[roundportponchos]

My 78

[Bentwheelbob]

Well, the engine isn't out yet, but it's close. I think MPD and I were both suffering from too much Thanksgiving turkey, but we got a lot done. Underhood everything is pretty much stripped down and ready. All that's left is to remove the brake booster, disconnect the clutch, unbolt the trans and crossmember, take the head pipes off, and pull the motor mount bolts. By noon tomorrow everything should be out and the engine on the stand.

A couple of things:

1) It turns out the radiator is a replacement. Therefore, I am looking for a FD 3 core radiator. Anybody have one let me know please.
2) Engine paint color looks weird. Almost like 72-73 Pontiac engine color. At some point the intake and valley pan were removed and repainted a dark blue, but the rest of the engine is light greenish 72-73 blue. When they repainted the intake they left the throttle bracket on and under it you can see the original color very well. you can also see it on the front of the heads where the brackets were installed. I've done some research, and a lot of it tends to point toward these engines not being what is generally considered to be corporate blue. I've still got a set of samples left from the 72-73 paint experiment that I'll break out tomorrow.

Here's a few pictures, including one of MPD saluting the thugs in Ferguson....We both loved the joke in the Lobby about how when they looted the Payless Shoe Store they left the work boots untouched.

[Bentwheelbob]

Originally Posted by 2manyT/A'S

.....and I feel that BWB might be capable of this act.....

You just might be right. MPD and I talked about this some today, and the more I think about it the more I like it. If I go with a donor block then I can beat on this thing with impunity and without guilt. I think I like that idea. In fact I know I do....

[Alvin]

I've really enjoyed this thread from day 1, and greatly appreciate the humor and contributions here.

IIRC - there were 1267 '78 Y88 4-speeds made...(HERE) so I'm wondering out loud what the current survivor ratio/number is?

Any WAGs?

[2manyT/A'S]

I've always felt that 78 W72's (especially 4 speeds) will have the MOST potential to appreciate in the 75-81 arena....

I'd say that 78 T/A pricing (especially with W72 4 speed) has risen substantially in the last 5-7 years.....

[2manyT/A'S]

Cant' remember if we touched on correct engine color here previously....but there is NOTHING currently available in a rattle can that's real close.....

[The Boss]

Similar to the picture you sent me from the road to the nationals. As usual, he's doing the dirty work.

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by Bentwheelbob

You just might be right. MPD and I talked about this some today, and the more I think about it the more I like it. If I go with a donor block then I can beat on this thing with impunity and without guilt. I think I like that idea. In fact I know I do....

That's the spirit!

[Grand73Am]

Originally Posted by Bentwheelbob

All that's left is to remove the brake booster,

You don't have to remove the brake booster unless you just want to. I didn't when pulling my engine out.

[Grand73Am]

Originally Posted by 2manyT/A'S

Cant' remember if we touched on correct engine color here previously....but there is NOTHING currently available in a rattle can that's real close.....

I didn't like the match from the rattle can "corporate blue" engine paints that I tried either. The rattle can color was too light and too blue, compared to some surviving original engine paint that was still in decent condition on my 79 TA's valve covers. The factory corporate blue has a slight greenish tint to it, and is a little darker than the rattle can paint. So, I took one of the valve covers to my local PPG auto paint store where they matched it and mixed up a quart in single stage urethane. Now the paint color looks right. Costs a lot more to do that, since not only does the paint cost more, but there's hardener and reducer to buy also(which I already had from previous projects, fortunately). I also prefer to prime the engine with a coat of epoxy primer first. So, that's one way to do it.
Also, for those that don't know, using automotive refinishing paint, like I'm doing, is fine to paint your engine with. It doesn't have to be high heat special engine paint. The engine doesn't get hot enough to hurt the paint.
Of course the exhaust manifolds do require high heat exhaust manifold paint, or ceramic coating, that doesn't burn off, if you're going to protect them from rusting.

[68ragtop]

Like so many others, I like to use silver hi temp paint on the bare cast exhaust ports. No primer, nothing. just high temp on with the blue on top of that. Yes, the blue will burn off, but its nice to see silver underneath & its pretty easy to touch up then & not as prone to rusting. I use DP90 on the rest of the engine, then color.

I did a rotisserie resto that I completed in 2008. I used polyester filler on dings & pits in the oil pan, then epoxy primer & paint. No issues whatsoever.

[Bentwheelbob]

Originally Posted by Alvin

I've really enjoyed this thread from day 1, and greatly appreciate the humor and contributions here.

IIRC - there were 1267 '78 Y88 4-speeds made...(HERE) so I'm wondering out loud what the current survivor ratio/number is?

Any WAGs?

Alvin - Thanks. I appreciate all the help you have provided. Glad you're enjoying the ride.

Originally Posted by The Boss

Similar to the picture you sent me from the road to the nationals. As usual, he's doing the dirty work.

