Pwr.Steering Box Change
 

I've been gathering up parts to replace the POS Cardone quick ratio box I got a few years ago. Gathered up the following parts.

Pwr.Steering gear box from a 1995 Jeep Cherokee-$46.19
Rag joint from a 1985 Chevy 2 WD Pickup-$11.77
Power steering pump flow control valve from a 1980's chevy Pickup-Free
All I need now is to get my pressure hose changed to metric or have a new one made.
I'll be glad to get rid of that 18 point "U" turn Cardone box.

Where did you get that box for that price?

Or is it a junkyard score and you restored it?

Parts
 

Webfoot,
I got the parts from Pick Your Part and Pick N' Pull in the Oakland area. Skinned a few knuckles on the gear box getting it off. There a quite a few to choose from, I got the newest stuff I could find.

Nice score, I've heard the jeep boxes are an all around better unit, aside from the faster ratio the steering feels much nicer. I would like to step up to one but most all the vehicles around here got scrapped last year.

Jeep gear
 

Webfoot,
I saw another box yesterday while getting my rag joint. It's on a 1993 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the engine removed, the steering box was unbolted from the frame but still attached by the center link and pitman arm, would be easy to take off. It had an MN code stamped on the end cap. The Cherokee had about 256,000 miles on it. I don't think it would be cost effective for me to pull it off and send it to you (They are heavy) but if you are desperate I would help you out.

Good job. this is a nice upgrade. I vote for new hoses. I did one new and the other used conversion fittings. Should have gone new with both, it's cleaner and fewer connections mean less chance for a leak. I love the feel of the new steering.

Yeah, those would be spendy to ship! If I ever feel like another project I'll probably try to find another one local. What are the best years to snag these from?

Save this
 

Webfoot, save this link it has a lot of good information on what is required.
Read all 3 articles.
Jeep Grand Cherokee 1992-1996.
I've checked and the ones listed by the AL code seem to have a 2.2 turns, the one I got has just a little over 3 turns but has the correct amount of turn radius. Check out the spread sheet for info. on other sources but if you have an "A" body get one with at least 43.5* travel, each direction about 87* total full left to right.


http://www.chevelles.com/techref/ftecref29.html

Guys,
Take a look at Craigslist for dudes parting out cherokees. I see this every couple of weeks: Cherokees being parted out. These guys are more than happy to get something like 25 bucks for the PS box, at least around here (CT). I got a nice box with the pump for 20 dollars. And the guy took it out for me. Couldn't use the pump, but jeez, what a deal.

Were is the code stamped on the box, I have a newer Z28 box but I don't see a code on it?

It's on the bid circular endcap.l Unfortunately it's inked on, so a lot of times it's nearly impossible or flat out impossible to read .

Ok if this jeep steering box is so good with 3 turns lock to lock then why is it that you can get a rebuilt steering box from Year-One with 3 turns lock to lock that is a direct bolt in with no adapters for $139? I may be missing something but I don't know. I'd rather have a stock type steering box with the same steering turns.

$$$$$$$$$$$$
 

What you are missing is the cost and some other things.
Year One box is $139.00 + $100.00 core charge + shipping 2 directions and the tax.
Also who did the rebuild? If it was Power Steering Services Inc. I would do it in a second.
It has been my experience the most of the re-builders make a one box fits all which doesn't work.
I purchased a rebuilt box that was done by Cardone, the turning radius sucks. As per the email they sent me they build them with a total turning radius of 60 degrees which is OK for maybe a firebird, but sure has hell not a 67 GTO which need the full 87 Degrees. Yet they list the box for both GTO's and Firebirds.
I'm not using adapters, just having metric fitting put on my original hose so the total cost of this swap will be about $70-$75.00. It's an easy cheap upgrade.

Code
 

hobbygto65
Look at the second photo of the Car Craft article, it shows where the code is inked on and is a very good tech article on a steering upgrade.
The box I got out of the 95 Jeep Cherokee still had the code on it and was very clear.


http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...ade/index.html

nu ideas 4 my 65 project!
 

I'm Glad i stumbled upon this article today as i continusly collect info for doing my 65 project.I've been years preparing to build this car and with much of the info/parts i've aquired....i hope to reduce a lot of headaches during the build and to also gain some of those modern touches that will enhance the car and make it a joy to drive. You guys make it so great to be a part of this forum!

Change of plans
 

I was planing on getting a new pressure hose or have the fittings changed to metric but the shop I went to today was just trying to cobble some pieces together so I left.
I called Lee Manufacturing Co. down in Sun Valley Ca. and ordered the two inserts that get inserted into the ports/adapt metric to a double flare so I can use my original hoses.

Very nice folks to deal with and very inexpensive + 2 day delivery.

