65 Star Chief heater controls help
 

Okay, so I bought this extremely clean 65 Star Chief for a little more than a tank of gas and I'm in the process of restoring it. One issue I'm having is the heater controls. The switches are labeled "off" "normal" "rear" and "deice". The heater box looks new, but most everything else on this car does too, so that doesn't hold much water at this point. At any rate, I can't see any possible way for there to be rear heat in this car, is there a way to tell if it did and someone swapped the heater box with one that doesn't or if the controls were swapped in from a car that did and this one didn't ever? The other thing I've noticed is each setting has its own fan speed settings regardless of what the knob says. This can't be normal, so I guess I need a better understanding of how this switch should operate and possibly vacuum/wiring schematics.

Thanks,
Rob

No heat to the rear passengers feet. Deice is the front windshield only. Unless you have the optional rear defrost. Then you would see a vent in the package tray.
Left knob is for direction of air and the right knob is how much cold air is let into the system. Hope this helps.
You can buy owners manuals on ebay. Also check local swap meets.

patrick

If you can post a Pic we can tell you if it is the right one or not.

The "REAR" setting simply increases fan speed to better get heat to the back of the car.

Post pics of said Chief if you can...oh and welcome to the PY board, regamble!!

Wow, after 2 days of serching for answers and coming up empty handed you all have answered my questions in less than an hour. Very impressive, and thank you all very much.

So the "rear" setting should change the speed settings of my fan motor? If so then my unit is now functioning close to correct. Some vacuum lines were swapped on the controller. However, my controller does have a vacuum leak internally. Are these serviceable?

One more question, does anyone know where to get a TH400 Kickdown Switch? Mine is mounted to the carburetor and I'm having a hard time finding a good replacement. B&M has one but I really don't like the looks of it.

Pics to follow momentarily.

Thanks,
Rob

Star Chief pics
 

Here's a couple of pics of her.

Looks like a normal setup to me. De-ice upps the fan speed over hi to make it blow to the back. Everything works basicaly by cables and a couple of switches.

Pontiac used that same 4 button (non A/C) heater design from 1963-1965.

cool car. drive it and enjoy. I would. :)

patrick

Yep, I agree with Patrick.... looks great! Drive it and enjoy it. I may have an extra control unit you can have for shipping.

Welcome to the board and thanks for posting pics... we always like pictures!!

Ron

Excellent, thank you. Yeah, the plan is to just make a nice driver out of it. The seats are going to need covered soon since they are original, I have my fabric supplier looking for matching materials now. This is my third pontiac, one was an 82 Firebird and the other was a 68 Bonneville. This one I intend to keep though. So, since I run a full restoration shop, this will be my new project for a while. Correct paint is on order and since there is zero rust and bodywork to do it'll be pretty easy to have a very original ride soon.

64catdroptop, I'll keep that in mind, thank you very much. I'm going to see if I can service mine and seal it up so that it operates correctly but if I can't I'll be getting a hold of you.

Next week I'm pulling the clock and the factory radio to get them operational again and install seat belts in the rear since I want this to be a good family ride for my kids as well. The rear seat belts and an HEI are the only mods I plan on making at this point, even going to keep and run the original hub caps and Rochester 2jet that my son is tearing down right now just because I love their nostalgic look.

Can someone tell me if quarter panel trim is available? I'm missing the right side rear trim piece, otherwise it's all there and has buffed to a nice luster.

On my 63s the 'rear' setting directs to the floor and the front seat actually has a raised area above the tunnel to alow heater air to get to back seat floor area.

Its my believe the unions (or some other reason) forced the hiring of a whole platoons of engineers in the 60s for whom there was no real need. The companies put them all to work designing outlandish Rube Goldberg contraptions to control heaters. The only restriction was if the control only needed a simple switch or lever to function flawlessly for the next 40 years then the designers instead should design something that would use 40 ft of vacuum line, troublesome vacuum servos, complicated electro-mechanical devices, jam prone goofy controls and confusing labling .

