[Old Blue 66]

I suggest that if anyone ever see's Arnie, don't be afraid to go up and start talking to him. You won't be disappointed.

Cant agree with this more. Arnie is a hell of a guy. A reall class act. I dont think Ive ever met anyone who appreciates his fans more than he does. First time I met him, I felt like I could have known him forever.

[Elarson]

Originally Posted by Brian Baker

More info...I just learned that the Challenger pictured was wrecked and burned to the ground, with Arnie driving. Apparently Arnie got his hands burned up pretty bad in that one too (a little deja vu from his fire in the Tameless Tiger a few years ago...he obviously survived both, but man, those are some creepy odds).

A bit more history...in chronological order:

1) Arnie builds 1st Boss Bird with ram Air V and Turbo 400

2) Arnie gets the Challenger loaned to him. He has Ed Pink build a new hemi....goes match racing with 2-speed Lenco.

3) wrecks Challenger

4) swaps Challenger hemi and trans into Boss Bird to try it.....races a few events this way.

5) A guy that Arnie knows buys the Phil Bonner Torino and convices Arnie to help him convert it into a second Boss Bird. Arnie supplies a body and the Challenger hemi engine. Arnie's own Boss Bird gets converted back to Ram Air V power.

6) Arnie has the Challenger fixed and returns it to it's owner.

7) Other guy sells the second Boss Bird w/o telling Arnie.

8) Arnie's barn burns to the ground with the Ram Air V Boss Bird in it.


Eric

[Steve Barcak]

B Baker states- "Diamond Collision = Rob Bruce...who accepted as payment, Arnie's original Boss Bird body which he then used on his Zombie AA/FC...which was burned up at FCR several years ago and ironically was repaired recently to use as a plug for molding a new body to go on the Boss Bird recreation"

Hmmmm. so the 'original' Boss bird body was used to make a copy? How can that be if the 'original body' was burned to the ground?
Eric has made references too about this 'allegedly original' body......yet, it is stated over and over the the 'original' Boss Bird body was burned to the ground in the fire of 4-72. How can this be so Eric? What are , indeed the facts here?

There seems to be more claims of more than one 'original' body. There can only be one that is , in fact , original, correct? AND, the facts show it burned to the ground. In other words- it is gone.
Perhaps there were more than one made from the mold, I am sure there was. Still, there can only be one original body used on the a Beswick car and it is gone forever, burned to the ground. Arnie told me this himself- "Steve, both the Boss Bird and Super Judge burned to the ground".

I read in a super stock magazine that a new firebird body was donated to Arnie Beswick in '73 or '74. Maybe that is what is being called the 'original' body?
The use of the word original is almost as useless and uncredible as the collector set uses the word 'rare'.

Just want the facts straight here.


Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only....no corporate nonsense!"

[Wareagle]

Originally Posted by Elarson

A bit more history...in chronological order:

1) Arnie builds 1st Boss Bird with ram Air V and Turbo 400

2) Arnie gets the Challenger loaned to him. He has Ed Pink build a new hemi....goes match racing with 2-speed Lenco.

3) wrecks Challenger

4) swaps Challenger hemi and trans into Boss Bird to try it.....races a few events this way.

5) A guy that Arnie knows buys the Phil Bonner Torino and convices Arnie to help him convert it into a second Boss Bird. Arnie supplies a body and the Challenger hemi engine. Arnie's own Boss Bird gets converted back to Ram Air V power.

6) Arnie has the Challenger fixed and returns it to it's owner.

7) Other guy sells the second Boss Bird w/o telling Arnie.

8) Arnie's barn burns to the ground with the Ram Air V Boss Bird in it.


Eric

Arnie did'nt have very good luck in the early 70's--Damn that fire.

[Elarson]

OK, Steve....I, too believe in the accurate facts.

Arnie owned (3) '71 Trans Am funny car bodies. The first one was on the RA-V car and burned in the fire. The second one was on the hemi car that got sold w/o Arnie's permission. This body still exists. The third body was donated to Arnie after the fire and Arnie never drove it down a track. This third body is the one that we are using to make a mold.

This third body was owned by Arnie until the late 90's.
Arnie wanted this body to be used to re-create the Boss Bird.
Arnie endorses, approves and is excited by our efforts.
We came up with some alternatives to make a new body that had zero connection to Arnie, but chose to go to the extra expense to use this one.

There's the straight facts. Now, it's up to everyone out there to decide which way the hair should be split; as to originality.

Eric

[Elarson]

When our funny car is finished, we will never use the word "original" to refer to it....just as we have never tried to fool anybody that our "Grocery Getter" re-creation is "original".

