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AMC Javelins
Any experts on Javelins around here? I'm considering a '69 4 speed project.
This one looks reasonably solid although one of the 1/4s had some work and a few panels have some dents and dings. It hasn't run in a while, but looks complete with some vintage speed parts. The interior is rough. Looks like the original 343 4bbl. I've always liked these cars, but have no idea what I'd be signing up for when it comes to parts availability or challenges with AMCs in general. |
I've always like the 1st generation. Had a girlfriend whose daddy bought her a 69 AMX for graduation. It was relatively quick with an automatic.
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I worked for AMC when they were new. There were no major problems. The rearend is fairly reliable but if you have to remove an axle it is a pain in the butt. If it needs work just put in a Mopar 8.75 or Ford 9". The 343 was a good engine. The ignition is Delco. I don't know how much is reproduced but interior and trim may be hard to find. Best to join an AMC club.
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By no means an expert butidid buy a 70 javelin project last year. I've have loved AMCs and I'm very happy to have one. Interior is the hardest to find but ACC makes carpets for them. Some pics of when I got it to how it is now. Sat in a barn since 86.
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You might try the AMC Forum.
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I’ve been poking around various AMC forums, FB groups, and resto parts sites, but it’s been hard to get an overall read on what’s hard to fix vs. what’s easy. I’ve been learning about decoding door tags and fender tags. Also that AMC didn’t vin stamp their engine.
I’ve had a soft spot for these cars since I was a kid, second to only Pontiac. This one’s apparently an original Big Bad Orange car which is pretty cool. Kind of like an AMX for a guy with a family. |
I love these cars.
My buddy has a 74 with the Pierre Cardin interior option. Go for it! Imagine parts are scarce however. My bEagle was impossible. |
Always liked the AMX. I favor oddball cars, AMX, Avanti, Bricklin, Allante, etc.
Go for it. George |
Javelins are good looking cars. The AMC V8 engines are solid. 390's are special and make great power. Have a slightly goofy oiling system similar to a Buick. Transmissions are solid. Rear ends are mostly small Danas, 35's and 44's. Suspension is similar to Fords of the era. I have a soft spot for 1970 AMX's myself. They had nicer interiors than 68-69 and I like the hood scoop. My mother had a 69 Javelin 390 4-speed she bought new. Red/parchment interior. My dad was none too happy when she came home with it! He hated cars in general and had no idea AMC made a sporty car. He assumed a Rebel or Ambassador would be joining the family, not a hot rod!.
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There’s a big AMC swap and show here in the D. A lot of Chrysler clubs let them in too. I see ac parts at the one Chrysler swap go to.
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I'm guessing this one has a T-10 4 speed. The seller couldn't tell me what the rear gear in it was. Hoping to get a look at it this weekend. If I pick this up, the Comp T/A will go off to greener pastures. It's been a fun car, but I prefer projects to work on. |
OK, I have some useless info: I took my road test in a copper color 1970 Javelin in 1974.
it was my girlfriends car, 390 auto Mark Donohue, Ram Air I was 16, car was fast, I passed the test. Car was also great at the drive in, plenty of room in the back seat, 50 years later.......not so much. |
I had a good friend who had a 1969 AMX when I was a teenager. It held up fairly well under some pretty hard usage. It held up better than his previous car, which was a Dodge Dart with a 340 4-spd.
I always liked the 1969 and 1970 AMXs. They were one of the few cars I liked but never got around to buying. I came close to owning one in the early 1980s, but it was yellow. I'm not a fan of a yellow car. Mike |
LOL Ramblers...........
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AMC Javelins are cool cars! Dan has a '71 base Javelin with the factory 401, 4-speed, 3.54 open rear, factory gauges, AM/FM stereo, all numbers matching. Came with dog dishes and is black on black. No PS or PB...has manual discs. It's a little rough around the edges but drives darn nice. He has many friends that are deep in the AMC world for parts. Good luck with the possible purchase!
