Pics
 

Another shot

Another pic

Ooh!

Did you have to restore it? I know the one I saw in an ad needed a resto.

Let's say "I think it needed a resto."

68
 

It`s a running & driving car, have not restored it yet, collecting NOS parts. KC

I'm so glad to see this car!

Okay, I'm back to revisit the production numbers. I'm not done with the matrix, but I'm close. I am not sure if I am going to present anything new here (for now, won't refer to previous posts in this thread), but hopefully I will. Since we all have references from other publications or, let's say, PHS, feel free to cross-reference because it's possible there's mistakes (more below).

In 1968, 453 428 HOs were built in total. Of those, either 172 or 173 were Catalinas. I have two pages with "5200 L75" that show one number or the other. But I also have a page that shows "5200/5600 L75" adding up to 180. I cross-referenced the Executive number and I get 7, so let's go with 173 Catalinas for the sake of simplicity with the idea that factory records are never accurate or that there may be a standard rate of error especially since the hard numbers are based on percentages.

As of now, I don't have any information on the distribution among all Catalinas except convertibles - this disappoints me! However, I can tell you that 85 of the Catalina HOs were built with a manual tranny. I have no info whether any were 3-speeds (I'm skeptical but far from an expert on these cars), but I'd venture to guess most/all had the M20.

However, I do have a number of 363 for M20 Catalinas for all engines.

The docs that Joe gave me have the options listed by sales code, not UPC, so it's a bit more difficult for me to see if I have any other info to offer (I know some, like engines and AC, but not these). But most other stats I have seem to be tied to something mechanical, such as:

L78/K81
L79/V81
L79/F64
L79/F72
L79/N40
L79/M40/F40
L79/S72/M40
L79/F71
M09/M20
M12/N33/A53/A69
NC7
L79/N10
N10/K30

Sometimes the combinations may not make sense, like what was in Pontiac's interested to know how many cars were ordered with AC + PS, but that's just how things were done.

It's been a few years since I took pics of the documents. Originally they totaled over 1000, but I only took snapshots of a fraction of that. That being said, I can't recall if I managed to take pics of ALL the pages or simply focused on ones that had engine info (my spreadsheet is including A- and F-bodies). The only way I'll know for sure is when I get back to the GM Heritage Center. I make a yearly pilgrimage to MI for the Pure Stock Drags in September, but I also told myself I wouldn't make another visit till I compiled the numbers that I have. Hence, I don't think I'll be going for another year because I've had some of these docs for several years and I feel I owe it to the good folks at the GMHC to finish the current job over the greed of accumulating unpublished information.

And, of course, pages are missing from the GMHC. Were they stolen over the years? Were they misplaced? Something else? I don't know, but nothing that I've seen has been complete. In fact, some years (like 1965-66) are missing, so no dice on how many 2+2 ragtops were built (except for 1967).

For whatever reason, I've always had a fascination with production numbers, so when Fred Simmonds did his thing over 25 years ago, I thought it was fantastic - now we all could know how many Judges had RAIV! Fred's handiwork is in the GMHC's files (if you've seen his matrices over the years, you know how to recognize them!), and I know much of what I've researched has been the same references that Fred has used, but I also have seen some of Fred's stats that I haven't been able to find in the GMHC - have they gone missing since then? If you know enthusiasts in Detroit who are in the know, they may have a story about an unscrupulous person within who has stolen things just to have it. I suspect the inner geek in all of us makes honest people dishonest at times....or not.

As I've said before, I am not allowed to distribute any of the docs, but I'm allowed to divulge information. This puts pressure on me because I have to be accurate with what I reference and subsequently tell. I'm also learning that the larger the spreadsheet becomes, the more opportunity there is for me to make a mistake. With so much misinformation, old wives tales, outright lies, and what-not out there, I want to do my best to make sure I can continue Fred's hard work in a positive manner and set the record straight on so many things; for those who prefer fuzzy math or estimates that have no proper statistical bases, I hope to ruin their day. :-)

Above all, with your help, I am sure we will bear witness to improving the Pontiac hobby.

