I need some info, quickly please . . .
 

Hey guys:

I've been on the phone with Dave @ ECS, need to order an emission label and a door compliance VIN label for my Sundance GTO for the POCI 'nats.

Dave has the emissions labels done, thanks NJSteve!

My problem is that I need the GVW info for the door compliance label (the blue sticker on the rear edge of the driver's door).

I'd like info from as many '72 HO GTO's and '72 HO LeMans hardtops as possible.
Since different plants may have used slightly different formats, I'd prefer info from the Pontiac plant where mine was assembled.
I'm hoping that the weight info is all the same (excepting the VIN and date of course).
Dave did tell me that the rear weight format seems to differ quite a bit.

Here is what Dave has asked me for, besides the VIN and production date:

GVWR ______

GAWR FRONT ______

on the rear weight, the format could be any of the following:

GAWR RR ______

or

RR ______

or

REAR ______

Please - let me know what assembly Plant your info comes from, and which transmission it has as well. Also, is it an A/C equipped car?
Once again, my car is a Pontiac Plant, M22 and A/C car, and was built in January, 1972.

Thanks in advance for your help. I'm trying to get this label done and in my hands before I leave for the 'nats on the 11th. Nothing like waiting 'til the last second!:doh:

And here I thought I could help.....

December built, Pontiac Plant, WHY is it HAND WRITTEN????

Thanks for trying, Chris. I appreciate the effort!
Maybe the typewriter at the assy plant was broken the day your car was built? WEIRD!

Interestingly, my car is a 12C (IIRC) body tag date, but according to the "manifest" was assembled January 3, 1972.

If I understood Steve correctly when I spoke with him yesterday, it may be that only cars assembled after January 1, 1972 were required to have the weights on the compliance label.

Need the info guys - PLEASE help.

I'm tryin'
 

Hope these help -- it was problematic tryin' to get a good close-up. The GVW is 5194.
cm

Oh, yeah, I forgot to add it's a Pontiac-built convertible.
cm

Those pics help, Chuck. I appreciate them.

Still need correct GVW's for a hardtop, though.
Heck - any endura hardtop car should be correct.

Come on, guys, help me out here.

TIA.

Lloyd,
Do you have a build sheet for any of your 72's?
I know on my 72 TA the GVW's front & rear are listed on my build sheet.
HTH,

Mine is 12C too, but the billing history is much later.

Keep in mind, that's 35 y.o. paint right there, but what's that undercoating like stuff next to interior panel?:confused:

Great thought, Steve.

But . . . all I have is a document titled "1972 MANIFEST - THRU REFINISH".
Lots of great info, much of it like a build sheet, but no GVW's that I can decipher.:(

Where is the build sheet on a 72?

Lloyd,

On my 72 455 HO Hardtop with A/C and M22:

GVWR: 5170

GAWR Front: 2640

RR: 2520


This is NOT a Pontiac plant, mine was built in Freemont, so not your exact specs, but close.

Pat

Hey Pat - THANKS!
You've come through for me once again.

Even though the format might be different at the Pontiac plant, the GVW info for your LeMans and my car should be identical, both being M22 & A/C cars.

Glad to be able to help Lloyd. And, Glad they are still legible. Are you getting this sticker reproduced? I need a couple for my other 72's. Who are you using? I'll try and call you sometime soon too.
Pat

Dave @ ECS is doing the correct GM door compliance labels. In fact, he just got permission and license to reproduce ALL of the GM labels, from whenever to current model years!

Dave is SUPER nice, and with this info I'll get my compliance label before I leave for the POCI convention.

Dave can be reached at (636) 207-7767.

Lloyd -
That's cool about the reproduction labels. As you can see from my pics, mine is in really poor shape.
cm

Its about time you made yourself usefull Pat ;) I kept checking in and wondering when you were going to end the suspense...lol

T/A

Well, it appears that the GVW info I "choose" is gonna be an educated guess.

I have two good responses so far:

Pat's HO M22 A/C LeMans, posted above.

And, from a M22 non-A/C WW5 GTO:
GVWR: 5183
GAWR FRONT: 2659
RR: 2524

?????

Non AC is heavier?? hmm those "beefed up WW5's" sure do weigh a lot. However, my Lemans has everything a WW5 GTO has, so I wonder why the weight descrepecies? probably the amount of Gas in the tank? Weird.

Hell, just pick a number Lloyd :) !

I was outta town all last week and couldn't get to a puter. Talk about withdrawal :).

You need to get into this fitness gig up there in DSM T. Phoenix FD put on a Sweeeeet fitness symposium at the luxurious Biltmore resort. Dang pop costs 5 bucks there! pretty proud of their sheeesh.