He also has a '67 American with the 343 4-bbl, 4-speed, and 3.15 posi...also a stripper with no other options, white over black. Dennis |
Step brother had a 68-69 amx back in the day.. always thought it was a nice looking car. Had a 290 in it I think. He rolled it over one night and totaled it after a few too many. I prefer it over the 71 style.
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The AMC community was good to us - good people with feedback, advice and knowledge they were willing to share. |
I have a 70 Javelin. I pulled the 304 2 barrel and replaced it with a 401, pocket ported the heads, bolted a Qjet on it with some headers. Put a 727 between the Dana 20 with 3.54 gears and its run 13.00 at 106 mph. Traction is a bit of a problem. 😉
Because AMC used lots of GM, Jeep, and Mopar bits and pieces many parts are available. Interior parts are difficult as the demand numbers are too low for the repop manufacturers to get interested. There are parts restoration folks who can resurrect some pieces. The electrical wiring is pretty basic but best replaced with modern style fuse panel as the AMC one is cheap and prone to corrosion issues. The 69 and early cars used a different style of front suspension which used a trunion slider instead of an upper control arm. There used to be problems getting replacement parts for that style suspension. I would look into parts availability before diving in. There is also an aftermarket coilover conversion but it's not cheap. I have no first hand knowledge of the 69 and earlier as I have a 70 which has a more conventional upper and lower control arm suspension. |
Circa 1976 there was an AMX Javelin with a supercharger that terrorized the local streets in Germantown TN. Beautiful car, custom paint etc.
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Friends Javelin 390 with roller cam. Bitchin' car
https://i.postimg.cc/vZ9WMZrF/IMG-20...537215-HDR.jpg |
I always liked those rocker moldings I don't think I have ever seen that roof spoiler. Was that a factory option part? Good looking car.
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This one would similar to the pic above when restored. It's a Big Bad Orange SST with a black c-stripe. I believe the spoiler over the rear window, the hood and the rockers on the car above were part of the Mod Package.
Interesting about the suspension parts, I'll do a little homework. |
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Well, I always thought if I owned an orange '69 4 speed car it would be a Judge. Not so much!
Made a deal on this '69 343 4bbl 4 speed Big Bad Orange Javelin this afternoon. All the numbers check out - at least as much as they can on an AMC. Super solid car with zero rust, original black plates. The down side is the questionable body work on the hood and passenger side and the lack of an interior. The seller included another hood, fenders, a door, the slotted mags for the driver's side and a bunch of extra parts. It's been sitting for 10 years, but has been started periodically. Definitely needs a lot of love, but we can get it going. I love the old school Offenhauser and Mallory stuff under the hood. The plan is to get it running, put an interior in it, spruce up the exterior a tad and drive the heck out of it. It's going to be our Duct Tape Drags car this year. https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1772930311 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1772930347 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1772930370 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1772930397 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1772931037 |
Funny unrelated story, last week I visited a new customer, was supposed to be an engine machine shop. When I pulled around the corner I saw a gigantic American Motors sign on the side of the building, it was obviously an old AMC dealership. Inside the showroom there were two blown small blocks, vintage speed parts and a few cross ram manifolds with NOS Holley carbs, After introducing myself and chatting with the owner it ends up that this was an old AMC dealership and specialized in AMX’s back when his father ran it, they were one of the largest AMX dealerships in the country.
The owner was an old muscle car guy from back in the day as some of my customers are, we spent about an hour chatting about muscle cars and particularly AMX’s, very cool old timer with heaps of knowledge about those cars and everything else, it makes me sad to realize when folks like him die we’ll be loosing decades of experience and knowledge. Long story short there’s supposed to be a guy who started the AMX club in Colorado who probably has a stash or parts but if not probably knows folks who do so maybe if you look him up he can help you find some parts? |
This is definitely a new frontier for me. Who is the Ames Performance and Butler of the AMC world?
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AMC parts are tough. You never see them at the swaps.
