R/A on PHS Sightings?
 

Hi and thanks in advance for any help on this subject. I found this PHS when looking at a 69 Firebird for sale.
It says F/B 400 R/A. Has anyone seen this before?
Sorry about the picture quality. It's the best I have.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...ium/ramair.jpg

69 bird
 

This I believe it is a RAIII, if it had RA inlet, it would be listed, unlike the GTO RAIII, where it was standard.

The fact appears to be that the Ram Air hood inlet was not listed separately on the PHS of early 69 cars. These very early cars showed up on the PHS listing the (code 348 F/B 400 R/A) and included the ram air just like the 69 GTO's with the RAIII motor. This PHS looks to be the one for the Goldenrod Yellow 69 body that sold on ebay a while back. It was a Royal Pontiac car with nothing but a shell. It was indeed an early ram air car that did NOT show the separate 611 HD R/A inlet like the later cars did. The later cars showed the (code 348 F/B 400 HO) and a separate 611 HD R/A Inlet option. This was also quite a bit more expensive on the later cars. The motor was approx. $19.00 more and the 611 R/A inlet option was $84.26! This Goldenrod Royal car is the earliest RAM AIR 69 Firebird that I have ever seen with a ship date of 11/27/68. They must have discovered that the cost was too low very early on and created a separate option for Ram Air later on?? I should add that this is the only PHS that I have seen like this (and I do have a collection PHS docs) but I have no reason the believe that it has been altered since what I saw came from Jim at PHS. One thing is for sure, All of these Ram Air Firebirds are rare!

Given that it costs about $5,000 now to so equip a car, ... not a bad deal.

Help me out here people. We have skeptics. Some people are saying that this is just an HO. How could that be without the correct HO pricing and also why would they call an HO an R/A on the PHS? Anybody else seen this code on the PHS *F/B 400 R/A* ?

I believe they did help you out and told you in no uncertain terms that your PHS represents a ram air car.

I hear you and thanks for the replies but I have EXPERTS to deal with. See for yourself; http://firstgenfirebird.org/ubb/ubbt...1316#Post98169

Give me a break. Mommy mommy, he hit me! I am going to tell on you...

Were you the kid who never got picked for anything in school? Your attitude sure reflects the mentality.

Yes, I am one of the skeptics, at least I do not go flaunting like a touting child.

I'm here for information. Let's stick to that please.

OK I'll make the skeptics case for them so we can cut to the chase. They believe that since it doesn't have the inlet on the PHS that it's an HO. Not a true ram air car. They say if we could find a few more like it they would be believers. This PHS all by itself and opinions aren't proof. Has anyone seen another PHS with F/B 400 R/A on it?

Hmmm...wouldnt the air inlet be a included with the RA option?
There for, not listed on the invoice.

Again, I'll make their case. There are alot of 69's that have the air inlet separate. One of the skeptics asked Jim Mattison(PHS owner) and apparantly he said that they have to have the air inlet separately on the PHS to be a true ram air car. I'm still not buying that when the PHS says R/A. I just need a little back up here with another PHS or siting of one with this option code. Personally, I have only seen this one. The skeptics haven't come up with a reason for the pricing being different either. They want to say it's an HO.

There was no Ram Air III option on the '69 Firebird order form.

To get a Ram Air III Firebird you either ordered the Trans Am option (midyear) or you ordered a 400 HO UPC 348 plus the Air Induction UPC 611.

The option price on the PHS for F/B 400 R/A doesn't fit that theory. They obviously aren't charging for HO.

Ram Air was not less expensive than HO, it had more components.

Been through all this on the other forum, no need to argue the points, just find several HO and RA III Car Invoices for 1969. Let the paper tell the story.

Looks like the Pontiac police are bustin' balls over there at the First Gen site. No wonder it's like a ghost town over there. :poke

Jim's up to his old tricks.
As he would say to anyone else
It's a photoshopped PHS
F/B 400 R/A Car. (LoL)

^^^
Just like Barry Martin is a cool guy and most reputable people here loathe him except for whom?

When you go with the "popular vote", you go for the angle that nobody likes, The angle you can't necessarily prove, the person (Barry Martin) 99% of the Pontiac Community deems an ass (you call him a "businessman").

