[brians]

Originally Posted by Brian Baker

The mounting holes aren't cast-in, so with enough meat in the head, they can be drilled and tapped anywhere you want them...just a matter of changing the program on the machine.

I see what 455-4+1 is talking about. Using it strictly on an aftermarket head is one thing. Bolt it any way you can or want just so it seals.

But using it on a factory head or with the factory bolt locations is another issue. There is no material for the rear bolt. Based on the picture even the middle bolt would not work.

[ho428]

Originally Posted by brians

I see what 455-4+1 is talking about. Using it strictly on an aftermarket head is one thing. Bolt it any way you can or want just so it seals.

But using it on a factory head or with the factory bolt locations is another issue. There is no material for the rear bolt. Based on the picture even the middle bolt would not work.

Exactly, looking at the pics I could not figure out how you plan to secure this intake except maybe 4 bolts per side, two between the front two and rear two runners. No center, no end bolts?

[Brian Baker]

Originally Posted by brians

I see what 455-4+1 is talking about. Using it strictly on an aftermarket head is one thing. Bolt it any way you can or want just so it seals.

But using it on a factory head or with the factory bolt locations is another issue. There is no material for the rear bolt. Based on the picture even the middle bolt would not work.

Oh, for the love of Christ.

You're comparing a factory intake to Lynn's intake with these pics.

What part about "with enough meat in the head, you can place the intake mounting holes anywhere you want" is so hard to understand?

Want to run a factory intake with Lynn's heads? Drill and tap for the factory intake. Want to run one of Lynn's intakes? Drill and tap for that. That's how I'm perceiving it.

Sorry to be so short...but God damn...this is an aftermarket head Lynn is putting out there to try and fit several different applications...not a direct factory replacement. Same goes for his intake, which he has designed for use on HIS head, not the factory head.

[spartazoo]

That makes sense i guess. Looking at the picture, is there enough "meat" on the intake to drill it on the end?

[brians]

Brian:
To use you own words
Oh, for the love of Christ.
What part about of Lynn’s statement is so hard to understand?

Originally Posted by NHRASuperStock455SD

All these intakes will have the stock Pontiac bolt pattern.

Lynn can make his intake and heads any way he wants. They are his to make and sell.
Use them or don't use them. It is not up to me.

Hope he and the parts do great, but 455-4+1 asked a simple question based on Lynn’s statement and for 2 pages he has been getting partial answers.

[ho428]

Brian B, you cannot put your holes anywhere you want, only between the runners it looks like.
You might could stack or stagger and get 4 holes per side, but I wouldn't want to run it with only two bolts per side.
The end runner may be thick enough to counter bore into it some, but until I see one mounted I'm as confused as several others how he intends to secure it.

On the previous page Lynn said

All these intakes will have the stock Pontiac bolt pattern. We are doing the front water neck cross over separately since all our RA-Vs will have reverse cooling.

Personally I don't care if it's factory mounting bolt pattern or not as I do not have factory V heads, but I'm curious as to the actual bolt pattern he'll end up with.


Edit: Typing at the same time as BrianS it seems.

[Brian Baker]

See this? I see all 5 factory mounting locations, plus two more. What's the problem?

[Brian Baker]

See this? I see a prototype intake that is not the final product, but it still has room for the center mounting hole between the two runners. Yes, on the left of the shot there doesn't appear to be enough meat for the outboard mounting hole, but Lynn has said "All these intakes will have the stock Pontiac bolt pattern. We are doing the front water neck cross over separately since all our RA-Vs will have reverse cooling. We will also have the ability to use regular flow cooling." I can't tell what is happening with the right side of the intake in the shot, but again...with enough meat in the head you can drill/tap the mounting holes anywhere you need them.

[455-4+1]

For the love of Christ Brain (even though I am not a God faring man I may well soon have to turn to devine intervention to get an answer on this one)

YES I SEE THE HOLES IN THE HEAD !!!!!. I have commented on both the stock 5 upper holes and the two additional lower holes previously. No issue there

Please tell me how you would fix the flange of the TR outboard of the rear port to "stock mounting location" hole "A" in the picture below

Please tell me you are waiting for the Patent documents to arrive before divulging all to us on your magic "air flange restraint system". Or will it be like the header fix off an accessory mount hole for heads with the missing outer bolt hole and boss ??

The intake shown cannot use the "stock mounting locations".

How hard was it for someone to say...........

"we ommited the rear mounting flange to save money on the prototypes"

"we ommited the rear mounting flange to make the prototypes shorther so they would fit in a box we had"

"we ommited the rear mounting flange on the prototype beacuse we intend to use the other two additional holes in the head to do their job and will use the out ones for another purpose"

"we ommited the rear mounting flange on the prototypes because we forgot about them but lucky its only a prototype and we can alter the cores to include them on the production peices"

Or whatever ????

