1969 PATTERN Judge Roll Call
 

This is for the early - early'ish 69 Judges , termed as Pattern Cars.
If yours is not listed , please advise. And post the invoice - with build week from trim tag.
Build weeks 01B through 02C seem to be the potential prospects.

We are grouping these by their Zone Number -and- Order Number , combined.
Check your Zone Number - And Order Number
See if it is listed.

Example : shipped to 24-992 = Zone 24
The Order Number will be along the top of the Invoice aka 00062
A sample Invoice is posted.

The best theory going that seems to hold water is that the Order Number is tracking the number of cars built for that Zone.
00017 is the lowest number in any Zone so far.
The highest number for a given Zone is going to be counted into a total by subtracting 16 from each zone as it's total.

Approximate total currently is around 1500 cars built .
It's a work in progress. Thanks for any further additions.

Listed as Zone Number
Followed by the Order Number of each car documented from that Zone
Example : 06 - 44, 46 = cars 00044 and 00046 are documented in Zone 06.


01 - 29, 54, 57, 64, 65
02 - 46, 51, 70, 74, 76, 119
03 - 19, 34, 35 40, 49, 55, 55, 67, 78
04 - 45, 46, 51 52, 59
05 -
06 - 44, 46
07 - 27, 40, 52
08 - 18, 35, 41, 58
09 - 21, 24, 27, 41, 42, 54, 56, 66
10 - 32, 59, 73, 77
11 -
12 - 21, 49, 59, 61, 64
13 - 39, 41, 45
14 - 22, 33
15 - 22, 31
16 - 30, 43, 59, 62
17 - 20, 29, 42, 43, 56, 58
18 - 22, 29, 35, 47, 51, 61, 71, 81
19 - 17, 24, 27
20 - 17, 31, 45, 47
21 - 33, 35, 53, 55, 72
22 - 51
23 - 17, 29, 45, 60, 71, 85, 86
24 - 17, 19, 29, 51, 62, 80, 89, 95, 103, 106, 118, 119, 143
25 - 26, 32, 45, 53, 61, 62, 63
27 - 34, 37
28 -
29 - 17, 36, 58, 61, 71, 81

https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...4&d=1762729328

Sample

https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1762729328

Really big thanks go to Johnta1 and North for compiling these Documented Cars from their files.
North came up with the idea of the Order Number actually tracking the number of cars per Zone.

John and North were able to organize their files and confirm that - thus far - no Order Number has been repeated within a given Zone..
So it's working out like the real deal.

Cars with Order Number 00017 have slight bragging rights. In a parameter.

I believe 17-00055 is listed here if I understand your posts correctly.

https://www.hemmings.com/auction/196...dson-nh-924761

Yes,that's what he's looking for.

I attached the PHS

Thanks guys.
Exactly what we are looking for.
Zone 17 , Car 00055 , build week 01D - was not in Johns or Norths files on the current list.

An elusive matching number Atlanta plant car with the high stamp Block VIN
Auto AC and Parchment. Cool car

I finally picked up my Judge, not a pattern car but a 03A Atlanta built car with a high stamp Block VIN. Two owner car with 32k miles on it. All original down to hoses, etc. The VIN stamp location confused me.

The 69 Atlanta stamping makes me wonder if a head honcho from Fremont transferred to Atlanta for a year.
Went back to Fremont for 1970.
Then transferred to Framingham for 1971.

The more Pattern Cars we can document, the better.
The best ones we hope to find are ones with the higher car number / order number.
To help push up the overall count of cars in that Zone.

For instance if Car 88 popped up for Zone 27 , it would raise their total from current Car 37

Here is the updated web page.

Pattern Judge Sort Table

A huge thanks to North for his info!


:)

If someone has the Invoice for this car -
07 00027 152820 B1xxxxx - 02/14 Shelton Pontiac-Buick Rochester MI

That Invoice Number can't be right @ 152820
Needs to be double checked.
The others dont start running until the 4xxxxx ranges

Invoice numbers run parallel to when the cars were billed out to dealer.

This one was also billed on 2/14
24 00019 496554 R1xxxxx - 02/14 Scoti Robinson Pontiac Torrence CA

Car 07 - 00027 should be invoiced in that number range.

Sorry, BVZ, that is corrected now!
Typing lots of numbers and got crossed up on that one.
(hopefully only one!)