Haha, that sounds about like my summise of the situation. Instead of having an engineer overseeing 5 engineers working together, you get 5 engineers in different cities all working on their own part of the project and one poor engineer that has to put it all together. And the '60s was a very competative time in automotive history, everyone had to have the newest latest gretest gadgets. I've got 6 cars from the '60s here right now and every one of them is like that.

The quarter panel trim is not available except used

check with Steve @ www.indianapontiacs.com for the needed trim.

patrick

FYI, in case you're not aware of clock repair.... 99% of the time, all the clock needs is a good cleaning (I use brake cleaner) and a good lub like WD40 or Tri-Lube and it'll work from now until h3ll freezes over. I cringe every time I see someone spending $80 on a new quarzt clock repair kit when a clean and lub is all it needs.

-r-

Heater Control Repair resource...
 

regamble,

Not sure if you are a member of POCI (poci.org) but I found this in their monthly magazine, Smoke Signals:

'65-'66 Full Size Heater Control repair: Don Monroe 253 566 8488.

I have no vested interest and I have not used his services...just wanted to pass along what looks like a useful suggestion.

65-66 tranny kickdown switch
 

Tim Doonan of Odenville Alb has the needed parts, 1-205-381-1890 or [email protected]. I purchased one for my 66 Bonny and it works fine. Bryce

If the hoses for vacuum are not on the right ports, you will have a vacuum leak in most positions, the valve vents the diaphragms not selected to atmosphere.
(heater air inlet in off, and defrost diverter in any position but de-ice)

The fan should be off, low, medium, or high in normal I forget how it works in rear and de-ice, but there is a "speed boost switch" in the controller that I think works in rear and de-ice.

I'll copy the schematics and post them in the next few days.

Stellar information. I'll be needing some good contacts in the pontiac realm, and you all have provided me with some wonderful resources. I can't thank you enough.

LASJayhawk, I would appreciate those diagrams for sure. At this point I can get it ducting correctly but the fan speeds are all messed up and I still have a vacuum leak which leads me to believe that I have at least the vacuum lines incorrect if not other things as well.

Bryce, I'll be calling them promptly for a switch, thanks a ton. Seems to be a lacking in the market there. B&M have a pull style one that I would assume works flawlessly but I have to question why the would have redesigned everything involved rather than just recreate the original.

65WJ, I'll contact them soon for the quarter trim. I'm going to paint it in the next few months and I'll want that trim for reassmbly.

This should be the info you need.

Interesting top note that the only thing rear does is make sure the blower is at least medium.

If you can't print from the views in the forum pm me your e-mail and I will email them to you.

Printed and headed out to the shop with them in hand. That's absolutely perfect, thank you very much.

MIght have the trim, can you give me a measurement. Had some of the 4 door stuff but not the whole set can't remember what was saved and what went.

That would be great. It's 36"x3".

So, you ever get online looking for solutions only to find 300 other people with the same problem but nobody ever does a followup to say "Hey, this is what I found and it fixed my problem." Yeah, it irritates me too. So, to avoid being one of those guys, here's where I'm at with the heater controls.

Thank you so much for all your input, it's been invaluable. Using the diagrams that LASJayhawk posted I managed to get all of my vacuum lines and wires correctly installed. Everything is now working up to par with the exception of there is no difference in air diversion between "REAR" and "DE-ICE". I found that it's not switching the vacuum solenoid under the hood. If I get my son to manually move the solenoid it diverts to the dash vents perfectly. Next week I'll tear the controls apart and see what makes them tick and try to repair them.

On that note, I'll take lots of good pics and try to get them posted for everyone in case someone else can put them to use. If nothing else, it will be a photographic testament to my up-coming collossal failure. :)

Thanks to all again.

The rear/deice is the diaphragm on the heater box inside the car by the gas pedal, the one under the hood should be activated in all positions but off.

They are also available. I bought one recently. I think it was Old Air Prod. They have all the different ones in these cars. $50.

Mine doesn't actuate the underhood diaphram at all. This could be a problem.:D