[Craig Berkheimer]

Well the 12 bolt took a dump off the line hanging a right. Quite a ride! I discovered the housing were the tubes are slid into split the case. Yes, they were tig welded but I didnt have any support to the outer ends. I understand once you get to this point, you need to start looking at a stronger rear.

Does anyone use a 12 bolt, 60fting in the 1.30s with any long term success? If so, what modifacations have you made.

How about 4130 tubes with both ends welded to the housing and triangular support bars?

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Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association
"For Those Who Live The Legend" www.outlawpontiacs.com


JBP 416ci on Gasoline
#16 Dports 10.8-1 Compression
Weight - 3275
10.5 - 29.5 TIRE
Best ET: 60ft=1.39
1/8 =6.49@104mph
1/4 =10.29 @ 129mph

[This message has been edited by Craig Berkheimer (edited 10-22-2000).]

[David Holmberg]

Nascar uses the 9in because they can change gears quickly, they may try 3 or 4 different gears sets in one day. I have seen many Nascar rear ends break from the driver hitting the gas before the jack is released.

[Hot Rod]

Half-Inch,
It's that 20 pound nitrous bottle full of lead shot that added the 55 pounds to keep from hitting the rear bumper when he leaves!!!! LOL [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] You talk about a heavy hitter( No pun intended ) that 416 is hitting hard!!!!!!

Hot Rod

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Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association
"For Those Who Live the Legend"



[This message has been edited by Hot Rod (edited 10-28-2000).]

[Craig Berkheimer]

Well the 12 bolt took a dump off the line hanging a right. Quite a ride! I discovered the housing were the tubes are slid into split the case. Yes, they were tig welded but I didnt have any support to the outer ends. I understand once you get to this point, you need to start looking at a stronger rear.

Does anyone use a 12 bolt, 60fting in the 1.30s with any long term success? If so, what modifacations have you made.

How about 4130 tubes with both ends welded to the housing and triangular support bars?

------------------
Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association
"For Those Who Live The Legend" www.outlawpontiacs.com


JBP 416ci on Gasoline
#16 Dports 10.8-1 Compression
Weight - 3275
10.5 - 29.5 TIRE
Best ET: 60ft=1.39
1/8 =6.49@104mph
1/4 =10.29 @ 129mph

[This message has been edited by Craig Berkheimer (edited 10-22-2000).]

[John Langer]

Don't laugh, this really works! 8.5 10-bolt, moser 35 spine axels (w/ c-clip eliminators), light weight spool, precision gears, TA cover, 1 billet cap or studded stock caps, weld your axel tubes at the housing, weld a bar from where your ladder bar bracket welds to the tube to the closest point to the front of the housing ( by the pinion shaft)on both sides. lighter and stronger then a 12 bolt, dana or 9". You have to check the alignment of the axel tubes prior to doing any modifications to make sure that they are straight. With the extra money you have left over after selling you 12 bolt, get drunk!

[Craig Berkheimer]

I just got off the phone with Moser. They are now making their own complete 12 bolt with "Fabracated" housing, 4130 tubes welded on the outside and the inside! Any length with any ends. New steel caps. $590.00
I think I'm going this way.

I fiqure with the LPW cover and triangular support, this should do the job.

------------------
Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association
"For Those Who Live The Legend"
www.outlawpontiacs.com


JBP 416ci on Gasoline
#16 Dports 10.8-1 Compression
Weight - 3275
10.5 - 29.5 TIRE
Best ET: 60ft=1.39
1/8 =6.49@104mph
1/4 =10.29 @ 129mph

[David Holmberg]

John L, on a side note: David Henninger Is looking for Karl Owens... If anyone can help...

Have him call David @ 810-757-1961 or page @ 800-892-3767

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That's my story and I'm sticking to it!


[This message has been edited by David Holmberg (edited 10-26-2000).]

['ol Pinion head]

The 8.5 corporates are real similiar to the 12 bolts in construction. The lack of ProGears in the 8.5 limits it's use in many cars which leave on an transbrake. Have personally built 8.5's which ended up in cars running down in the low 10's with spools, aftermarket axles & US Gears. I believe their housing strength is similiar to 12 bolts Chevys. With aftermarket caps& killer axles, LPW cover & bracing, they are tougher than most would expect. Weld the axle tubes to the housings on all of the leaf spring versions, as have even witnessed spun axle tubes in a 13 second street tired Camaro.

