[Lloyd-TX]

Originally Posted by scott70

the difference between the pontiac 360 hp and 370 hp 70 455 was the heads,#15's had small valves and pressed studs,#64's had big valves and screw in studs,the valve size alone is more hp.Plus the gto version you could get the 068 cam with a manual trans,again more power over the 360 hp version.Plus all the gto /gp 370 version came with 4 bolt main caps.I bought my 70 455 4 speed bone stock.I tried it at the track a few times and had someone mention to recurve the dist.He helped me do it at that time,(20 years ago)and i remember taking the original advance springs out,they had so much tension,i had to use pliers and pull hard to get them off.(i still have the originals)He told me he couldnt see how the thing would ever total advance.It knocked a few TENTHS just redoing the dist.,something they should have done better at the factory.Ran mid 13's pretty well stock.

The '70 GTO 455 engine was rated 360 HP, no matter TH400 or 4-speed equipped, Ram Air or no. All had cast# 64 big valve heads. The exact same engine was rated 370 HP in the GP, once again with the 64 casting heads. #15 casting heads were full size only, small valve standard engine rated 360 HP. The 370 HP engine was available on fullsize cars as well, with #64 heads, etc.

[P@blo]

Is the #64 head considered a performance head or would a 6X be better ?

[Lloyd-TX]

The #64 cylinder head is a great D-port head, on a 455 or larger engine. 87CC chambers, 2.11/1.77 valves and screw-in studs were all standard fare. Great setup for a pump gas 455+ engine.

Two downsides - it's a farely uncommon and sought-after casting so be prepared to pay for a pair.
The only other issue is that there is a boss "missing" from that casting (and all pre-1971 castings) which allows the use of '71 and later alternator and accessory brackets and pulleys. One can run the later accessory setup without that boss - which has a threaded hole for the alternator thru-bolt, but this destabilzes the accessory mountings and can cause belt flipping or throwing.

[Judge273]

70ra455: The prices are crazy, and I agree that a Baby Blue benchseat poverty capped 70 W-30 HT can get 105K is awfully tall money! The Green 4 sp 70 RA IV was for sale at the GTOAA Nationals in July, and can't get a sale at 88K? It is fully restored numbers matching engine, nicely optioned except for color? Here are some pictures I took of that car.

The same is true for 71-72 GTO 4-speed 455 HO cars, and they would be lucky to break 50K.

[P@blo]

Thanks Lloyd, much appreciated.

[68addict]

Thanks Judge 273, now those numbers are even more impressive!!! BTW I love this thread.

[BLKBRD]

Five years ago I sold my 100% numbers matching '70 442 W-30 auto Sebring Yellow on Black for $7500.00.

[Lloyd-TX]

Originally Posted by Judge273

70ra455: The prices are crazy, and I agree that a Baby Blue benchseat poverty capped 70 W-30 HT can get 105K is awfully tall money! The Green 4 sp 70 RA IV was for sale at the GTOAA Nationals in July, and can't get a sale at 88K? It is fully restored numbers matching engine, nicely optioned except for color? Here are some pictures I took of that car.

The same is true for 71-72 GTO 4-speed 455 HO cars, and they would be lucky to break 50K.

IMO, it's all about having the car "in front of" the right buyer at the right time. If that RA IV car is everything it's supposed to be, it should bring near $100K or even more, even in the fall/winter season. Just gotta fine the right buyer.

I paid $52K for my Sundance GTO (455HO / M22, w/ A/C) in May of this year, and was offered $60K before I even had the car in my possession. I believe the "right" buyer would pay $70K-$75K for it right now, and next spring even more.

[gloryrestoparts]

a few misc points/ramblings.

- the W-30 455 is NOT a round port motor. The only round port Olds was I believe the W-43 455 dual overhead cam that never made it to production. I guess you can compare that to the RA V, although RA V pieces/motors are out there. I think there is only 1 or 2 W-43 motors out there and they are in museums.

- In the list that Mike (Judge273) posted, the 69 W-30, those cars are PIGS and you can't compare that to ANY Pontiac/Buick/AMC etc. It's apples and oranges in the truest sense. The 68 and 69 W-30 used a COMPLETELY different 400 Olds motor than the 66-67 W-30 400 and obviously the 70-72 455 W-30. The 68 and 69 W-30 cars are horrible for performance. Those small bore 400 were an attempt at emissions as Olds sunk their engineering into the W-31 350 in 68 (aka 68 Ram Rod). Once they saw how phenominal those cars were from a performance standpoint, they started marketing the W-31 package in 69 more. And the same with 70. (I have a 69 W-31 and possibly the only powder blue car out there. I'm also building a 70 W-31 that will be a lot more towards the NHRA limits for Factory/Pure Stock so I can go pick on some big blocks :-)))) eventually I'll do a Poncho for Pure Stock or FAST)

Mike, great info and times you posted. I get the feeling you REALLY want to take one of your cars to the Factory Stock or Pure Stock race. If you are interested, there is a FAST/Factory Stock race in Martin, MI in June. I have a truck and trailer and my W-31 won't be ready for Martin. Stanton, hopefully thats a different story. You'll probably see Dan in Martin too. Let me know and we can work out the details. I'm also trying to convince a friend to bring out his 62 GP 389 tri-power auto car.

[scott70]

Originally Posted by Lloyd-TX

The '70 GTO 455 engine was rated 360 HP, no matter TH400 or 4-speed equipped, Ram Air or no. All had cast# 64 big valve heads. The exact same engine was rated 370 HP in the GP, once again with the 64 casting heads. #15 casting heads were full size only, small valve standard engine rated 360 HP. The 370 HP engine was available on fullsize cars as well, with #64 heads, etc.

Ive always thought that was screwy the way they rated them.The gto engine had the same 360 rating as the #15 headed 455 in a bonneville,ect.And yes,the gp had the same engine as the gto but rated at 370....for what reason??????Obviously to boost power over the standard 360 hp ,70 455(#15 head),they made the better #64 head but kept the same 360 rating as the standard 455 .They either had their reasons or somebody wasnt payin attention.