Options and worst case scenario
 

My son and I are weighing our options with this engine that we bought and the issues with trying to get the thing installed. The whole issue is that the motor has the Edelbrock round port heads. We had no idea of the challenges that this would create when we bought the engine, otherwise I would have passed on the opportunity, no matter how good the deal was.
It appears that the proprietary manifolds required to install a round port engine in a '67 will never materialize (I'm told "another 4 weeks, another 4 weeks, another 4 weeks"...). The car is just not fun to drive as it sits, with a dog of a motor that's likely not worth trying to improve as it's old and tired. It's got no power and is unreliable. I can't go with headers without converting from column shift to a floor shift. I'm not keen on doing that, as it has a rare tilt column and I'd hate to alter that.
So I'm trying to determine if it's worth switching to D-ports. This engine is built like I've never seen and I don't know if the roller cam and valvetrain from the Performer RPM heads can be used on a new pair of Performer D-ports or similar heads from another vendor. I'll probably be stuck with the round ports sitting on a shelf as I see that they are not that popular right now. I just want a servile engine with cast iron manifolds.

Im using the app, so i might not be able to see all your info.

What chassis? A-body, B-body, F-Body?

What manifolds are you using now?

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1967 LeMans. I'm not using any manifolds as the engine is not in the car. The car presently has another 400 engine from a '74 Pontiac installed in it.

What company are you looking into? The company that keeps telling you they need more time?

What product are you waiting for from them?

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When I bought my 71 455 HO (round port) it was in a 66 Lemans column shift TH 400. Been a long time but I don't recall seeing any modifications done to make it fit. I know the F-body manifolds were still intact/uncut.

Should be able to find them used
Clay

Where are you getting these round port exh manifolds that fit the pre 68 A body’s?

I have Colunm shift with roundport Headers: just bend the vertical rod to be more behind the LH Head.

I wouldn' t think the fabrication to keep the column shift linkage for headers would be that extensive. Another option to look at is there are column shift cable conversions that may suit your needs. I have to say that headers are going to be your only true option for the time being sonce manifold options are out of production for an unpredictable amount of time.

https://www.ramairrestoration.com/po...oversized.html

I'd like to think that eventually they might show up, but I'm not holding my breath. Going into September and beyond, we'll be drving the car less and less and eventually it will sleep for the winter. So I may chill out for a while. But if they don't show up in 2021, I'll have to assume that they are not coming. I don't like being strung along.

Dougs are out of stock now, too. But I'll bet it won't be a long lead time for replenishment.
Like I said, I'm exploring any option, including just selling the whole damn motor. Or even getting ahold of a '68 and up A-body. These are the things going through my head. That engine sitting there just kills me right now.

Say that I wanted to install a temporary floor shift until I get the column shift/header/manifold thing straightened out. How much work would it be to throw a factory or aftermarket shifter in there? I'm thinking aftermarket, because that's usually a self contained unit. Can I just cut a nice neat hole that can be welded back up later?

Is that in a '67, though?
I actually do have a set of headers that came wth the engine. They're the Hooker Super Competition headers for this motor. The motor and those headers were in his '69 GTO.

https://butlerperformance.com/i-3085...ef=brand:99956

These things are monsters with their 2" primary's. I don't even know how he got them into his '69. Funny that they are over 1000.00US, About 1,300.00 to me. I put them up on Craigslist for a couple hundred bucks and didn't even get a bite.

Here are the instructions to a cable shifter for a column shift. Everything bolts on, no mods to the column. Add headers and it is done.

https://www.lokar.com/assets/instruc...iftLinkage.pdf

Dad runs the 2" super comp headers on his 69 GTO. They actually fit quite well and have decent ground clearance. I also never had to modify the linkage rod from the steering column. His is a factory floor shift but GM still used the linkage rod, starting in 69 to lock the column when the shifter is put in park, and to work the neutral safety switch. That linkage rod dropped right in with no mods at all and tons of room from the headers.

To the OP, I would call RA Resto and talk to them in detail about what the difference is between the ones your waiting on for the 67 and the 68 and up A body ones if they have those in stock.

Years ago I got around a long production delay / wait on a set of headers by by doing what I suggested .
All I had to do to run a set of headers that the company had in stock was to make a 1/4” steel plate shim to go under the motor mount frame brackets ( big washers would have also worked) and grind a 1/8” deep by 3/4” wide and tall U shape on the rear of the frame before the starter and on the passenger side also as I recall.

The 1/4” rise in height gave me no fan to shroud clearance issues or any other problems!
The whole process took me 3 hours and the next day by late afternoon the motor was back in the car and I drove it to get fresh fuel in it.

where are you getting that from? all the round ports i see for sale lately go pretty quick & for good prices. the round port heads are not available from edelbrock right now & because of that the used market is pretty good. if they are listed for a fair price based on their condition they should sell pretty quick.

but based on the comments above it looks like theres a couple options to retain the column shift.

