[The Champ]

Originally Posted by giddygoat

Take a look at the for sale ads on these trucks, not many chev 3/4 or 1 tons listed to begin with, lot of Fords, most with 150,000 to 300,000 miles on the clock, they are not setting in the shed.

That's one theory.

Another is that the Chevy owners are happy with their "longest lasting, most dependable trucks" and are still using them. The Ford owners are tired of Fixing Or Reparing Daily...

What we do know for a fact is that there are more Chevy's still registered than Fords over the last 30 years - despite the fact that Ford built more trucks.

Which clearly means that more Fords end up in the scrap yard sooner than Chevys.

[giddygoat]

Or another theory, longest lasting, most dependable infrequenly used? They all have thier issues. Guy I do alot of repair work for would never get a Ford, he has a 88 half, a 74? 3/4 ton 6.2 diesel, a 2006 3/4 gas, and a 1 ton Duramax dually and a 1 ton 78 Dually gas 454. The two not having something major go on the engine is the 454 and the 06. The 88 is on at least its 3rd intake gasket and the radio and heating controls have never worked correctly from new. The 6.2 well lets just say he could have bought a brand new truck for all the money that has gone it to that POS. The 06 has been ok no major problems, the Duramax had injector and pump issues, cost was over 4k to fix, he does not drive it in the winter, does not start well, less than 100,000 when that occured.
He drives a citiation for the mileage, typical of GM owners, maybe they just like to keep them around. Just ran a search on Minneapolis Craigs list for Ford Trucks 405 for sale, Chevy Trucks 137, GMC Trucks 84. What does it mean? not sure. Would be nice if there was a way to track the actual mileage driven, registered really does not mean use. I have two GM and one Ford currently registered but mostly drive the Ford.

[sleepy]

True. I have a motor home sitting next to my garage that hasn't moved for four years(no time and costs to much for gas, cheaper to get motel) and the city ordinance says it has to have current plates on it.
The vettes have currant plates(2) and are driven VERY little, the 02 bird convertible has sat with currant plates for two years(fuel pump took a dump three days after i had the trans rebuilt so I parked it)
If I had the 68 bird and the 64GP(restoring both) parked outside they would have to have currant plates too.

[68gtoMN]

Originally Posted by The Champ

That's one theory.

Another is that the Chevy owners are happy with their "longest lasting, most dependable trucks" and are still using them. The Ford owners are tired of Fixing Or Reparing Daily...

What we do know for a fact is that there are more Chevy's still registered than Fords over the last 30 years [cite your source for this "fact"] - despite the fact that Ford built more trucks.

Originally Posted by The Champ

Which clearly means that more Fords end up in the scrap yard sooner than Chevys.

No, it only means that there are more registrations. If you had any training in statistical analysis (yes, I do), you would know that the conclusion you arrive at is indefensible. You have an illogical syllogism at best.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by 68gtoMN

No, it only means that there are more registrations. If you had any training in statistical analysis (yes, I do), you would know that the conclusion you arrive at is indefensible. You have an illogical syllogism at best.

If a truck is not registered, it can not be legally operated on public roads. Ford has already admitted that Chevy has more registrations. It's an accepted fact that Ford built more trucks.

So, while you claim that I have made an illogical syllogism, you have no form of statistical analysis to validate your claim (and Ford's) that Ford has more trucks over 250,000 miles.

Although you tried to claim that the vehicle's registration would document the mileage and prove this assumption, it was a claim that was very easy to discredit, and more of an illogical syllogism than I have made here.

[dennis kirban]

While the debate lingers on what camp has the most trucks on the road.....

At least in America we have choices....

I am sure both GM and Ford make good money on the number of trucks they sell.

Realistically from a marketing standpoint they need them to wear out.....so you will buy another one!

I am sure if enough research was conducted the findings would be some years GM builds the best truck and some years Ford scores......

Every company has winners and losers in their portfolio.....

[email protected]

I got one SUV of each.........

[Tom Vaught]

"Nothing Rusts like a Chevy Truck"

That being said I looked at my 2001 Ranger Super Cab and see that the running boards (the little steps to help old ladies get into the truck) are starting to rust on mine so I guess I will have to get after those in the spring time. Lots of chebbys rotted out at the rear wheel houses. No rust on mine (PLASTIC BED).