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There is a guy local (Battleground WA) to me who buys and sells AMC stuff. If your interested PM and I will give you his phone number. I've bought parts from American Parts Depot, Kennedy American and AMC Parts Warehouse. If you want to go faster check out Indy Cylinder Heads. |
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I'm also going to have to source a bunch of used parts. In particular I need a core drivers side door panel and all the trim for the driver's side door, headliner bows and associated wind lace. No one makes headliners for these so that's going to be a trip to the upholstery shop. The reality of how rough this car is was setting in yesterday. |
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Looks like a great car! |
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Oh yeah, I was poking around the storage lot waiting for the flatbed to arrive yesterday and found this '67 4 speed. For a minute I was like "Hold on, maybe I want this instead." but the deal was already done.
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773077597 I pressure washed it yesterday and started taking inventory of all the stuff we're going to need - $$$. Cole reminded me that it's supposed to be a duct tape car and I told him to police me if I get too out of control. For all it's missing, it's a very solid car. The worst rust is behind the peeling bondo on the passenger quarter. The floors, fenders trunk are solid as a rock. First step is getting it running. It turns over, but there's no spark or fuel so we have some things to sort out. It's got an old Mallory dual point on it that I'm going to try to save. Getting my feet wet over at the AMC forum so I don't bore all the Pontiac folks with this project. I'm really missing the familiarity of Pontiacs and the resto market right now. https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773077929 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773078166 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773077955 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773078096 |
At least the distributor is out in front where it's easy to get to!
I like it. Throw some quick paint on it. It will look better and provide initiative for more work. George |
I happen to know that 2nd gen Ford Probe seats are an easy bolt in.
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That's useful to know. Junkyard seats would be way more economical and reduce my chances of getting tetanus.
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773185899 |
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"Ran when parked"
We're prepping to pull the engine to clean it up and reseal it, but wanted to see if it was a runner first. Carb was corroded from ethanol, and the cooling system needs a good flush, but valve train looked squeaky clean. Popped a new Edelbrock AVS2 carb on it, replaced the points, cap and rotor, and fed it from the gas can and it fired right up. Can't get any fuel from the tank so I assume the pickup looks a lot like the carb did. I've never seen a carb that bad. https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773628546 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773628554 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773628579 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1773628635 |
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Been ignoring the Pontiacs around the house lately as our new toy is getting all the attention.
Started with the easy stuff and replaced a few pieces of missing trim. I love the tail panel on these cars, so replacing that was on top of my list. Cole and I pulled the engine over the weekend. The inside of the engine looks great - nice and clean. Needs a timing chain, no big deal. The real surprise was the amount of rust in the block. It must have had tap water sitting in it for a long time. I spent yesterday rodding out the engine with a coat hanger and flushing it with the hose. I was able to get a vast majority of the rust out of the block. We dropped the gas tank to look at why we can't get fuel to the carb from the tank. It turns out the pickup had fallen off and glued itself to the floor of the tank. The inside of the tank looks like the Titanic. It was repaired and coated as some point, but they didn't do a good job. It's one reason why the fuel looked like transmission fluid. $700 later we have a new tank on the way. The clutch is also pretty tired, so we have new one on the way and sent the flywheel out to get resurfaced. https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774305281 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774304912 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774304895 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774304836 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774304854 |
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Ken, maybe you know this already, but AMC’s got better designed higher flowing exhaust manifolds starting in 1971. They came on 360/401 (304 too...maybe?) engines in the Javelin, Matador, and Ambassador. They should be reasonably available, but the AMC guys like them for the earlier cars to keep the stock factory look and better performance over the old logs, so it will require some patience to find. If you are interested in going that route, I can have my AMC contacts search for some…unless you are going to use headers, then disregard this post. Here are pics from my brother’s 401 Javelin’s to compare the exhaust manifold design to yours.