Personally like the moly tubed 9"s for verasatility. Dana 60's are alot more affordable to build & I can see their positives.

[Craig Berkheimer]

Scott, everything is reusable. The only thing I trashed was the housing.

------------------
Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association
"For Those Who Live The Legend"
www.outlawpontiacs.com


JBP 416ci on Gasoline
#16 Dports 10.8-1 Compression
Weight - 3275
10.5 - 29.5 TIRE
Best ET: 60ft=1.39
1/8 =6.49@104mph
1/4 =10.29 @ 129mph

[Craig Berkheimer]

My guess is one of the scales are off.

Maple Grove---3275
Mason Dixon---3330




------------------
Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association
"For Those Who Live The Legend"
www.outlawpontiacs.com


JBP 416ci on Gasoline
#16 Dports 10.8-1 Compression
Weight - 3275
10.5 - 29.5 TIRE
Best ET: 60ft=1.39
1/8 =6.49@104mph
1/4 =10.29 @ 129mph

[Bracket Racer]

Craig - That's a real bummer to hear. Frankly, I think your pushing the envelope now as far a what a 12 bolt will take. I'd start looking for a Dana or a 9 inch. So it broke the gear housing where the tubes are welded? Or did the tube(s) just break the weld(s)? Guess this put's the trans-brake project back a little further?

[Scott Misus]

John:

My mind is drawing a blank.

From the tube where the ladder bar (or 4 link) mounts to the forward part of the housing? I'm lost. Please explain how to weld to the iron center section. Or is this a girdle deal, like the tube braces that Gach mentioned?

[Scott Misus]

Doesn't Strange make a drop in 12-boat center section for a 9" housing?

[Half-Inch Stud]

Crysler 8.8 appears to be the most available stout rear, with a decent gear selection.
Otherwise the Heavy, and sloppy-toleranced Dana60. I'd go Dana60 before 9"Ford.

I looked at the 9". Don't like the looks...turns out I'm close to correct, as the only good 9"rears are ones with all aftermarket parts. Like Misus said, likened to the small chevy. Probably wise to leave the 9" with the street rods market, along with small chevys.

The 12Bolt is efficient.
The Big Car rears are tougher...no gears.
If all I need is 3:42:1, then I've got more than enough gear...you'll see. Running 3.31:1 to the high 11's hopefully at atco.

Corporate 10Bolt..sure, go run a Type O too.

When it comes to Musclecar rears; Looks matter...12Bolt, 10Bolt, Dana60, and the old Olds-Pontiac.

Oh, how about those independent rears? any one gonna go to bat for those??

[John Langer]

My pro-mod comment wasn't directed to pro-mod people

[Scott Misus]

Then it would appear that the smartest, most cost effective avenue would be the Moser 12 boat deal. You should be back in the swim a day after receiving your new housing.

------------------
First hillbilly: "I just caught my wife in bed with my best friend..."

Second hillbilly: "You bitter?"

First hillbilly: "Uh, huh. Bit HIM too!"

[Craig Berkheimer]

Then again, I may have been low on fuel at the Grove. In the latter part of this year I've been running almost a full cell of fuel for extra weight in the rear. (15gal cell) I probably have about 12gal in when race ready.

[Craig Berkheimer]

I was on the last pass, 2nd round, to take the 2000 Outlaw Pontiac Drag Series Championship as well! I only needed that round to clinch it. I had a .552 bulb to my apponates .646 He was also a 14 second car. It would have been a kill for sure The Badbird was running dead nuts. The second place dude, Ted McGann, had to win that event to push me out. Wounldn't you know it, he went four more rounds and won the event and pushed me to 2nd place by 9 points. I guess I should have waited to run those 10.20s at Cecil another week.

To answer your question,It broke the housing! Right where GM welds the tube to the housing in that hole. Split it pretty good!
You don't think the 4130 tubes and angle bracing will do the job?

[Craig Berkheimer]

ditto what Scott said.

[Bracket Racer]

There is a kit available I believe to use 12 bolt gearsets in 9 inch housings. The relationship of the ring to pinion on a 12 bolt does not rob as much power as a 9 inch is the reasoning I think.