You go with the unpopular angle, not out of fact or righteousness, but out of need. There is something to be said for your assertions and desires. Either you are taunted with the need for attention or spoiled by past experience.

To get with the program, Jim, you call everyone else out "on the other board" and "demand proof", like I said, let's see that "invoice" with a correct numbers matching "RAIII" that is correct AND complete.

I am being a dick because that is how you treat others. Now you are caught up in your same "tempermental trap" without a motor, trans, Ram Air package or anything else that denotes that car a RAIII.

Before you opened up "Pandoras Box", you should have enlightened yourself to the same loathing scrutiny you provide and offer others when they promote their assertions. In other words, don't come screaming to "the Pontiac Police" about brand X when you can not suport the claims other than a body shell and no correct parts to support the RAIII claim.

As others have said, provide more evidence and we will either shut up or pat you on the back. You have inflated this simple matter to a new molecular level. Not only is it personal, it is consuming your life on two boards, and that is sick.

Tag Team Scum Bags
 

Just looking for anyone who may have seen this F/B 400 R/A. I'm not looking for someone to be right or wrong. I'm looking to have the correct information. I don't own this car. I'm not buying this car. I thought it was cool to see a code like that. It's different than any I have seen and heard of. It doesn't make sense to me that it is an HO.

And since it's time for honesty I will cut all the niceties that I have been taught. Tom and Vikki here followed me over to the PY board. They think they have a victim in me. Just because I will not, up until now, fly off the handle and say what I know is impolite. Well I've had it with these too pieces of dung. They are scum of the Earth. Neither has a spec of integrity. They would rip off their grandmothers. One hides behind a badge and the other hides behind being a woman.

Tom(Banshee) runs his mouth about anything and everything. He has a third grade education trying to write at a fifth grade level. He has no comprehension of any complicated thought. He has little reguard for proper manors. He's a bully through and through. That's why he's here. He's a wimpy cop that only can bully people on the internet because in public he would get his clock cleaned. I'm sure you all can imagine how he is when he's pretending to be one of Detroit's finest. So Tom, this probably blows your mind because I haven't gotten personel on any of my posts in the years past. It takes a real slug to bring this out of me. You win the prize for being the biggest piece of dung on any board I have ever visited.

Vikki(Yellowbird/Cudagal),
You are one of those women that hide behind being a woman and act like a man. An ill manored man at that. I've put up with so many personal cut downs from you without ever saying anything back. Again, I was taught to have manors. I was also taught that when a woman acts like a @#$% long enough she deserves to be put in her place. You have zero integrity, ZERO. You lie and cheat for your agendas or dollars. One day you are in bed with someone in their business and the next you cut them down. You will stilt any and all information you put out to meet your agendas. Which is usually a quick sleazy buck. I know you have quite a few men buffaloed, not this one. I've seen your shaky dealings and rip off schemes up close and personal.

I could go on and on with evidense on how low you two are. You guys are scum of the Pontiac World. You deserve each other but the rest of us do not deserve you. Go away!

Jim, a.k.a. "Mr. Fabrication", I can tolerate your opinions so long as public forum permits me to likewise express mine.

"Followed" you from the other site? I have been a member here for a few years, same as you. In fact, longer than you. My participation here has nothing to do with you. This is, I believe, a Pontiac site. I am a Pontiac hobbyist, like many others.

I have never questioned your parentage, sexuality, personal characteristics, or intelligence. Why do you direct a personal attack at me when I challenge you in a public debate over interpretation of documentation?

I have asked for, and received, an opinion from an expert of high standing. You discredit his opinion.

I have extensively studied what I speak of, not just shoot from the mouth. And I use a full spectrum of information to draw conclusions, not hand selected samples that fit my desired result.

I hide behind nothing and no one. I lie for nothing or no one. I am an individual who happens to be interested in cars, and have been since I was a teen. I've had the great fortune to own some of the greatest musclecars in existence, and I've learned everything I could about them. My integrity is open for inspection, I have nothing to hide with my business ethics or personal ethics. But as this is supposed to be a car forum, not a personal attack venue, please withdraw your ill-advised personal comments and stick to the topic at hand.