WhereOWhere
 

Bill,is there a website for Lee Manufacturing? I tried google,but just came up with some generic links that don't seem to actually lead to what may be the correct source i'm looking for.I kinda wanted to look over some of these adapter fittings as i'd like to figure if i'd like to adapt or just re-fit hoses. Any info/links would be nice.Thanks,DeWayne

Lee Mfg. Co.
 

Here is their number, Tom's wife usually answers quickly and very nice to do business with.

818-768-0371
I don't know of a good Web Site.

Tom makes these adapters and if he says they will work with the original hoses I believe it, he is very well respected in the power steering world. Attached photos from Car Craft Article. The inserts are $4.00 each plus tool to install.

appreciate
 

Thanks Bill.This could helpa lot with the decision of the steering options for my 65 project.

65?
 

dracowizard,
If you are working on a 65 be sure to read the other steering coupling/shaft requirements here,
http://www.chevelles.com/techref/ftecref29.html.

You may not want to alter your steering shaft as required for 64,65,66.

If you have the $$ and time talk to these guys that do a super re-build so I've been told.

http://www.powersteering.com/

nice....thanks again
 

Thanks for the links and the heads up.I'll have to study up on this required shaft change you speak of.This is very helpful as i've had this car waiting in the shawdows for 7+yrs now as i finally have a garage i've built to do a frame off and mod.It's finding sources like this that i hope will help me reduce/overcome proibs as i do the build which is getting closer every day,well the start day anyway....:)

ut-o....nowwhat
 

Interesting change from what i read.....dosen'tseem too difficult to modify if i read correctly....or in my case,if i COMPREHEND correctly,LOL.I was curious though about if i was to experience anything like this during a box switch,would it be a good option to adapt a flex/u-joint like seen on many rod applications. I'm thinking the rag joint helps retain a stock look and maybe absorbs a lil shock,otherwise i could not be sure of any disavantage if i was to try and use a flex/u-joint setup.

I have a Flaming River joint on my Scout in place of the OEM rag joint. Steering response is of course excellent. Noise through the joint from the gear box sent into the cab, resonating the steering wheel that is sent through the joint, can be horrible. For my big nasty truck, a few more rattles and buzzing is not a problem, though if my GTO made the racket I get from the joint I'd be mighty unhappy.

Supposedly the rubber in the rag joint is also a safety feature in old cars, designed to tear as your sternum impacts the steering wheel in a collision. This seems a bit far fetched, though I've read it a few times online...

Lastly, at least on my '66, the metal coupler is pressed onto my steering column rod where it meets the rag joint, and I'm not sure it could a) be easily removed, or b) that it would accept a joint on its (I assume) threads, as I see no threads protruding from the joint and wonder if it's just a compression fit or staked in place??? Your cars may be different, of course. Just some thoughts...

Appreciate....
 

Thanks for the input Socrates. I felt using the u-joint may be somewhat of a disavantage and it's nice to recieve info from someone who has experienced so as to make a comparision. However i have been fortunate to review the following link
--> http://www.chevelles.com/techref/ftecref29.html which was supplied by Bill and it's very informative. It explained all items needed to make a good switch to a 12/1 ratio and gives a good breakdown of diff column types and how to adapt to them.What i've read fits what i've seen as i have a diff column in my 65 than the type i've got that i pulled from a 66 GTO. The 65 has a totally removable rag joint and the 66 has a fixed flange. The article gives good detail how to mod each for a steer upgrade.While i may actually use a rag joint after obtaining this info,i;ll be extremely cautious which joint i'll choose after what happen to me when i would drive the car B4 parking it. I had noticed a lot of "slop"in the steering and gave most the credit to the steering box. What i found was the RAG JOINT was tearing! Would've not been long B4 it would've tore apart! Whew....missed a bullet that time!

F#C*i%g UPS
 

The UPS guy arrived today with the heavely padded envelope from Lee Mfg.Co that was supposed to have my inserts for my power steering box. Envelope was ripped in the center and taped over, checked inside and it was empty, gave it back to the UPS driver.
Called Lee Mfg and told them what happened, another set is on the way. Guess I'll have to wait a few more days to complete this swap.

Caution...it's UPS at the door!
 

Wow...thats the second time i've heard about very similiar circumstances. Another forum i am part of ( motorcycle type) had one of the members share his experience about a set of tire warmers he had bought from another rider.When the package arrived,he said only one of the warmers was in the package and a blue blouse! Someone had replaced the warmer and sealed things back up and sent it on....the weight was checked against the original to show there had been a switch in items. Sounds as though they're living up to their usual high standards.. :)

Special steering tool, 74 cents!
 

While waiting for my parts from Lee Mfg. to be delivered today I decided to install new pitman shaft seals in my jeep box before putting it in the car. I couldn't find the correct tool to tap the seals in place so I purchased two 1" Sch. 40 pvc couplings and used those.
They have just the correct inside and outside diameters and worked great.
Hope UPS doesn't show up with another empty envelope today.