Chris - I thought you might appreciate that picture and wondered if you might feel a personal connection - hah.

Originally Posted by Grand73Am

You don't have to remove the brake booster unless you just want to. I didn't when pulling my engine out.

Thanks for the advice, but I was going to remove it anyway to replace it with a fresh, new booster and master cylinder as part of the under hood cleanup. I read with interest your paint match post. Do you still have the mix formula on your blend?

================================================== =======================================

Well, the engine and transmission are now out. No big surprises or stories. A few comments though in no particular order:

1) Speaking of brake boosters - man, what a pain to remove them on Fbodies. Four little nuts that take about an hour to remove. If Joey theWelder wasn't deer hunting we would have had him make an extended 9/16" wrench. I'm not sure how we will get the nuts on when the new booster gets installed.

2) Next in order of difficulty was removing the frame mount portion of the motor mounts. Again, I'm not sure how we will get the nuts installed when we put the new mounts on.

3) I'm not sure what has gone on with this engine, but it is clear that not only have the intake and valley pan been off, but the heads have also been off in the past. If you look back at one of yesterday's pictures you can see that the head gasket has no paint on it. I posted another picture below.

4) Everything under the hood looks good. Sort of like the floor pan and rear of the car when we cleaned off the grease and undercoating. The Front end will clean up nicely, and with the exception of the battery tray there is no real rust or rot. On the firewall you can see an original white inspection paint mark.

5) On top of the crossmember was something stuck in the grease. On closer inspection it turned out to be the bottom half of a sparkplug. Based on the quantity of grease it was trapped in that plug undoubtedly came from the prior century.

The fun continues. Here the pictures...

[Grand73Am]

Originally Posted by Bentwheelbob

I read with interest your paint match post. Do you still have the mix formula on your blend?

================================================== =======================================

Well, the engine and transmission are now out. No big surprises or stories. A few comments though in no particular order:

1) Speaking of brake boosters - man, what a pain to remove them on Fbodies. Four little nuts that take about an hour to remove. If Joey theWelder wasn't deer hunting we would have had him make an extended 9/16" wrench. I'm not sure how we will get the nuts on when the new booster gets installed.

2) Next in order of difficulty was removing the frame mount portion of the motor mounts. Again, I'm not sure how we will get the nuts installed when we put the new mounts on.

The paint I'm using is PPG's Shop-Line brand in single stage urethane (JAU). The color they found that's a close match is a Land Rover color. The name of the color is Tuscan Blue and the code is 16513. That's what they started with. I think they added a dab of yellow and black to make a better match with the valve cover I provided. So, since there was some tinting done to match the sample color, there's not an exact formula.

For the booster nuts, I have some "gear wrenches" with pivoting heads that I got from Harbor Freight that makes the job easier.

For the motor mount bolts, I prefer to put the bolt in from underneath and put the nuts on top. Much easier than trying to start nuts up inside the frame.

[roundportponchos]

Hi. Bob, if you come up with correct rattle can blue, or formula let me know... I will need in upcoming months.
Thanks

[roundportponchos]

Hi. Bob, if you come up with correct rattle can blue, or formula let me know... I will need in upcoming months.
Thanks

[78 TA KID]

Here is a picture of my 48K 78 W72,4SPD,WS6 T/A untouched motor if you want to see the correct engine color. Hope it helps you guys restoring these wonderful muscle cars.

[burd]

Nice car Bob, what does your trunk mat look like? Black or Aqua grey?

[Alvin]

Originally Posted by Bentwheelbob

You just might be right. MPD and I talked about this some today, and the more I think about it the more I like it. If I go with a donor block then I can beat on this thing with impunity and without guilt. I think I like that idea. In fact I know I do....

Post # 8 on this thread http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=765459 may be of interest to your "alternate Pontiac engine universe" option suggestions.

[Bentwheelbob]

Originally Posted by burd

Nice car Bob, what does your trunk mat look like? Black or Aqua grey?

It has black nylon carpet which I think was standard on Van Nuys cars. I'm sure this is original as the trunk is completely unmolested. Wish the other end looked this good under the lid.

Originally Posted by Alvin

Post # 8 on this thread http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=765459 may be of interest to your "alternate Pontiac engine universe" option suggestions.

Thanks Alvin. I watched this thread with interest yesterday and have already spoken to Len Williams today. As it turns out he has an XX block in stock and I am a hair trigger away from giving him a committment on a stroked 400 short block.

[2manyT/A'S]

[QUOTE=Bentwheelbob;5313818]It has black nylon carpet which I think was standard on Van Nuys cars. I'm sure this is original as the trunk is completely unmolested. Wish the other end looked this good under the lid.


FWIW......I've yet to meet ANY 78 F-cars that came from the factory with black trunk mats....especially VN builds........and i've looked at ALOT of them.

The first time something dirty or ugly got loose in the trunk.....the original grey one got tossed....likely for a black one from the junkyard....JMO