the story of my 1971 GTO
 

Hi, i'm new member of your forum. I'm from Switzerland and i have two goat. I did the presentation in the general thread.
In this section i will present the story from the last buy, the 71 GTO and i hope you can help me in the correct restoration..
I will say i'm very lucky: this car was sold in switzerland from the GM dealer and I am probably the second owner.
This are the picture from the first time have see the car in my country in 2014

Thanks for sharing, do you see many Pontiac's in Switzerland? And what restrictions are placed on American classic cars?
John L.

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Nice car and beautiful color! Is that Copper Canyon?

Very attractive with that color. I sold a Camaro I owned for 40 years with a color I painted like that.

Great looking car!

Beautiful. Welcome.

Four people and not one staring?
What's up with that???

There are many us cars in Switzerland! We don't have restriction for vintage car, is important for the road tax the originality of the car.

after 6 years that I saw the circular gto in my country I managed to buy it.
unfortunately it was no longer as beautiful as I had seen it in the past ....

Ouch! Too bad but on a positive note the height of the impact seems to have avoided hitting the frame directly. Also the hood looks safe (very hard to replace nowadays). Bumper, rad support, fender, valance and headlight housing assembly should get you back in business.

Yes, fortunately the damage is only to the bodywork, the chassis has not suffered. Even the hood is ok, only a little bump in the side.

First is fix the front radiator support...i know how is strong find the parts also from you in USA...and the right parts ist very expensive.

Next step have good luck and very good memory to find again the number of the phone from of the garage that put these pieces up for sale 5 years ago ...

Although those are 72 fenders with the vents, they'll work.

Yes, all the front was from a 72. I'm not happy to close the vent but i don't have another solution.
Next step test the right position of the endura bumber....

Canyon Copper 71. Nice. When you do it remove the GTO decals from where they are to behind the front wheel opening. Automatic or manual transmission? Be glad your hood is ok, hard to find and very expensive.

I wouldn't close the vents on the '72 fenders, more trouble than it's worth. It won't be correct but it looks better.

This is the assemby test with the Endura (sandblasted), valance panel, fender and hood. I think the alignement was good....:D

A little bit of fantasy to repair the lamps support: from two parts in one! Befor cut the craked edge from the "72" parts end rapair with the "survived" parts from the "71"

Ok, "72" fender is modified but is not right... :oogle: ist just to watch to right side!:D:D

Next step is to "remove" the "furry" cover seat....:gag:

Also the carpet is not very nice, I buy a new one to AMES. Very happy to find the build sheet, the original carper label and a very nice sheetmetal!:hooray:

Very Very more better!

Congrats on the great GTO!

It's sure a good thing you kept information on that 1972 front end!!

Your work looks great so far!!
Good luck on correcting that modified 1972 fender!

You are very lucky indeed to have found that build sheet!!

I started to check to what extent everything is matching numbers and with the engine everything is ok: correct engine casting, code "YS" and the sequential number is correct with the body number...:thumbup:

this is the build sheet. With the "PX8" code the tires are all black or with white stripe?

"G70-14 WW"... Looks like whitewall tires to me but l don't know much about decoding build sheets.

According to the DeMauro book, the PX8 code of the UPC indicates G70x14-inch Wide Oval whitewall tires.

My car have a 14 inch Honeycomb but in the trunk i find this and i think is one of the original because have correct code...
"M4" plant (where is this plant? i find M1 and M5 but nothing about M4)
"0" 1970
"8" August
"6" week
"JT" 6x14
Very strange but i think in Switzerland the original "Firestone" were being replaced by "Pirelli" before the car was sold...:attention

I recently looked in this wheel stuff, and am happy to share what I learned, and compiled.

What I observed was that the assembly plants tended to be identified by the first letter, and the plant's manufacturing line was the second character;

Plants:
K = Kelsey Hayes
M = Motor Wheel
T = Norris Industries

So your wheel was manufactured by "Motor Wheel", on their fourth line.

Motor Wheel

Your date decoding needs a small correction;
0 = 1970 calender year (correct)
8 = Month; August (correct)
6 = day of month; 6th

Your wheel was made by the Motor Wheel Company, on the 6th of August, 1970.

Curiously, I have notes about that wheel code only being made up until August 1970;
After August, that code wheel was superseded by the code KU, and if my notes read correct, no wheels were made in September or October 1970 because of a strike.

I would wager a guess that the tire on that wheel was changed, as that wheel shows scratching from a trim ring being on, and off of it several times.

I have read period magazine reviews, and read nothing about Stateside tires being replaced for European manufacture tires.

This is a picture in march 1971 to Geneva Autoshow from a brand new Camaro SS and the tires design is a little bit different from the Wide Oval...

This is a very mistake: i give a picture of the tires in my original rally wheels.
Is a Pirelli CN72....this tire is born in 1967 and is produced to 1973.
My have a "DOT 301".....is this "30week" of "1970" possible??

Nobody has an idea?:(

I didn't realize there was a question in your prior post.

According to THIS web page, that would be a 30th week of "1" year;

If the tire is as old as you say, then it would be indicating that it's likely from the 30th week of 1971.
You neglected to tell us the actual tire size;
If it's an GR70-14, then I'd put odds more likely as it being from 1981.