When you coming into town?
I'll call you later too.
:)
Pat

Yep, weird, huh?
Here's the list of options on the WW5 that I posted the GVW numbers from:

Cordova top
Radio AM
Console
Grds-Dr edge
Cust trim
Lamp
GTO option
Tape Stereo 8
Mldgs-whl
WW5
Lamp-luggage
Glass S/R-AL

Certainly nothing to add enough weight to the car to be heavier than your A/C equipped HO LeMans!

BTW, I've forgotten, is your HO LeMans Y99 suspension equipped?
If so, methinks I'll be using your numbers. your A/C car ought to be closer to my car than just about any other that I've seen yet.

Yup, Y99 equipped. Has all the WW5 options on it...and then some! :) Mine is an AM/FM stereo too..thought those weighed more? hmmm...

`72 vin label
 

This is my 72 h/o convert. may not help you , just thought I would show just in case.... the frt. is 2650, kinda hard to read

Thanks, Forrest.

Interesting that your HO 'vert is rated only about 75-80# heavier than Pat's HT.
Is yours an M22 or M40 car? With or without A/C?

I sure appreciate all the replies, just wish I could reach Dave now, been trying since yesterday AM with no luck.:fear:

Need to order this stuff ASAP, since I'm leaving for Tulsa next Wednesday AM. If the whole danged event doesn't get flooded out, that is!:mad:

Great news - Dave called me back this afternoon and my labels will be on the way shortly. Just in time for the 'nats.

Thanks to everyone for posting/sending your compliance label pics and info.

Since Pat's LeMans is most closely optioned to my car, I chose his GVW numbers, though I had to guess on the F-R numbers since the F+R weights should add up exactly to the GVWR. I chose 2640# front and 2530# rear.

Lloyd,

Usually the GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) does not change because of options that may or may not be on the car unless HD Suspension, Towing Package or some other option that may add to the RATING of the car. The options on a car only decrease the AVAILABLE weight that can be put in the car.
Example: The rating of the vehicle is 5200#. The actual weight of the car is 3900#. Add the driver of 200 you end up with 4100#. The maximum load is now only 900#.

Y99, or in my case Y96 suspension, endura nose, air conditioning adds weight but does not usually affect the maximum rating of the vehicle.

Do not mix the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating and Shipping Weight/Curb Weight/Actual Scale Weight with out driver. I deal with commercial vehicles all the time and this confusion exists there also. Hope this helps.

I totally agree with you, Jack.

I have no explanation as to why, but I've now seen about 6 or 7 '72 A-body compliance labels, and EACH AND EVERY single one has unique GVWR, GAWR front and rear numbers.

If I can get a word in edgewise, I'm gonna pose this very question to John Sawruk at the convention.

?????

Compliance labels
 

Hi Lloyd, I just saw your post now. If you have a few days I can get over to my building and snap a few pics of the lucy blue WW-5 4 speed hardtop label for you. Emial me directly if you need it. Thanks!

Hey LLoyd, my `72 has a/c and is auto, also has the endura/gt option, glad it all worked out for you!

I appreciate the offer, Jeff, but . . . Sparks beat you to it, LOL!

Wouldn't the different available tire sizes have an effect on GVWR? :noidea: It would be interesting to note what the factory tire size was on each of these cars.

My WW5 came with G60-15's which I would think would have a different MAX. rating than a G/F70-14. Could this be the variances that we are seeing between seemingly similar cars? Just a thought...

Mike

You are right. I forgot that the tire size would change the rating because the tire itself has a rating on it. The following would change the rating. (GVWR)
1. Tire size
2. Optional heavy duty suspension (which usually means stouter springs)
3. Towing package (again stouter springs)
4. Sport/special handling (again stouter springs)
5. Air shocks

However, all things being equal and one has a 4 speed and the other an automatic or one has a 400 and the other a 455 would make no difference in what the car is rated at. It would however change the load available because the weight of the car changed. Same for air vs non air. It just makes the curb weight more but does not alter the rating for the car.

Typically old station wagons had a greater rating than a sedan or ht because of the larger tires and heaver duty springs.

REVIVE OH GREAT THREAD!

Found this info.....under the model, the W/W62 means with GTO option and the D/W62 is delete GTO option? Am I reading that right?

Lloyd's old thread - very informative. Speaking of which, where has he been hiding lately? I hope he's doing ok ...

(Pat - no hijacking intended)

I was thinking the same thing - I'll have to give him a call.

I called yesterday to check up on him. He's was doing fine, but said he was sick through the holidays and still trying to dig out.

Call and give him h_ll.

on the F-bodies, we found the weights were not added to the conformance label until mid-December of '71 for the '72 model year cars. Wondering if there was a similar mid-year change over on the A-bodies? I noticed the revision date on the GTO labels that Pat posted is 10-20-71 so that leads me to believe there may have been early '72's with the old label that contained only VIN and month-year of build.