:eek:

John, here is the trim tag for one you have listed.

Thanks Mike!


:)

Possibly a pattern car. This one is missing from the registry and should be added. The car is currently for sale by Streetside Classics in Fort Worth TX

Zone 16 - Car 00038 is not on this list yet.
Will check their website.
I looked at it on eBang.

They used 1968 Radiator support and fan shroud parts.
All the glass looks clear.
No GTO emblem on dash
Black stripes instead of Blue
15" wheels with Red center caps

EDIT : Restamped Block with VIN down low , instead of up high (Atlanta 1969)
wrong font also - and crookedly /staggeredly

Zone 16 - Car 38 - 01D Build

https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1763356606
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1763356623
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1763356635

Updated both pages:

Pattern Judge Table with zone dealer


Pattern Judge Sort Table

:)

Is the one with the zone dealer number the one preferred?
(over the other one)

Don't want to get too much extra data in it?

:confused:

There are a lot of obvious things wrong with that car for $125k. Funny that they point out in the text that the 15" wheels are correct...

The one with the zone lot number is a good feature. Might be handy at some point.
Think I would list it row 3 instead of row 2 , since we are focusing on Zone and Order Number/Car Number.

And would be easier to discern the cars per Zone if they were in Order Number/Car Number sequence.
Easier to see the low and the high for each zone.
Are they currently sequenced by VIN ?

Maybe if space allows - storage lot or inventory lot as the heading- instead of dealer number heading -
for the 991 992 993 etc column.

In the page, they are sequenced by the Zone number.
The zone numbers were not in order if in numerical Vin (per plant).

I can do it with VIN exposed if wanted?


:confused:

The VIN is good too , except in a case where owner requests not to.
I vote to sequence them by Zone as they are - further sequence each zone by order number.

for fake example :
02 - 00024
02 - 00037
02 - 00048
02 - 00059
02 - 00084

03 - 00019
03 - 00027
03 - 00099
03 - 00104

Easier to see the low and high per zone

Here it is

New page with additions.


Pattern Judges Sort Table


:)

Ultra Deluxe on that set up John .
Very comprehensive and easy to navigate.

Added one more pattern Judge and changed some Ident #'s for easier sorting.


:)

Here's a possible pattern Judge.


The buildsheet and PHS are not real good and partial.


The buildsheet has the order number I have a pointer to that looks like 00006 with a digit can't make out.


https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1763766657






This sheet looks like the one that is for pattern # 17 with the last digit hard to see or rubbed off or something.


https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1763766657


Both Framingham Plant.


Need a good PHS of the G127252 PHS for best case.


:)

Car VIN G125205 Buildsheet is for Car 29-00017
It is already on the Big List .
The 00017 Zone Order Number order number is on the top line of the text body of the Bsheet
186276 - 000017

The 00001 down lower means it was Car #1 in that Zone. (00017)
I do not believe there is a missing 7 on that line.
Although I do remember years ago some speculating it was missing a 7.
Newer info we have now leads me to that decision.
(see Car #6 below)

Car VIN G127252 Buildsheet is for Car 07- 00022
It is not on the Big List
The line we need that would show it's Zone Order Number is missing/illegible.
The 00006 down lower will make it Car #6 in that Zone (00022)
(see above - per car #1 = 00017 ,,,,, there is no car lower than 00017)

That also fits in line by it's Invoice Number 493999 being lower than the previous lowest Invoice Number in that Zone
of 494051 for car 07-00027

This is all working out totally flush.
Good Stuff ! :D

The BHC threw me a small curve.
The State Codes are TO: 21 / FROM: 21 (Michigan)
PMD Plant wasn't building Judges yet.
The State Codes are for the Zone Lot it was at in Michigan Lot #992 , Zone 07 (FROM)
And it sold to Packer Pontiac in Detroit (TO)

07 00022 493999 G127252 992 - 02/14 Packer Pontiac Detroit MI

07 00027 494051 B152820 992 - 02/14 Shelton Pontiac-Buick Rochester MI

Updated web page:


69 Pattern Judges


:)

