Pontiac - Race The next Level

          
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-02-2016, 01:03 AM
Johnny406's Avatar
Johnny406 Johnny406 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 2,877
Default Machining a 3 series gear to fit 4 series spool?

I'm not even sure this is feasible hence the question, but has anyone ever machined down a 3 series ring gear to fit a 4 series spool? I'm currently running the "thin" Yukon 3.90 gears in my bracket car with a full spool running 275-60-15 drag radials. I generally race the street/foot brake class hence the radials over slicks. My problem is my very stout TH400 transmission has a 2.75 first gear so overpowering any tire isn't too difficult. I know I can go to the thin 4 series 3.73 but I'd like to get into the 3.42 to 3.55 range and sadly no one seems to make a 12 series ring in those ratios for a 4 series carrier.

__________________
Johnny US Army Retired
1978 T/A 463 Pontiac, KRE 74cc 292CFM D-ports, Lunati VooDoo, V-max lifters, TKII, ATM 850 E85 carb, TCI TH-350 race tranny, 3600 converter 3.73 12 bolt 11.63@116.68mph
1981 T/A 4-speed 406 Pontiac, Merrick ported 6X heads, Comp 270S cam, Crosswind intake 750 Street Demon, 3.42 30 spline Eaton posi street car.
1980 Formula 350 Pontiac back burner project
1972 LeMans 350 Pontiac
  #2  
Old 08-02-2016, 07:24 AM
firechickenman's Avatar
firechickenman firechickenman is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Savannah, MO
Posts: 1,191
Default

Is a 3 series spool not available for your application?

__________________
'68 Firebird

463/pump gas/SD 325 E-heads/266-272 SR cam/1050 Dominator/3.73/ET Street Radials/1.37 60'/6.30@108.80/9.93@135.14

Hot Rod Drag Week finishing averages:
2014 - 11.12 @ 118.56
2015 - 10.84 @ 124.97
2016 - 10.56 @ 127.88
2017 - 10.29 @ 130.74
2018 - 10.29 @ 130.53
2019 - 10.16 @ 132.34
2021 - 10.09 @ 132.69
2022 - 10.13 @ 133.07

9.93 run - https://youtu.be/hII0_UlYM4U

  #3  
Old 08-02-2016, 08:33 AM
Johnny406's Avatar
Johnny406 Johnny406 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 2,877
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firechickenman View Post
Is a 3 series spool not available for your application?
Believe it or not, nobody makes a 3 series full spool for a 12 bolt.

__________________
Johnny US Army Retired
1978 T/A 463 Pontiac, KRE 74cc 292CFM D-ports, Lunati VooDoo, V-max lifters, TKII, ATM 850 E85 carb, TCI TH-350 race tranny, 3600 converter 3.73 12 bolt 11.63@116.68mph
1981 T/A 4-speed 406 Pontiac, Merrick ported 6X heads, Comp 270S cam, Crosswind intake 750 Street Demon, 3.42 30 spline Eaton posi street car.
1980 Formula 350 Pontiac back burner project
1972 LeMans 350 Pontiac
  #4  
Old 08-02-2016, 09:00 AM
firechickenman's Avatar
firechickenman firechickenman is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Savannah, MO
Posts: 1,191
Default

Strange has them in 33 and 35 spline. I didn't see one for 30 spline.

__________________
'68 Firebird

463/pump gas/SD 325 E-heads/266-272 SR cam/1050 Dominator/3.73/ET Street Radials/1.37 60'/6.30@108.80/9.93@135.14

Hot Rod Drag Week finishing averages:
2014 - 11.12 @ 118.56
2015 - 10.84 @ 124.97
2016 - 10.56 @ 127.88
2017 - 10.29 @ 130.74
2018 - 10.29 @ 130.53
2019 - 10.16 @ 132.34
2021 - 10.09 @ 132.69
2022 - 10.13 @ 133.07

9.93 run - https://youtu.be/hII0_UlYM4U

  #5  
Old 08-02-2016, 10:20 AM
Johnny406's Avatar
Johnny406 Johnny406 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 2,877
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firechickenman View Post
Strange has them in 33 and 35 spline. I didn't see one for 30 spline.
You're right, I forgot to mention that I have aftermarket 30 spline axles and C clip eliminators so I'd rather not replace those again. My best bet is to probably go with a Eaton posi and be done with it.

__________________
Johnny US Army Retired
1978 T/A 463 Pontiac, KRE 74cc 292CFM D-ports, Lunati VooDoo, V-max lifters, TKII, ATM 850 E85 carb, TCI TH-350 race tranny, 3600 converter 3.73 12 bolt 11.63@116.68mph
1981 T/A 4-speed 406 Pontiac, Merrick ported 6X heads, Comp 270S cam, Crosswind intake 750 Street Demon, 3.42 30 spline Eaton posi street car.
1980 Formula 350 Pontiac back burner project
1972 LeMans 350 Pontiac
  #6  
Old 08-02-2016, 12:27 PM
ponjohn's Avatar
ponjohn ponjohn is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 9,544
Default

3.73 is it for a 4 series spool.