I'll second that. Round ports are popular and always have been, even before the aftermarket aluminum heads showed up. I'd choose a set of round ports before D-ports.

The difference in '67 HO GTO manifolds & the '68 GTO HO-RA manifolds, is the position of the drivers side outlet. the outlet is slightly fwd on a '67. If anyone has a loose '67 drivers side manifold or an early repro, & they have a tape measure & can post a picture, can easily mention where to measure. Can even pull out some original round port manifolds & make comparative measurements.

As I mentioned in your previous thread '66Sprint6, I've personally examined the remedy to a similar problem, be it decades before Paul D came out with round port manifolds to fit in the '64-66 or '67 A-body frames.

I've thought a couple iof times about placing a, want to buy ad, here, in the performance section and the 67 leMans GTO section. A lot of folks the look at those areas, don't frequent the street section, here............

Hey guys I am going to work in earnest on some of the solutions that you mentioned. I've googled the heck out of this and it appears that I will have to do three things if I'm installing the Headers. Of course, if anyone can confirm it's always appreciated.
- relocate the brake line distributor block from the frame to up around the control arm
-at the very least, re&re the starter. Switching to the mini is beneficial.
-Something with the oil filter housing. I see that a gasket comes with the headers. So re&re or install an adapter to move it.

Pontiac had some engines where the oil filter tilted backward at an angle (toward the firewall, vs straight down.
That really helped with fitting some of the RA manifolds and Tube headers.

Tom V.

you may find using a Fram PH3675 instead of the PH25 will give you some much needed room. I recall on my F body once i put the scattershield on (which has both right and left starter bumps) i could NOT get the large 25 oilfilter OUT!!!! between the header and bellhousing. Some simple book work lead me to the 3675 :) Same 13/16-16 thread, gasket LOCATION (albeit a thinner gasket) but 7/8 smaller can OD.. 35 yrs ago BOOKS were awesome.

Why not just get a set of 'shorty' type headers made locally to suit what you have, or make a set yourself from a SBC weld it up kit but using Pontiac flanges? You could even fab a pair of log type headers similar to some of the turbo headers, if it makes them easier to fit in the car. Any of these options are likely to flow as well as any cast iron manifold.

Anything but a Fram filter....

Who needs books when you can get all the details quickly online:

The PH 25 is a cross to the WIX 51248 for a 1967 and up Pontiac V8

Height: 4.338(110)*
Outer Diameter Top: 3.66(93)*
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed:
Thread Size: 13/16-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: None
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=6/20
Burst Pressure-PSI: 345
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micron Rating: 21

The Ph3675 is a cross to the WIX 51522 - not designed for any Pontiac built V8

Height: 4.526(115)*
Outer Diameter Top: 2.921(74)*
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed:
Thread Size: 13/16-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: None
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=6/20
Burst Pressure-PSI: 290
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micron Rating: 21

WIX shows the correct filter for a '66 to be the WIX 51049

Height: 5.178(132)*
Outer Diameter Top: 3.66(93)*
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed:
Thread Size: 13/16-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: None
Beta Ratio: 2/20=6/20
Burst Pressure-PSI: 260
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micron Rating: 21

The WIX cross reference site gives you all the dimensions:

https://www.wixfilters.com/Lookup/FilterLookup.aspx

Just enter competitors filter # or enter year, make, model and click on "search"

That will take you to a page that shows all the wix cross.

Click on the part #

That will take you to a page with all the specs.

On that page, if you want to know engines that filter was designed for, click on "Applications".

That's how I learned that the PH3675 was designed for a few GM V8's and multiple different V6 engines:

PONTIAC BONNEVILLE 2004 - 2005 V8 4.6L 281 CID
PONTIAC G6 2007 - 2010 V6 3.5L 213 CID
PONTIAC G6 2006 - 2010 V6 3.9L 237 CID
PONTIAC LAURENTIAN (CANADIAN) 1981 - 1981 V8 5.0L 307 CID
PONTIAC LAURENTIAN (CANADIAN) 1981 - 1981 V8 5.7L 350 CID
PONTIAC MONTANA 2006 - 2006 V6 3.9L 237 CID
PONTIAC MONTANA SV6 2007 - 2008 V6 3.9
PONTIAC MONTANA SV6 2007 - 2009 V6 3.9L 237 CID

This is so much easier than looking up the info in books.

35 yrs ago......Al Gore had not created the internet yet....lol

simple hint that there is a 3" filter for a PONCHO motor....that is NOT LISTED per menu's and apps...INSTEAD of the 3 5/8 large can. This is called secret squirrel stuff

There are Doug's Headers for the car, and I even has a set of multi piece Indian Adventures headers to fit the chassis. Not sure how they are with column linkage but other options.

But you were recommending a Fram (orange can of death) filter.

I just showed you how to find a quality filter the same size on the internet, which does exist (and has for several years) today...;)