Eric

[Brian Baker]

Rob took receipt from Arnie, and owns said body I was discussing...it's the one Rob burned up that is being repaired to serve as a plug for Eric's new body.

[Elarson]

Originally Posted by Brian Baker

Rob took receipt from Arnie, and owns said body I was discussing...it's the one Rob burned up that is being repaired to serve as a plug for Eric's new body.

True....and when VFN is done making the mold, that body (the "third, former Arnie Beswick" body) will be returned to Rob.

Eric

[Elarson]

Steve:

Is that a satisfactory disclosure? Or do you still have questions that you think need to be cleared up? I don't want to leave the impression that we're trying to deceive anybody.

Eric

[Steve Barcak]

Hey Eric,

I consider you my friend and am not say you are deceiving. I have the highest regard of both you and Mike and I think you know that.
It is just these facts should be known as there are so much crud out there that is so wrong.

Several months ago I got bashed here, Jim Zeek even called me a name ( he got hot faced because he did not know his facts in this issue), for just trying to show facts about Mr Beswick. People get misled and think I hate him. Wrong, in fact, very wrong. That thread was thought to have a V in it and Beswick driving. I added I thought it was a Chrysler and , perhaps, not Beswick driving. People didn't like that but, it turned out to be true. some people here apparantely have an issue with the truth. Showing the true is NOT bashing, is it?
Back the the body issue-
So, you state that Arnie had 3 bodies but, that is 3 bodies over time, not at he same time. The 'third body' was donated to A Beswick well after the fire and was never used on the Boss Bird or even built by him, just donated.
This isn't really splitting hairs because of each different bodies use.

Using the word "Original Boss Bird" in reference to any Boss bird body alive today is, infact, not true. The original is long gone and can never return.



You know I support, encourage and look forward to seeing the new Boss Bird go together and always have.

Keep us posted on progress.

Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

[Steve Barcak]

All this brings up another very related question-

What about the '70 Tyree body? There were a few others used too. Were they all from the same company or did 2 companies make a 70 Firebird Funny car body.

I will have the '68 Tyree Firebrid funny car body on display at Pontiac Heaven X for the first time in April here in Phoenix.

Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only...no corporate nonsense!"

[Brian Baker]

Steve, I don't think Eric was misleading, not even unintentionally. If anything, the information I posted could have been. I merely posted what was directly told to me by Rob Bruce himself, that the body he has he got directly from Arnie in exchange for some work he did for Arnie, and that it was the old "Boss Bird" body. As to how or why Rob believed it was the original body, I can't say...I don't know...it certainly wouldn't be the first time anyone was misled as to the originality of a Pontiac body however.

Rob was instrumental in my finding out the history of my funny car as well. pointing me to the path of the original owner, Dick Rosberg.

[pont406]

Eric,were you stating the Hemi Boss Bird is still exsiting? or is it M.I.A ? I would imagine alot of the "flip top" funny car teams, back then, had at least one spare body stashed away "just in case". if the Hemi Boss Bird surfaced, it could still be considered a "Boss Bird" F/C, as people like "Jungle Jim" and others had more than one car, (east coast/west coast) at the same time.

[johnta1]

Is the Fabulous Firebird's Funny car a newer one or an old Bird body?

[Steve Barcak]

Brian B states- "Steve, I don't think Eric was misleading, not even unintentionally.... "

I was not implying he was.

However, for the average 'Joe' who sees Eric and Mikes car over all these years. They think it is Arnie Beswicks car. I wonder what the percentage of average spectators who see the Grocery Getter, and the future Boss Bird, actually know it is not owned, tuned, driven or paid for by Arnie Beswick? That is misleading. I do not see how it can be denied. Further, I am not being critical, just factual. If my facts are incorrect, please respond so everyone can get 'in the know'. Mike Garblik and Eric Larson are the 'stars' of the Grocery Getter, not Arnie Beswick. They are the ones who deserve recognition for their great success with this car. Yet, besides the Pontiac gear heads in the know....who else really knows this?

Brian B also states-

".... I merely posted what was directly told to me by Rob Bruce himself, that the body he has he got directly from Arnie in exchange for some work he did for Arnie, and that it was the old "Boss Bird" body. As to how or why Rob believed it was the original body, I can't say...I don't know...it certainly wouldn't be the first time anyone was misled as to the originality of a Pontiac body however...."

I understand. again, I am just trying to establish the actual facts.

".....Rob was instrumental in my finding out the history of my funny car as well. pointing me to the path of the original owner, Dick Rosberg."

Good for you!