Updated "Quick List"
Added Cars 17-00055 + 16-00038 + 07-00022

01 - 29, 54, 57, 64, 65
02 - 46, 51, 70, 74, 76, 119
03 - 19, 34, 35 40, 49, 55, 55, 67, 78
04 - 45, 46, 51 52, 59
05 -
06 - 44, 46
07 - 22, 27, 40, 52
08 - 18, 35, 41, 58
09 - 21, 24, 27, 41, 42, 54, 56, 66
10 - 32, 59, 73, 77
11 -
12 - 21, 49, 59, 61, 64
13 - 39, 41, 45
14 - 22, 33
15 - 22, 31
16 - 30, 38, 43, 59, 62
17 - 20, 29, 42, 43, 55, 56, 58
18 - 22, 29, 35, 47, 51, 61, 71, 81
19 - 17, 24, 27
20 - 17, 31, 45, 47
21 - 33, 35, 53, 55, 72
22 - 51
23 - 17, 29, 45, 60, 71, 85, 86
24 - 17, 19, 29, 51, 62, 80, 89, 95, 103, 106, 118, 119, 143
25 - 26, 32, 45, 53, 61, 62, 63
27 - 34, 37
28 -
29 - 17, 36, 58, 61, 71, 81

John or North - do either of you have anything on Car 24-00017 ?

It's in my list , but not on Johns list .
My quick list shows 5 #00017 Cars
John has 4 of them

Here is a different page with the plants in their own table.

Sort by Plant


I don't have it that I can see. But I need to go through all I have to see if I missed any from North.

:confused:

I checked back on Norths original list,
he has the Zone 24 - Car 00017 on his list.

My list is just his list , in a different format.
I need to cross reference against your list and see if I am missing any of those.

He has a Car 17 in Zones 19 , 20 , 23 , 24 , 29

0 from Arlington
2 from Atlanta
0 from Baltimore
2 from Fremont
1 from Framingham

Yes
There are numerous cars that he doesn't show , or you don't show , between the lists.
That is just from the first 3 Zones so far

Would be great if somehow your expanded data list by Zone had them all with their details.
Might be a tough job

Will try to start plinking away at listing the variations.

Zone 1
J - 29, 54, 58, 64, 65
N - 29, 54, 57, 64, 65

Zone 2
J - 68, 74, 76, 119
N - 46, 51, 70, 74, 76, 119

Zone 3
J - 19, 34, 35, 49, 55, 67
N - 19, 34, 35, 40, 49, 55, 67, 78

Zone 4
J - 45, 46, 51, 52, 59
N - 45, 46, 51, 52, 59

Zone 6
J - 44, 46, XX
N - 44, 46

Zone 7
J - 22, 27, 40, 52
N - 22, 27, 40, 52

Zone 8
J - 35, 41
N - 18, 35, 41, 58

Zone 9
J - 21, 24, 41, 42, 54, 56
N - 21, 24, 27, 41, 42, 54, 56, 66

Zone 10
J - 32, 73, 77
N - 32, 59, 73, 77


Will do some more Zones after while ........

North has sent me a lot of Judges I didn't have. I have added them to mine for the web page. It would take some to separate his from mine.

But I don't think I got the DON 17 zone 24 that is missing.

I am re-looking at all the PHS' to see if I can find it or any I might have missed.

BTW, just to make sure, on that web page, if you click on the top (Gold color) heading it will sort by that column, example sort by VIN click the gold VIN and click again for reverse sort. (ascending or descending)

Or click to sort by DON, Ident #, or Zone etc.

:)

Here is the list from other thread I think.

Mine are in bold and one's with asterick is one's North didn't have.
I sent him mine that he didn't have and he sent me his.
So hopefully all are in there except that one DON 17


Bold is mine; * is not in North's data

01 - 29, 54, 57, 64, 65
02 - 46, 51, 70, 74, 76, 119
03 - 19, 34, 35 40, 49, 55, 55, 67, 78
04 - 45, 46, 51 52, 59
05 -
06 - 44, 46
07 - 27, 40, 52
08 - 18, 41, 58 35 *
09 - 21, 24, 27, 41, 42, 54, 56, 66
10 - 32, 59, 73, 77
11 -
12 - 21, 49, 59, 61, 64
13 - 39, 41, 45
14 - 22, 33
15 - 22, 31
16 - 43, 62 30 *, 50 *
17 - 20, 29, 42, 43, 56, ?,58
18 - 29, 35, 47, 51, 61, 71 81 * 22 *,
19 - 17, 27 24 *
20 - 17, 31, 45, 47 none
21 - 33, 35, 55, 72 53 *
22 - 51 none
23 - 17, 45, 71, 86 29 *, 60 *, 85 *
24 - 17, 19, 51, 62, 80, 89, 103, 106, 118, 119, 29 *, 143 *, 95 *
25 - 26, 32, 45, 53 *, 61, 62, 63
27 - 34, 37
28 -
29 - 17, 36, 58, 61, 71 (?) *, 81 *

BTW, there have been a few added since this was made. (at least three I think maybe more)

:)

The Zone sections I am listing separately in Post #40
Are your current listings by Zone ,
Compared to Norths listings by Zone .

