[poison heart]

That's great stuff. Did Pontiac get back into the factory racing stuff in the '60s? I read about the "swiss cheese cars." Were those factory or aftermarket? What year were those?

[Steve Barcak]

Poison- "That's great stuff. Did Pontiac get back into the factory racing stuff in the '60s?

No, they were not allowed until about 1985 after the Pontiac V-8 was killed. Then Pontiac started developing racing parts based on the chev engine, that is what I have labeled "corporate nonsense!" ( a nice way of saying corporate BS). Now, I am talking about factory race cars and parts. There were individuals and dealerships who raced Pontiacs after the Jan '63 ban but, they were mostly in the lower classes as the higher classes generally went to the Fords and Mopars who were constantly coming out with wilder, tricker stuff like HEMIs, SOHCs, tunnleports, Boss 429, 302, etc, etc. the Pontiac could not run with them as they were only offering and selling street cars while Mopar and Fomoco offered street cars and factory race cars. The '68 HEMI Cudas and Darts and the '64 427 Thunderbolt Fairlanes are some examples.




I read about the "swiss cheese cars." Were those factory or aftermarket? What year were those? They were factory built and are generally accepted as the zenith of Pontiac racing, at least for the full size models. The 421 Tempest were really something but, Pontiac only made about a dozen of them before the ban. My understanding is many more were planned to be made. Because of their limited production, they were not allowed to run in the A/FX classes, had to run modified production. They were made a few months prior to the ban. More were planned but, the ban stopped everything.

[Brian Baker]

These need no introduction, however...in looking at the chassis under the Super Judge, I'm wondering if it was the same chassis that was later under the Boss Bird?

[Brian Baker]

Here's another one that is mostly unknown by the Pontiac community. A Hemi powered Challenger that Arnie campaigned briefly in 1971. The car was owned by Vic Ferris from NY (Vic was allegedly connected with some "wise guys"). A before shot when Vic first campaigned it, and an after shot repainted when Arnie campaigned it. The car was destroyed over the July 4th weekend 1971 at a race in Union Grove, WI. See accompanying article from the July 17th, 1971 edition of Drag News.

[Brian Baker]

This one I have zero information on. Can anyone help?

[Jack Gifford]

As Brian said, it's not about disliking any fellow members here. I was trying to say that Mickey DID make Pontiacs more popular WHEN he was racing them (up to early '63). From about '59 to '63, Pontiac V8s were THE engine of choice- hotrodders were stuffing them into all sorts of vehicles- they couldn't have been any more popular.

[GonicGM]

Originally Posted by pontiac jack

...From about '59 to '63, Pontiac V8s were THE engine of choice- hotrodders were stuffing them into all sorts of vehicles- they couldn't have been any more popular.

I remember a period magazine with a how-to article for transplanting a 389 into a Vette (58-60) for increased power.

[GonicGM]

Originally Posted by Brian Baker

Here's another one that is mostly unknown by the Pontiac community. A Hemi powered Challenger that Arnie campaigned briefly in 1971. The car was owned by Vic Ferris from NY (Vic was allegedly connected with some "wise guys"). A before shot when Vic first campaigned it, and an after shot repainted when Arnie campaigned it. The car was destroyed over the July 4th weekend 1971 at a race in Union Grove, WI. See accompanying article from the July 17th, 1971 edition of Drag News.

Off the Pontiac subject for a moment but while on Challengers...
The Hills Brothers campaigned an early Challenger AA flopper circa 1971-1974, it was white and had a very unique feature I was only aware with on that car. The car ran the northeast, I believe that car was based in the northeast as well. Does Brian or anyone remember the car or the feature?

[Brian Baker]

I'm not familiar with that one, Gregg...but I will see what I can find out for you.

[sdbob]

The racing in 62/63 was power to weight.The Pontiacs were heavier by design for street use. The Mopars were lighter so the development of the 'swiss cheese Cats'. The tempests were better-if you ever could get a picture of Arnies 63 station wagon the rear tailgate tells the story about the Mopars.Listen -Listen to theMopars Cry as the equal weighing Pontiacs go by'.From the stories I read the initial clasification was SuperStock-A.For these tempests but no one had ever heard of the auto-manual trans.Remember the one maker was putting large amounts of money( when you get beat by technology you cry for equal playing field) into advertising so these 63's were moved to A/FX then to MP.The literature I've read the first tunnel ram intake was the 63 'Bathtub' for these Pontiacs.If you get Arnies disc he tells the story.Imagine whopping up on all the big factory cars by a little "farmer".They were not happy!

[Brian Baker]

Originally Posted by GonicGM

Off the Pontiac subject for a moment but while on Challengers...
The Hills Brothers campaigned an early Challenger AA flopper circa 1971-1974, it was white and had a very unique feature I was only aware with on that car. The car ran the northeast, I believe that car was based in the northeast as well. Does Brian or anyone remember the car or the feature?

A friend of mine who is much more knowledgable sent me these pictures when I asked about the Hill Bros. He said these are the only pictures he has and if you can determine what made these cars unique from other funny cars of the day to let him know.

[GonicGM]

Originally Posted by Brian Baker

A friend of mine who is much more knowledgable sent me these pictures when I asked about the Hill Bros. He said these are the only pictures he has and if you can determine what made these cars unique from other funny cars of the day to let him know.

Brian,

The right most image of the three is at New England Dragway in Epping New Hampshire. Who knows, maybe I was there that day/night! I don't know if they had more than one white Challenger through the vintage. The unique feature of the one I remember...

Functional Headlights!

I thought that was the coolest thing, very memorable, very unique.

[Brian Baker]

Here's one that ran at E-town regularly. Sorry for the low quality of the shots as they were taken of a scrapbook that was on display at one of Bruce Larson's dragfests at his old barn in PA. I'm pretty certain that this is the body that eventually became Dave Sano's "Screamin' Insanity". He found it in a NJ junkyard.

[Brian Baker]

Jack, look how the light catches the threads inside those spark plug holes and compare it to the angle which the camera was viewing them from. It certainly gives me the impression the holes are angled, pointing the plug toward the exhaust valve.