I have hauled a lot of sand in that truck with no issues.

Tom Vaught

[455Grandville]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

"Nothing Rusts like a Chevy Truck"

That being said I looked at my 2001 Ranger Super Cab and see that the running boards (the little steps to help old ladies get into the truck) are starting to rust on mine so I guess I will have to get after those in the spring time. Lots of chebbys rotted out at the rear wheel houses. No rust on mine (PLASTIC BED).

I have hauled a lot of sand in that truck with no issues.

Tom Vaught

Yea, everytime I see a Ford it's being used like a truck, the Chebbys I see are suburbia guys who use 'em to go to Lowe's & pick up a few 2 x 4s. I can't count how many old farmtrucks Ive seen that are Fords, but almost never a Chebby. Same goes for all the machine shops and industrial parks I've worked in: Ford trucks when they have to haul heavy material. With Chebbys weak frames they simply will not hold up to the relentless abuse.

Originally Posted by 68gtoMN

No, it only means that there are more registrations. If you had any training in statistical analysis (yes, I do), you would know that the conclusion you arrive at is indefensible. You have an illogical syllogism at best.

Well said; you'd have to know are the variables (how the trucks are used) and how the Ford was used vs. the Chebby. although my sample size is not huge, everytime I see a construction site it's almost always Fords. A truck used in that application will certainly live a harder life then a suburbia truck.

[Brewster]

I picked up my new 2500HD Duramax four door short box last month and so far so good. It blows away my old 2003 Duramax via power and fuel ratios so far.
Love the new truck and thought I'd note it, cant wait to pull something this spring!

[Brewster]

I picked up my new 2500HD Duramax four door short box last month and so far so good. It blows away my old 2003 Duramax via power and fuel ratios so far.
Love the new truck and thought I'd note it, cant wait to pull something this spring!

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by 455Grandville

, everytime I see a construction site it's almost always Fords. A truck used in that application will certainly live a harder life then a suburbia truck.

Same around here....

[wytnyt]

while that has seemed so,lately ive lots of dodges popping up

[hurryinhoosier62]

big hammer,

You REALLY shouldn't compare a 3208 (I've machined HUNDREDS!!) to the 3408. The 3208 is a MID-RANGE diesel, while the 3408 is a HEAVY diesel engine. Apparently, no one has ever told you the Detroit 8V71s and 8V92 were some of the MOST POPULAR and DURABLE OTR powerplants EVER built. Do YOU know WHY Detroit Diesel stopped building them? It had NOTHING to do with durability; they couldn't meet emission specs.How much do you know about locomotives or tow boats? Growing up in S. central Indiana along the banks of the Ohio, you learn a great deal about tow boats. Jeffboat(largest inland shipyard in the U.S.) builds them regularly. They are normally powered by EMD(ElectroMotive Division) V-12s or V-16s (4,500hp -7,000hp). Ever seen one? I have.I used to build the fuel injectors for them along with the older ALCOs. Look at your arm. That's how long the SOBs are. Additionally, they weigh around 100lbs EACH.Care to guess HOW LONG these engines stay in service? ON AVERAGE, 20yrs. The old Fairbanks Morse inline compounds averaged around 5-7yrs. I presume you're going to assert that these engines(EMDs and ALCOs) don't see any loads, aren't you? The average tow boat displaces around 200 tons(400,000lbs). An average barge displaces around 75-100 tons depending on length(144,000-200,000lbs) EMPTY. The AVERAGE 30 barge tow has a total displacement of 3200 tons EMPTY. This same tow can handle a load equal to that carried by 150 tractor/trailer combos. That's 9 MILLION POUNDS!! Remember, these are those "unreliable" V style diesels you CONTINUE to opine about. Yes, the current crop of Class 8, inline diesels are far more powerful and reliable than their V-style predecessors. HOW MANY years of re-engineering and federal mandates did it take to achieve these numbers? I can remember when the NT-855 Cummins was the "hottest" inline you could get and it STILL gave up nearly 70hp to the 8V92s. (250 vs 318). We had customers we built K1250 and K2500 series Cummins for because NO OTHER inline was powerful and RELIABLE enough. They modified their tractors(lengthed the nose by 2ft) to fit these monsters under the hoods. We also built 12V71s for others that needed more power. I'll close with this point. The biggest V-12s I have personally machined are the 12V149 Detroits. We had a contract with Amax Coal to rebuild these monsters. They were used to supply electrical power to coal mines(underground) in S.Illinois. These engines ran 24/7. Even if the mines weren't in operation, the engines and generators had to run to keep the water pumps operating. Try THAT with an inline!!