J - John
N - North

I will get the rest done in a little while.
In Zone #1 you have a 58 and he has a 57 , as one example.

I see some emails about Buildsheets. Thanks !
Will check them out after I finish going through the two Zone list comparisons.

Zone 12
J - 21, 49, 59, 64
N - 21, 49, 59, 61, 64

Zone 13
J - 39, 39 again, 41, 45
N - 39, 41, 45

Zone 14
J - 22, 33
N - 22, 33

Zone 15
J - 31
N - 22, 31

Zone 16
J - 30, 38, 50, 62
N - 30, 38, 43, 59, 62

Zone 17
J - XX, 20, 29, 42, 43, 55, 56, 58
N - 20, 29, 42, 43, 55, 56, 58

Zone 18
J - 22, 35, 47, 71, 81
N - 22, 29, 35, 47, 51, 61, 71, 81

Zone 19
J - 17, 23, 24
N - 17, 24, 27

Zone 20
J - 17, 45, 47
N - 17, 31, 45, 47

Zone 21
J - 33, 53
N - 33, 35, 53, 55, 72


More later ......

Zone 22
J - 51
N - 51

Zone 23
J - 17, 29, 60, 71, 85
N - 17, 29, 45, 60, 71, 85, 86

Zone 24
J - XX, 19, 29, 51, 62, 80, 95, 103, 118, 119, 143
N - 17, 19, 29, 51, 62, 80, 89, 95, 103, 106, 118, 119, 143

Zone 25
J - 26, 32, 45, 53, 61, 62, 63
N - 26, 32, 45, 53, 61, 62, 63

Zone 27
J - XX, 34, 37
N - 34, 37

Zone 29
J - XX, 17, 36, 61, 71, 76, 81
N - 17, 36, 58, 61, 71, 81

That's all the confirmed cars.
Some are dangling as unconfirmed or not enough info to substantiate yet.

Revised - Quick View List

01 - 29, 54, 57, 58, 64, 65
02 - 46, 51, 68, 70, 74, 76, 119
03 - 19, 34, 35 40, 49, 55, 55, 67, 78
04 - 45, 46, 51 52, 59
05 -
06 - 44, 46, xx
07 - 22, 27, 40, 52
08 - 18, 35, 41, 58
09 - 21, 24, 27, 41, 42, 54, 56, 66
10 - 32, 59, 73, 77
11 -
12 - 21, 49, 59, 61, 64
13 - 39, 41, 45, xx
14 - 22, 33
15 - 22, 31
16 - 30, 38, 43, 50, 59, 62
17 - 20, 29, 42, 43, 55, 56, 58, xx
18 - 22, 29, 35, 47, 51, 61, 71, 81
19 - 17, 23, 24, 27
20 - 17, 31, 45, 47
21 - 33, 35, 53, 55, 72
22 - 51
23 - 17, 29, 45, 60, 71, 85, 86
24 - 17, 19, 29, 51, 60, 62, 71, 80, 85, 89, 95, 103, 106, 118, 119, 143, xx
25 - 26, 32, 45, 53, 61, 62, 63
27 - 34, 37, xx
28 -
29 - 17, 36, 58, 61, 71, 76, 81, xx

John can you review the documents on these 2 cars ?
We aren't supposed to have any repeat numbers in the same Zone.
Showing 2 cars as #39 in Zone 13 on your list.

13 00039 486100 B156002 99? - - - -
13 00039 511449 B158185 992 - 02/20 Griffith Motor Co Neosho MO

I have changed it to a question mark. Not sure why I had it in that zone?


Here is the PHS


https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1763984241




If someone has the zone/dealer info, would be great to have.
I think it was in an auction or something?


:confused:

So, do you guys have this one listed as 03-35? Or is it 25 (looking at build sheet)"