Thanks for your work, Diego!

:)

Are the sheets like the ones posted before on 71/72 production?

They had a "F.J. Gordon Manager Car Distribution" on it.

Is he still around I wonder?

:confused:

You mean like this?

No, it's a completely different document. I've attached an edited pic of what I am looking at.

Yes, your 1st pic.
(same guy too :) )

Thanks again for the work.

:)

So can anyone help me with some of the option codes listed above?

Or suggest a resource where I can find them? Not having much luck.

Here is what I have:

L78 - 400 engine
K81 - upc:681 62/63 amp alternator (this later year, probably different amp alternator in 68?)
L79 - 428 engine
V81 - light trailer option (in 1971/72, possibly same in 68)
F64 - extra high rate springs & shocks
F72 - Highway patrol high rate springs & shocks
N40 - Power Steering
F40 - upc:622 Heavy load springs & shocks
M40 - upc:351 THM 400
F71 - HD front & rear springs & shocks
M09 - upc:534 Special gear shift knob
M20 - upc:354 4 speed Muncie wide ratio
M12 - upc:356 floor gearshift control
N33 - upc:504 Steering wheel Tilt
A53 - upc:568 Strato Bench Seat, Notchback Front Only
NC7 ?
S72 ? probably some paint code?
N10 - upc:481 Dual exhaust
K30 - upc:441 Cruise control

:)

Diego, Does this look familiar?

Dennis

What's the story on that?

I believe this is the car you were referring to in the title of this thread...428 HO, M-21 4-speed, 4.11 Safe-t-Track Catalina Sedan. It followed Dan home this past weekend.

Dennis

Ya gotta love a site where a query on a unicorn ends up findng its way into the thread, and then one of your friends ends up buying it a week later.

Thanks to KC for selling the car to Dan, who is tearing (investigating) into it as we speak. The Cat was assembled at the Linden, NJ plant and was sold at Maxon Pontiac in Union, NJ and lived it's entire life in the area. VooDoo green with black guts. It does need a restoration and Dan is weighing his options of what is the best path to go. As KC mentioned, all the numbers and match and is a complete car. I'll let Dan add to this if he wants.

Options:
348 - 428 HO V8 Engine
358 - 4-spd Close Ratio Transmission
361 - Safe-T-Track Differential
362 - Performance Axle Ratio (4.11)
382 - Radio - Push Button (AM)
404 - Defogger - Rear Window
412 - Guards - Door Edge
444 - Custom Gauge Cluster
501 - Power Steering - Wonder Touch
514 - Heavy Duty Fan (7 blade clutch)
531 - Glass - Soft Ray - All Windows
591 - Speedo - Gear Adapter
682 - Radiator - Super Cooling
701 - Battery - Heavy Duty
754 - Shoulder Belts - Front (Mandatory option)

Dennis

Boy, I'll bet the backstory on that car would be interesting...who was the original owner, what did he use it for, etc.

Stuart, Yeah, I wish we knew too, but from what Ken (KC) told us, he bought the car from the 2nd owner, who bought it from an estate sale with the intention of flipping it. The second owner didn't know any history and unfortunately we can only speculate the motives of the original buyer, which isn't too difficult to do. It has 108,000 miles on it and Dan did get the OO's maintenance log book from 60,000 miles to 108,000 (2008?). It hasn't been driven hardly at all since the OO died. It does have Englishtown Dragway decals (from the 60's) in the rear qtr. windows and was dragraced there. It was a true dual-purpose car and I'm sure a street racer as well. The OO bought, modified and installed a metal mailbox on the hood as a hood scoop that also came with the car. He even painted it Verdoro Green to match the car. I wish we had back-in-the-day pics of it. If KC knows any more history than what I told, hopefully he will chime in.

Dennis

Would the 428 HO have a single snorkel air cleaner for '68, or an open element type like 1967?

Thanks, Dennis

Definitely not for stopping quickly...