You gotta wonder how a postman was able to determine what they were for... maybe someone on the board?:noidea:

nice tool......uh,i mean....cheap tool!
 

Good tip Bill.....i'll have to copy that idea and put it in my Tips/Tools& Ideas folder!

Love my Jeep PS BOX
 

Got the inserts from Lee Mfg. yesterday,put the jeep box in my GTO today and love it, great road feel, kind of firm and best of all I can make complete left and right hand turns and U turns. That Piece of SH*T cardone box is stashed in the corner to use as a core or a boat anchor.
Picture of the inserts below.

I will admit I did screw up when I first attached the pitman arm, I had a mark on the input shaft and pitman shaft were I thought center was, I should of used 2 marks. On the first test run car would turn to far left and very little to the right. Pulled it back to the driveway and discovered while installing the box I turned it one turn out of whack. Put it back together, one happy GTO driver here!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nice..
 

Thanks for sharing Bill.Seeing what you've done helps me as i dwell over what i'll be able to do with my 65project when the time comes(hopefully getting closer all the time).One of my hugh concerns will be getting the steering correctly centered.This being unchartered territory has me trying to learn as much as i can to reduced problems when i do get around to working on it.

Is there a manual steering option on these jeeps as well?

Don't think it will work
 

The only jeep vehicles I could find with a manual gear from the 90's is the wrangler and there is no way that would work.
I'm sure there are some quick ratio manual boxes out there for sale by vendors, who knows??

Pic is of a manual jeep box for Wrangler.

man that looks alot like a 69 bird manual box to me

What do you guys use or recommend for a power steering pitman arm in a 1964 to 1967 GTO when converting from manual steering and using the Jeep GC power steering gear box?

Thanks

Thanks for the info guys!!! My dad's 67 I'm building has a leak in the box and the pump whines and boils over. I'm gonna do the jeep box and a new pump. How much is knowledge worth? Thanks Again!

I spent 49 bucks on a 97' JGC box, 15 bucks on fittings from Leff MFG, 22 bucks for a rag joint from autozone and I bought a PS pitman arm from Bob Vidan on here for 45 bucks and i was in business. El-Cheapo 12:1 Power steering. Its a great, inexpensive, bolt in upgrade. I have a thread on this too I think.

Just thought I would add some references that I have saved over the last year of trying to understand the gear box swap.

http://oldsjunction.classicoldsmobil...r.htm#Steering
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...e/viewall.html
http://lee-powersteering.com/index.htm
http://jimshea.corvettefaq.com/?cat=5
http://classicoldsmobile.com/forums/...ap-w-pics.html

Thanks for the links guys!

69 Firebird, want to do the same, have the box, have the inserts but number is rag joint from AZ. Thanks Mark

I'm doing the Jeep steering box conversion. I bought a pump for a '77 K-Series truck to get the control valve. It looks identical to mine. Do they look different at all? I'm just wondering if the rebuilt ones are different then the factory ones.
Thanks

Relief
 

Sent you a PM today.
The parts look the same on the exterior but the big difference is that the internal relief spring inside the flow control valve itself from the K truck is set for 1400 PSI while an original GTO flow control relief is set at about 900 PSI.

PSI question
 

Don't wanna hi-jack the thread,but reading this thread has me curious about my own choice to use a quicker ratio box.I've aquired a box from a 97 jeep and knowing it's a faster ratio i'm curious if i need to choose a steering pump that'll better serve the quicker box.

To take full advantage of the swap, you will want the higher pressure valve. check out this link and scroll down to this title.

POWER STEERING PUMP – PRESSURES AND FLOWS

http://www.chevelles.com/techref/ftecref29.html

Thx for the help guys. I'm just hoping the remanufactured pumps for the K series trucks are actually getting the 1400 psi valve. The remanufactured pumps are built by cardone. I guess I'll know when I drive it?

It is OK
 

I'm sure that Cardone used the correct parts. According to Jim Shea, GM switched from the 900-950 PSI to the 1400 PSI in 1970, it will be fine.

I am doing this swap and have gathered my parts and cannot figure out how the flow control valve is installed. I did not have to remove the itmes so I did not get a chance to see where it came from. I know its a simple install, I'm just not smart enough to figure it out. So what is the proper install procedure for the flow control valve?

Thanks Bill!

If you look on the links that are listed earlier in this thread you will see a diagram of the control valve/spring detail. You take out the high pressure line fitting from the back of your pump and it's behind it.

Thanks
 

Appreciate this info a lot.Very good to help me complete my setup for the results i want.I first read Jims info of which box to choose and failed to follow up on matching to a correct ps pump.Thanks