Mail. I absolutely LOVE Tropical Lime 71 GTO's, and I have never seen a Judge in that color, then you add the white painted top, heck that is the icing on the cake in my book. I would really love to see what it looks like. Thanks for your input.

Erik,

Welcome to the board, I also have a 71 Judge that i dont believe ever had the grills blacked out. I cant be as certain as you since i dont have the history from each owner but i do have pics of the car from about 78 and in the pics there are several things that didnt quite make sense, the grills aren't blacked out, the scoop inserts are not blacked out, and strangest of all the drivers side rear quarter stripe is backwards, it's a stripe from the right side on the left. all of these things were still this way when i bought it, the stripe was still this way and the stripe was every bit as old as the stripes on the rest of the car. I dont plan on recreating this but it is an interesting part of the car. Must have been a friday afternoon car :D

I've try and post a picture. The only ones that I have are the ones with the body separated from the frame before I took it to the body shop. (I still don't have it back) I tried to upload pictures, but it said that the files types were too large. Do you know how to make the pictures smaller? It would be interesting to know on what day our cars were made. I have heard of some oddities that came across the assembly line back in the day.

Rust issues aside, I would pay more for a vinyl top Judge! The top, if in the right color combo, adds character to the cars IMO.

send the pictures to me and i'll post them for you

[email protected]

Kayser where is the IV car???????????

Where do you live?........ I love taking rides in the country!;)

With my trailer!

My '69 Judge is Carousel Red with Black vinyl roof. It's on the PHS. In fact that's my car in the picture earlier in this thread. Taken back in 1988.

sorry owner ask me not to give out location,too many vultures out there,lol

were soaring the skies already

A good friend of mine from Austin, MN at one time owned two two-tone Judges. One was a Cardinal Red w/white top '70. The second was a Lucerne Blue w/white top '71.

Red Judges with Vinyl Tops
 

Found a couple more pictures I got somewhere of red Judges with Vinyl tops

well owner let me take a real close look at the car and the motor,numbers matching but only a ram3 in wolfs clothing,seems the hood was repainted some time ago and they put the 4 decals on it

and he wouldnt let me take any pics because he want it to be left alone and not be hounded about it

i can respect him for that,i just want it out of the weeds,i even offered free storage to get it out of the weeds

Did the original color of the vinyl tops appear on the cowl data tag? I looked at a 69 yesterday with a black vinyl top. The vinyl top was noted on the PHS as an option that was ordered with the car. On the cowl tag, the paint code was 40 (Mayfair maize) and the trim code was 268 (black). There was a B to the right of the paint code, but I thought the code for black vinyl top was "2"? Can someone please help me?

sawyer, I have seen one other 69 this way...it had a green top and the trim tag was coded with a letter, 'G'. The build sheet showed the correct '9'. This particular car was a Freemont built car.

FWIW, 69 Firebirds are coded this way, A=White, B=Black etc. BUT, I have also seen 69 Firebirds with number codes...all Cally built cars. :noidea:

Hope this helps. Mike

On the PHS paper work for a H.T. model there is always a number that tells you that there was a vinyl top on the car in the color box, and then on the Trim Tag that Vinyl top code is a Letter. The actual vehicle color is the opposite where on the PHS the vehicles color code is a Letter in the color box, and on the Trim Tag the vehicles color is a number. Again this is on a 69 H.T. model as I am not sure about other years. Pontiac wanted to make us confused that is for sure.

So that car you looked at did come with a Black Vinyl Top from the factory with the given codes you gave.

Hope this helps alittle as this is the short version

What PHS paperwork are you referring to that would contain the vinyl top number code? I saw the PHS (invoice) for this car and did not see a color code on it. The invoice listed the vinyl top option but I did not see a space for color (code 2-black). There were other documents attached to the invoice which had certain sections highlighted which included vinyl top code 2. I was wondering what PHS would be looking at to determine the original vinyl top color, as I could not find it on the invoice and obviously the build sheet, if any, would be with the car and not at PHS.

The trim tag on my '69 Judge shows 72 B for paint code. (Carousel Red with Black vinyl roof)

UPC, where was your car built?

Mike

Arlington.

Hi Sawyer,

I have attatched a picture of a PHS from a 69 GTO with a Vinyl Top. If you look on the top row just Right of the vehicle Vin you will see D5. That is the color box I was refering to in my above post. Here this is Warwick Blue with a Parchment Vinyl Top 69 GTO. I wish I had a picture of the Trim Tag so I could include that as well but I do not. If you would like I can post another GTO both the PHS and the Trim Tag so you can see the difference when I get home from work tonight.

In '69, Fisher Body changed the way they indicated exterior color and top colors. Instead of a letter for the paint color and a numeral for a fabric top (Cordova or convertible) they switched the order to a numeral/letter. All Fisher plants except for the Pontiac plant that is, which continued to use the letter/numeral order into 1969. By '70, all plants were using the numeral/letter system.

PHS paperwork is PMD-based, and not driven by the Fisher Body system of identification. '69 was a transition year for color codes. This is why most reference works will list both the letter and numeral codes for 1969.

Here's the PHS for a '69 GTO with two-tone paint. Paint code is on this car is 'PC'.
Palladium Silver with Cameo White painted roof.

http://www.weedengraphics.com/images/b/69SilverPHS.jpg

Very Cool UPC WU2. I was going to mention about the painted tops but forgot. That would be a neat combo Silver/White painted top and something I have never seen.

UPC- where was your car from(sold) originally? I had a Carousel Red/Black vinyl top Judge in mid '70s.

Guys-thanks for all the info. You are a wealth of information. I was confused, but now understand that on the 69 I looked at the paint codes were letters on the PHS and numbers on the cowl tag and vinyl top colors were numbers on the PHS and letters on the cowl tag.

Bob, my Judge was sold new in Janesville, Wisconsin in April '69. It has been in this area it's whole life, within 25 miles.

Years ago...
 

I walked away from a Carousel Red auto/air car because it had a black vinyl top...for $2400! Broke up the lines, in my opinion. There was a Cardinal Red/ white paintedto Judge on the circuit a few years back. I last saw it in Kansas at the '88 'Nats. Neat car. BTW...the blue/white cars look killer!

If I ever find that Liberty Blue Judge, my next goal is to find a Carousel Red Judge with a Black or White Vinyl Top as I absolutely Love them with the Vinyl Tops. Been thinking about changing my name to Vinyl Top Lover LOL.

I think you should put a Mopar Mod Top on your Judge

Here is a picture of our Orbit Orange Ram Air III Canadian built Judge. It has alot of options, PS,PB,PW,PDL,PDS,Tilt,8 Track,Trunk Release,HD Frame,and more. 1st at 2005 Seattle International Roadster Show, and 1st at 2005 POCI western Regionals, Bass Lake CA. We love the car, drive it, and feel very lucky to own it!!!

WOW, that car is absolutely Beautiful. I love that car with the Vinyl Top as it looks sharp. Thanks for posting.

I have a 69 Verdoro Green Judge with black vinyl top that I originally ordered from the factory. I saw that color combination in the showroom on a GTO and liked it better than the standard judge color.

Wow, I'd like to see that!

I'd love to but car is currently undergoing restoration, getting it back to how it looked the first day I got it. I will post pictures as soon as body is complete, hopefully in couple of months.