Dennis PS: Actually, these manifolds won't work...they are for the 1970-up heads with the dog-leg exhaust ports, yours has the older design rectangular ports. I missed that it was a '69 343...darn! |
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First things first though, I have to get this engine in shape to run. There's not much to this car - no power brakes or a/c - so it should be pretty easy to install a set of headers later. I'm really enjoying learning about these cars, but man, I thought Pontiac stuff was expensive. Overall I've been happy with the quality of parts I've received from Kennedy and American Parts Depot but the dollar doesn't go too far with these cars. |
Yes, those AMC manifolds are true logs…they sure look like their namesakes! The 343’s are true winders and make great power for their size with a 4.08” bore x 3.28” stroke. Headers are definitely the way to go. Maybe mimic the old Group 19 performance upgrades offered at AMC dealerships with an aluminum 4-bbl intake (R4B), 650 Holley carb, upgraded cam/lifters/valvetrain, headers, and freer flowing exhaust system. They do have cast rods like our beloved Pontiacs, so be aware of that. Does it have the 3.54 rear?
At the Pure Stock Drags we have a couple of early 390 AMX’s running well into the 13’s running those crappy log manifolds. There is a ’70 390 Go-Package AMX running in the 12’s with the logs…pretty amazing. I’m sure he opened up the outlets as large as he could get them (2 ¼” maybe?), ala’ the Rebel Machine. This is going to be a fun non-PMD build to watch! Dennis |
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The so called AMC "free flow" manifolds are decent. I used them on a 0.060" over 401 Jeep build and they were fine for street usage.
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If one so desires, Free Flow exh. manifold mods are relatively easy. See link.
https://theamcforum.com/forum/modify...pic118358.html |
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https://i.postimg.cc/fLf9hQvn/Screen...-26-131112.jpg |
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Well, I've got bigger fish to fry on this one before I get to headers.
I replaced the timing chain this weekend to find the driven gear for the distributor was worn. Apparently a common problem on AMCs since the gear oiling is off the timing chain. That was the least of my problems. I ended up pulling the heads off this weekend as part of cleaning the cooling passages to find corrosion the cylinders. It clearly sat with water in it for a while. I'm glad I pulled the heads because most cooling passages were clogged. It's against every bone in my body, but I think we're going to do the Frieburger "Don't get it right, just get it running" thing with a driveway hone, rering and new bearing job. Below is a pic of the worst cylinder. It really needs to be bored, but we'll see how it cleans up with a hone. I'm trying to keep this from going to full blown restoration, but it's a slippery slope. On the plus side, I installed a correct shifter handle and got rid of the Chevy truck steering wheel with a '69 Javelin unit I repaired and painted. It should have a wood wheel since it's an SST, but I'm not dropping $1200 on a repro. AMC parts are weird. In my limited experience, they're either crazy expensive or really cheap. The Comp T/A goes off to a new owner this week, so I'll be able to move the engine operation into the garage once that goes. https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774894887 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774895037 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774895019 https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1774895083 |
Matt at Bulltear.com is a very good source of expertise and proven parts for the timing cover, dizzy and cam gear alignment and "matching" sets and oil pump issues with AMCs.
All inter-related many times. |
I wonder how AMC did the DOT-mandated ignition/transmission lock thing?
Or did it not kick in till 1970? |
Funny I've had more engagement over this project here than on the AMC forum.
I picked up an oil pump mid plate from Bulltear to go with the new Melling oil pump kit. It's such an odd oiling system on these cars where thickness of a gasket can make or break oil pressure. From what I've been reading, replacement timing chains with the multiple oiling slots tend to starve the distributor gear rather than direct the oil. I ponied up for a Rollmaster which seems to be preferred because it only has two slots. You also have to make sure the oil passage out the front of the cam gear is clear and aligned. I was wondering the same about the ignition lock. Our '69 still has the key in the dash and the column doesn't lock so maybe GM got a jump on everyone? Cole's been working on the wiring and got the headlights, markers and tail lights working using what he learned on the Ventura. The turn signals and brake lights don't work yet which I read can be a symptom of a bad turn signal switch. Ours looks pretty crusty so we may be pulling the column to replace. Fortunately it's a common GM part. |
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