[71SportRagtop]

Originally Posted by 77 Canamman

It's the uninformed, like you, in this hobby that make it very aggravating at times. The '73 Buick Gran Sport Stage One was a hot runner, and the 455 GTO in '73 still performed well, clocking high 14's all day long. The 442 L77 455 4 speed ran excellent too. The 5.0's were a boxy joke out of the box, as were everything from the 80's except the GN or GNX.

Too bad there isn't a Supra in your future...

So let me get this straight. I asked for people to make a list of the hot performance cars available from 1972 to the mid 80's other than the SD T/A's. You listed two cars for that 13-14 year period. The 73 Gran Sport Stage 1 and a high 14 second 73 GTO...and this makes me uninformed??

Here's what I googled about the 73 GS Stage 1...

http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclec...-history.shtml

This link says the car ran 15.3 seconds in the 1/4. If that's fast to you then more power to you. Funny thing is that my wife's 4 cylinder WRX, a lot of modern minivans, and pretty much any 5.0 Mustang will smoke that Stage 1 Buick and the 73 GTO that you are calling me uninformed about.

My point was that other than the 73/74 SD T/A's, the 73 and up cars of ALL makes lacked the performance and charisma of the 64-72 models. Sales figures, fan loyalty, and the overall popularity of the 64-72 models would seem to support my statements. Again, I'm struggling to understand how this makes me uninformed.

[77 Canamman]

Originally Posted by 71SportRagtop

So let me get this straight. I asked for people to make a list of the hot performance cars available from 1972 to the mid 80's other than the SD T/A's. You listed two cars for that 13-14 year period. The 73 Gran Sport Stage 1 and a high 14 second 73 GTO...and this makes me uninformed??

Here's what I googled about the 73 GS Stage 1...

http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclec...-history.shtml

This link says the car ran 15.3 seconds in the 1/4. If that's fast to you then more power to you. Funny thing is that my wife's 4 cylinder WRX, a lot of modern minivans, and pretty much any 5.0 Mustang will smoke that Stage 1 Buick and the 73 GTO that you are calling me uninformed about.

My point was that other than the 73/74 SD T/A's, the 73 and up cars of ALL makes lacked the performance and charisma of the 64-72 models. Sales figures, fan loyalty, and the overall popularity of the 64-72 models would seem to support my statements. Again, I'm struggling to understand how this makes me uninformed.

The 15.3 number is from a loaded out automatic. The informed enthusiast would know that the 4 speed Stage One optioned correctly was a beast. This stock '73 is indicative of the 4 speed performance:

http://www.hemmings.com/hmn/stories/...feature18.html

I know the WRX's run well. My friend bought a '12 brand new, and I drove it with 30 miles on the clock. He kept it a year until the paint was literally peeling off the car...

Your "fast" 5.0's, well, weren't..

Here are some factory stock tested cars, as tested from factory by Road and Track, and Hot Rod etc. the first number is o-60 the second is 1/4 mile times.

1987 Ford Mustang GT 6.4 14.4 (Automobile, April 87)
1988 Ford Mustang GT 6.4 15.0 (MT Jan '88)
1989 Ford Mustang GT 5.0l Manual 6.2 14.8 (MT Jan '89)
1990 Ford Mustang LX 5.0 6.4 14.9
1991 Ford Mustang GT 7.3 15.6
1992 Ford Mustang LX 5.0 6.2 14.8
1993 Ford Mustang Cobra 5.9 14.5
1993 Ford Mustang GT (auto) 8.0 16.1


I mentioned 5 cars in my post, not two. Again, uninformed..

Like I said, you really need a Supra.

[71SportRagtop]

Originally Posted by 77 Canamman

The 15.3 number is from a loaded out automatic. The informed enthusiast would know that the 4 speed Stage One optioned correctly was a beast. This stock '73 is indicative of the 4 speed performance:

http://www.hemmings.com/hmn/stories/...feature18.html

I know the WRX's run well. My friend bought a '12 brand new, and I drove it with 30 miles on the clock. He kept it a year until the paint was literally peeling off the car...

Your "fast" 5.0's, well, weren't..

Here are some factory stock tested cars, as tested from factory by Road and Track, and Hot Rod etc. the first number is o-60 the second is 1/4 mile times.

1987 Ford Mustang GT 6.4 14.4 (Automobile, April 87)
1988 Ford Mustang GT 6.4 15.0 (MT Jan '88)
1989 Ford Mustang GT 5.0l Manual 6.2 14.8 (MT Jan '89)
1990 Ford Mustang LX 5.0 6.4 14.9
1991 Ford Mustang GT 7.3 15.6
1992 Ford Mustang LX 5.0 6.2 14.8
1993 Ford Mustang Cobra 5.9 14.5
1993 Ford Mustang GT (auto) 8.0 16.1


I mentioned 5 cars in my post, not two. Again, uninformed..

Like I said, you really need a Supra.

I never said to be the most informed enthusiast. Granted I don't know a lot about the 73 Stage 1 because it's not the kind of car I'm interested in. Same goes for a car like a Porsche, I know that they can go fast but I couldn't quote top speeds or 1/4 mile times because they are not my kind of car.

OK so let's add your high 13 second Buick to the list. So we have the 73 Stage 1, the 87 GN, and the 73 and 74 SD T/A. That gives us 4 cars by my count from 1972 to the mid 80's which were fast. How many cars of all makes and models can we come up with from 64-72 that were considered fast???

You quoted 5.0 Mustang times telling me that they weren't fast but 5 of the 8 cars you listed run mid-high 14's. That's the same 1/4 mile time YOU say is respectable for a 73 455 GTO. So what is your theory? 14.8 is fast in a 73 GTO but slow in a 5.0 Mustang?? You're not making sense.

You're upset because I said that I wasn't a fan of the 73 and I dig that. Nobody wants to hear that someone doesn't like their car. But the bottom line is this: if you ask 100 members of this site what is your favorite year of GTO, maybe 5-6 are going to say the 73. You're PO'd at me for stating what seems to be a fact that the 73/74 GTO's are simply not as popular as the earlier years. I said that I believe that it's directly related to their performance. Tell me then why throughout the Musclecar world it's the faster more performance oriented cars that bring top dollar??

Why does the 454 LS-6 Chevelle bring hundreds of thousands of dollars when the 71 Chevelle SS 350 brings maybe $20-$25K??

Why does the Hemi Cuda bring insane pricing?

Why do Ram Air GTO's and Firebirds bring more money than base models??

Why in the 80's was the 5.0 Mustang SO popular?

IT'S PERFORMANCE.

[Ben M.]

Originally Posted by 71SportRagtop

Why in the 80's was the 5.0 Mustang SO popular?

Ford made SO many of them resulting in them being SO cheap and they were SO easy to modify. Most were 4 and 6 cylinders with some real 5.0s, and a few Cobras and other 5.0s that were true contenders to be reckoned with. The idiots in the high school parking lot who put the 5.0 badges on and tried to act cool were fools then just as the idiots with the 6 cylinder Lemans with the sky high rear were trying to pretend their car was fast 10-15 years earlier. The truly fast cars were always respected (unless daddy was writing the checks ;-) ).