Brian staes- "More info...I just learned that the Challenger pictured was wrecked and burned to the ground, with Arnie driving. Apparently Arnie got his hands burned up pretty bad in that one too (a little deja vu from his fire in the Tameless Tiger a few years ago...he obviously survived both, but man, those are some creepy odds)."

I will add....Arnie had at least 1 additional serious fire resulting in injuries. It was in '65 when a trans came apart in the '64 GTO. He was hospitalized and began wearing a fire suit afterwards.


John,

the Tyree '70 firebird is now owned by Larry Cooper in , MO. Here is a pic


To add further- correct me if I am wrong. Eric stated recently that the only car Beswick ran or runs with a chevy in it is his '64 GTO. This is not correct, the prior car, the 63 Tempest tiger car is also corporate nonsense powered. The cars he drives are corporate nonsense powered. Whether he owns them or not depends on who you ask. Everyone has a different answer This would extend to othe cars with his name on it.

Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only...no corporate nonsense!"

[Brian Baker]

Steve...speaking of fires, it was also relayed to me that Arnie was wearing golf gloves when his hands were burned in that Challenger fire, which prompted him to wear fire gloves from then on.

Paul Spotts, if you're reading any of this, and haven't done so already, please get your fire suit recertified and up to date, along with boots, gloves, and headsock. Your friends would like to keep you around for awhile should something unfortunate happen with your FED.

[Elarson]

Lots of conversation....that's good.

No offense taken on my part. I agree that we all need to be as accurate as possible.

Concerning the hemi Boss Bird....I know that the body still exists. It was only a body....I have no knowledge what happened to the rest of the car.

Steve...I genuinely appreciate your compliments about our work. Having Arnie's name and history attached to the car opened a lot of doors and captured the interest of the Pontiac crowd. Over the years, we have also run this car at events that were not Pontiac-specific. Casual fans in that environment do not necessarily know Arnie. So the popularity of our Grocery Getter is a combination of Arnie's history and our current efforts. BTW: many of the behind-the-scenes movers & shakers in the industry are more receptive to helping us on our projects when they know we're building/campaigning Beswick car(s).

Concerning the corporate nonsense engine....Arnie has one of these drivetrains and it is in the '64. It was removed from the '63....so I only counted it once. Then Arnie loaned the '63 to Rick Thomas and provided components to refit it with traditional power.

Steve.....I enjoyed your visit here this summer. The garage is pretty much finished and everything is in out of the weather.

I just took delivery of my new SFI-20 suit for the funny car. Already had the -20 gloves and boots. Going to use all of them in the GG. Paul is an important friend...I hope he is properly protected.

Eric

[Brian Baker]

Are we going to bring up Rick Thomas again? It's my understanding that car was bartered to Rick to pay for work Arnie recieved from Rick (much in the same way Arnie bartered the body to Rob Bruce that you guys are using for a plug). The boards got quiet after that information was revealed, and Rick's post in the lobby about it mysteriously disappeared.

Paul missed out on what could have been some interesting race coverage when the POCI convention was held in California a little over a year ago. After having his dragster trailered 3000 miles, he wasn't allowed to race, since his firesuit was out of cert' and I think not the correct type (-15 instead of a -20). The car also had an out of cert' blower restraint. Paul had been allowed to run the car like this at Maple Grove and other local tracks whenever a "nostalgia" meet was being run, and no doubt at Norwalk too, so I guess he figured them California boys would be no different. Hard lesson.

[Steve Barcak]

Eric- I think we understand each other and that is good. I understand your comments. I have never had any of those benefits of knowing the movers and shakers as you say. I did and do most everything myself and on my dime. Of course, I have had a of of help from dedicated friends who believe in me too.
I was going to ask about the shop. That is some shop! I will have something on that caliber after I sell one of my properties and can afford it. I can only imagine what I could do with that much inside space. do you have a current pic? or would you allow me to post the ones I took? pretty cool shop indeed.
I still do most of my work for now in the dirt and outside in the open except for a small machine shop/ shed for my mills, tig machine, etc.

Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only....no corporate nonsense!"

[Elarson]

Steve - I attached a couple of pictures of the new garage. The semi isn't our's...we backed it in there for the photos. I like to go out there when it's dark and stormy.....all of our stuff is clean, dry and well-lit.

Brian - Sorry, but your understanding about bartering with RT is not accurate. I won't share everything that I know or half-know about the RT affair, but I will offer these 2 items (only).

1) The legal system agreed that Arnie still owns the car.

2) Bartering ownership of a complete, famous rolling chassis for some body work on a Chevy truck? Does this pass the filter of common sense?

Eric