Thanks unruhjonny! Is right the rally wheels is the original for my car.
The question is whether in Switzerland the "wide oval" were actually replaced before the car was sold. It seems strange to me that the owner replaced the tires after just one year of driving. As mentioned the DOT is "301" and the car was built in September 1970 and sold to the customer in March 1971
The photo of the camaro wheel was taken in March 1971 and the profile doesn't look like those of the firestone or goodyear that GM normally fitted.

Just to be clear, if 301 is to be interpreted as 30th week of 1971, then that would put it as being made the week of July 11th 1971;
Again, between the 11th and 17th of July.

If your car was sold in March 1971, then that tire is too new to be the original tire.

I would suggest that the tire in question is NOT the original tire that was sold with that car.

When did Europe adapt to metric tires sizes?
Or maybe more specifically, when did Switzerland?

In North America, metric tire sizes only started showing up in the 1980's - and till they became the standard, the older style letter series tires were being sold.

If you do not have conclusive evidence, I'd say that "1" indicates 1981.

I just did a search, and it reads as though Switzerland only went fully metric by joining the international system of units in 1977... But I will assume you to be the governing body in this conversation as to when metric sized tires were being sold in Switzerland.
Canada started going metric in 1973;
I actually have a spare set of 1970 Firebird gauges with a really old KPH overlay on the speedometer.
While the first year of dual (MPH & KPH) speedometers was 1975, the first year that Canadian cars came with KPH as predominant was 1979.

EDIT: Additionally, unless I am mistaken, the 205 section width would be too small for an original tire for your car.
I believe that a G70-14 (OEM as built) would cross to a 225 70 R14;
Is the "V" just an older indicator of the ratio and radial "R" in indicator of it being a radial tire...

Wow, i think is a very perfect answer. Your consideration in the past post is also correct "as that wheel shows scratching from a trim ring being on, and off of it several times."
At this time the tire is build in "1981", is the only right solution.
The Honeycomb wheels have a build date code? Where?

Bobby1971, Here is where to find the date codes on 14x7 Honeycombs...backside along the outer lip of the wheel. This one decodes as 'JK' 8 - 8 - 0 (1970).

Dennis

Thats is...."JX" "0" "9" "22"......if is correct is "22 september 1970"

Correct on the date! Sorry, JX is the correct wheel code too.

Dennis

Is very nice find all this code information! but now I have other doubts...ahahahaha
The car is "born" with the rally wheels on the build sheet and i have only one on the trunk and on the car is 4 honeycomb with correct code....
The body is 09A (1 week september) and on the PHS documentation the car was assembly on 23.09.1970.
is it correct to think that it was the dealer who replaced the 4 wheels before sending the car to switzerland? This would explain why there are 4 honey and a rally.
Or is the spare wheel usually always made of metal?

It was probably changed AT the dealership.
I have understood that it was not uncommon for selling dealers to change wheels from one car to another in order to make a sale.

Your build sheet shows it invoiced for GM overseas so no dealer stateside would have had this car before it was shipped;
If you ordered PHS, and somehow came to the conclusion that it was ordered for a stateside dealer, or stateside alotment, then your guess wouldn't be a far stretch of the imagination - but becasue your built sheet makes an airtight argument for it never sitting stateside (other than awaiting shipment) then that kills your idea as to where or why the wheels were swapped.

I have understood that the Honeycomb wheels were a big deal in 1971 - so odds are the original purchaser either saw it set up that way by the dealer, or asked the dealer to change wheels with another car before he took ownership.

That spare is just one of the five original wheels that your car rolled off the assembly line with;
If your car was ordered with Honeycomb wheels it would not have a Rally II spare.

I don't know the production practices very well, do you mean that the car was assembled as per document and sent to Switzerland directly in Bienne and that the wheels were changed here?
I am doing a very detailed research as I have a Swiss technical document which proves that my car was used as a reference model for homologation here.
The size of the tires is also shown, 205 VR14 .....
At this point I would say that they have fitted new honeycombs with European tires instead of rallywheels
It is also possible that it was exhibited at the Geneva Motor Show in March 1971! I found a photo showing a piece of GTO that could be mine .... :-)

Yes, that is precisely what I am saying.

(regaurding the rest of your research)

Neat!

This are the photo! A brand new Caddy...and in the rear right the GTO.... :-)

cool!

how i can find other parts with a date code numbers to check the originality of the car? The engine is veryfied and is ok....

most parts will have stamped date codes;
They are quite literally everywhere.
only parts which were cast, such as the engine's parts will have a cast date code - cast codes are much easier to find.

I still don't know whether to frame-off or one piece at a time. For now I have been lucky with the pieces, also true that having already restored a GTO 70 I have learned a lot and have kept many pieces. I am considering cryogenic sandblasting of the chassis and underbody. I still have to remove the engine to do a correct painting because now it really sucks.
Here labor costs a lot, I disassemble and reassemble without problems but the most delicate jobs will be done by specialists.

Just for fun, we have here not only chocolate and banks but also strict vehicle laws
Look what the 1972 GTO was being modified final of the exhaust pipe! This is picture from the Geneva Auto Show in 1972

Help, i find a set of rally whees but i don't find the dimension with this code "HN"