[hurryinhoosier62]

Brad,

You could be right. Most of the 8V92s we got were 350hp. In fact, we had a couple of late ones that were allegedly rated at 395hp. Either way, the 8V71,6V71s,8V92s,6V92s and 903 Cummins were successfully powering OTR trucks YEARS before emissions regs and fuel costs made them obsolete. Think HOW MANY Petes,Kenworths and Freightliners were built with these engines, ran WAY past 3000hrs (that's only about 2 yrs for an OTR tractor) and went to the scrap heap only because of federal and state emission regs and fuel became too expensive to use them anymore.

[bigunde]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Brad,

You could be right. Most of the 8V92s we got were 350hp. In fact, we had a couple of late ones that were allegedly rated at 395hp. Either way, the 8V71,6V71s,8V92s,6V92s and 903 Cummins were successfully powering OTR trucks YEARS before emissions regs and fuel costs made them obsolete. Think HOW MANY Petes,Kenworths and Freightliners were built with these engines, ran WAY past 3000hrs (that's only about 2 yrs for an OTR tractor) and went to the scrap heap only because of federal and state emission regs and fuel became too expensive to use them anymore.

One more "small" Detroit for ya

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp-qcZr_Wrw

[455Grandville]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Same around here....

Most of the time I see an aftermarket body for heavy use like the above it's on a Ford chassis. You type in "flatbed" on craigslist/e-bay and it's the same thing. There's a pattern -

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Brad,

You could be right. Most of the 8V92s we got were 350hp. In fact, we had a couple of late ones that were allegedly rated at 395hp. Either way, the 8V71,6V71s,8V92s,6V92s and 903 Cummins were successfully powering OTR trucks YEARS before emissions regs and fuel costs made them obsolete. Think HOW MANY Petes,Kenworths and Freightliners were built with these engines, ran WAY past 3000hrs (that's only about 2 yrs for an OTR tractor) and went to the scrap heap only because of federal and state emission regs and fuel became too expensive to use them anymore.

The thing about Detroits is you can rebuild 'em over & over.
If "V" diesels were no good you wouldn't see 'em in marine use as you said.
As far as "undersquare" designs in a big rig think about it : height isn't a problem (stroke) in a long nose, but length is -

[70judgeconv]

I have a 2005 duramax with 228000 miles only replaced an idler pulley. Just bought a new 2011 duramax, best truck ever to date. Fully boxed frame made a huge difference.
My truck plows with a fisher vplow and tows a 17000lb fifth wheel. Both trucks are 2500hd crew cabs. Bought a ford f350 once, it burnt to the ground overnight just sitting there. Never again. Chevy all the way

[hurryinhoosier62]

bigunde,

That's 2 12V71s bolted together with LOTS of custom turbo plumbing. I saw it in "Hot Rod" late last year.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Brad,

The guy out in California we built the "K" series Cummins for had to lengthen the frame and doghouse 2 ft to make enough room for those monsters. 1,250 ci and 2,500 ci!! We couldn't get a reliable dyno reading on them, but best guess was around 550hp for the 1250 and 700 for the 2500. We had one guy the wondered IF you could fit a Cummins V-12 1710 into a truck chassis. That sucker is over eight feet long!!

[455Grandville]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Brad,

The guy out in California we built the "K" series Cummins for had to lengthen the frame and doghouse 2 ft to make enough room for those monsters. 1,250 ci and 2,500 ci!! We couldn't get a reliable dyno reading on them, but best guess was around 550hp for the 1250 and 700 for the 2500. We had one guy the wondered IF you could fit a Cummins V-12 1710 into a truck chassis. That sucker is over eight feet long!!

Isn't the 1710 cid based on the 855 ? (2 put together as a V ?)

The KTA was a huge sob; my great uncle had a Steiger Tiger he bought new in 1985.
I can't even describe what a monster that thing was
It's still in use today last I heard.