I promise I wont ask again, I have obviuosly greatly oversimplified a very complex problem I just cant get my head around

[johnta1]

Here's an idea.


Since Lynn is selling the crossover as a separate unit, it would probably be mounted like the exhaust crossover on a RA IV intake.

The bolt hole 'A' would have a bolt with a big washer that spans the crossover and the intake flange.

[Tom Vaught]

That will look like H*ll and work like Chit, IMO, John.
Here is why: If you look at Post #107 the bolt hole is centered over the water cross-over water passage.

You put a big washer on the boss on the water cross-over and all it will do is act like a diving board out on the ends unless it is very thick. Either way it will look like a band-aid for a screw-up.

Tom Vaught

[455-4+1]

Does raise some questions about the front runner / crossover mount also as mentioned ??

The hole I identified as "A" was at the rear in this pic, (note Dissy hole) the water hole here would usually either be a heater nipple, freeze plug or aftermarket "rear crossover deal".

I can almost understand no flange at the front (I have had separate crossovers on all of my engines, makes good sense), just not the rear ??

[mechanickeith]

Also with the thickness of the intake runners, dont think there would be any kind of warpage. Looks like it would bolt down pretty tight.

[Sirrotica]

If Lynn was able to get the project to this stage I doubt he's not thought about how the parts are going to be bolted together. He'll probably be along shortly to explain how he's got it all figured out as soon as he quits laughing at all the others trying to second guess his engineering plans.......................

He doesn't seem like the baling wire and bubble gum type of guy, at least not to me. Just be patient, as Rome wasn't built in a day neither is a resurrected new and improved Ram Air V engine program. This was a huge undertaking for Pontiac to do with all of the resources they had and Lynn is doing it with only his own resources and a few select peoples help. The magnitude of this type of undertaking is pretty amazing and he's doing a great job so far in my opinion.

This project is right up there with what Indian Adventures did with the IA1 block, it's a good thing Pontiac guys aren't quitters or we'd all have 068 cams and D port heads cast iron manifolds with Q Jets......LOL.

[Tom Vaught]

No one has yet to prove that the intake will not clamp down as cast.

The question was: "Will it seal on a production V head", (basically).

That remains to be seen, so why don't we have a bit of patience on the deal and see how the dyno testing goes.

Tom Vaught

[ho428]

Originally Posted by 455-4+1

I can almost understand no flange at the front (I have had separate crossovers on all of my engines, makes good sense), just not the rear ??

Interesting idea though, connect the banks at the rear and run a single line to the front crossover under the intake.

[NHRASuperStock455SD]

Sorry guys I have been busy and have had limited computer access. There is a rear bolt hole for all intakes, this pictured intake was a prototype intake that was changed. (Isnt that why we do prototyping?) Our tooling guy assures us it isnt required for this intake, but put it in there anyway.

As you can see with the picture of the RA-V head picture, RA-Vs intake bolts are different. They have no bolt hole in front of the front intake port like a traditional Pontiac(Ports too big). I have asked my tooling guy to add as much material to the front in that area to run a small bolt into the head if they wish to add one themselves. Yes we previously added two extra bolt holes to the center area if so desired.

Cross overs will be separate. This allows us to do the Reverse Cooling or traditional Pontiac cooling as our customers wish. It also allows flexibility of using a stock intake on our heads.

We have done as much as we can to make these interchangeable with the OEM stuff as possible while also adding the new technology to the new head(raising the ports). We aren't perfect and we appreciate everyone's input. It keeps us on our toes!

All questions and points appreciated!

[NHRASuperStock455SD]

What do you guys think of an exhaust manifold set that are tubular? They would be about the same size as the factory exhaust only with optional collectors flanged or with the new style connectons? We are definitely doing them, and need your input.

We did a prototypen for a car my son is working with Turbo pipes included. I can post pictures next few days.

[Dragncar]

Just keep it up Lynn, when are we going to see the results of all your hard work with numbers.
I want to see what these heads can do with a IA2 or MR1 on pump gas.
If we only had people at Pontiac like you when it all went away maybe it would never have all went away.
The effort that has been put into this, and the people chirping that it would never happen, or the peoples money is gone, with where its stands right now, has got to feel good.
Thanks, its mind boggling if you think about it.
Takes a crazy person.
Or a real honest to goodness Pontiac person who put their money where their heart is.

[tom s]

Lynn,I think virtually anything that will fit GTOs and Gen !! birds would work.A good pattern would be the tubular ones made for the 63 Tempests and the NASCAR big cars.Almost like a shorty header.Tom