That is what is so attractive about a ford 9, spool in any ratio.

Even a Dana is limited to 3.54.

  #7  
Old 08-02-2016, 06:47 PM
77 TRASHCAN's Avatar
77 TRASHCAN 77 TRASHCAN is online now
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 31May2013 Temporary home to the world's widest (that we know of) tornado. Lord, NO more Please...
Posts: 6,620
Default

Your gear could be machined, a real machinist would need to perform the job, though.

__________________
1977 Black Trans Am 180 HP Auto, essentially base model T/A.
I'm the original owner, purchased May 7, 1977.

Shut it off
Shut it off
Buddy, I just shut your Prius down...
  #8  
Old 08-02-2016, 11:59 PM
Scarebird's Avatar
Scarebird Scarebird is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: ABQ, USA
Posts: 5,057
Default

not so sure of that - those gears are hard as hell.

  #9  
Old 08-03-2016, 12:12 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 20,674
Default

I have a thin 3.73 in the IA/Camaro's 12 bolt Moser spool 33 spline.

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #10  
Old 08-03-2016, 01:20 AM
77 TRASHCAN's Avatar
77 TRASHCAN 77 TRASHCAN is online now
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 31May2013 Temporary home to the world's widest (that we know of) tornado. Lord, NO more Please...
Posts: 6,620
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarebird View Post
not so sure of that - those gears are hard as hell.
Most machinist's would not tackle this job. I have been blessed to have a friend that's a real deal machinist. He likely would do such a job for me, not many others...just because of the degree of difficulty...

__________________
1977 Black Trans Am 180 HP Auto, essentially base model T/A.
I'm the original owner, purchased May 7, 1977.

Shut it off
Shut it off
Buddy, I just shut your Prius down...
  #11  
Old 08-03-2016, 01:24 AM
Jack Gifford's Avatar
Jack Gifford Jack Gifford is offline
formerly 'Pontiac Jack'
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Phelps, NY 14532
Posts: 10,188
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarebird View Post
... not so sure of that - those gears are hard as hell...
Not that hard where it needs to be cut. No problem with carbide mills.

Having said that; I can't speak about the overall gear design, regarding the resulting strength of the gear.

Also, if the result is too little bolt thread engagement in the gear, that's a problem. I imagine that the gear is too hard to drive a bottoming tap another 1/4" or so into the gear.

__________________
Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons?
... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac?
... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967)
  #12  
Old 08-05-2016, 12:11 PM
Half-Inch Stud's Avatar
Half-Inch Stud Half-Inch Stud is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: BlueBell, PA or AL U.S.A.
Posts: 18,495
Default

My 2-Series and 3-series 12-bolt posi chunks sold like hot cakes awhile ago. Got no more, just good used guts.

Got a ring gear spacer of a correct thickness for some sort of series/gear swap. Probably have the longer bolts..

  #13  
Old 08-05-2016, 12:13 PM
Half-Inch Stud's Avatar
Half-Inch Stud Half-Inch Stud is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: BlueBell, PA or AL U.S.A.
Posts: 18,495
Default

Such a hard-steel gear would be grinded. right?

Probably at equal cost of a custom spool from Strange.

  #14  
Old 08-11-2016, 10:34 PM
firechickenman's Avatar
firechickenman firechickenman is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Savannah, MO
Posts: 1,191
Default

I had the cover off my 12-bolt the other day and didn't remember how thin the 3.73 (11/41) for a 4 series carrier looks. I'm not sure if a 3.42 (12/42) or 3.55 (11/39) was machined for a 4 series carrier that there would be enough material to support the ring gear teeth. It wold be interesting to see what the difference is in the pinion size of the three gear sets.

.310" is the difference between a 3 series and 4 series carrier.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Thin 3.73.jpg
Views:	48
Size:	199.2 KB
ID:	434527  

__________________
'68 Firebird

463/pump gas/SD 325 E-heads/266-272 SR cam/1050 Dominator/3.73/ET Street Radials/1.37 60'/6.30@108.80/9.93@135.14

Hot Rod Drag Week finishing averages:
2014 - 11.12 @ 118.56
2015 - 10.84 @ 124.97
2016 - 10.56 @ 127.88
2017 - 10.29 @ 130.74
2018 - 10.29 @ 130.53
2019 - 10.16 @ 132.34
2021 - 10.09 @ 132.69
2022 - 10.13 @ 133.07

9.93 run - https://youtu.be/hII0_UlYM4U


Last edited by firechickenman; 08-11-2016 at 10:43 PM.
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:30 PM.

 

About Us

The PY Online Forums is the largest online gathering of Pontiac enthusiasts anywhere in the world. Founded in 1991, it was also the first online forum for people to gather and talk about their Pontiacs. Since then, it has become the mecca of Pontiac technical data and knowledge that no other place can surpass.

 




Copyright © 2017