[Chief of the 60's]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

I understand the folks at Pro Systems are Pontiac people. Know them very well.

I never heard that Patrick is a Pontiac fan but he does build one damn nice carb.

He is also the only one I know of that gives you his personal cell number in case you have an issue any time, anywhere and he answers it.

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

I never heard that Patrick is a Pontiac fan but he does build one damn nice carb.

He is also the only one I know of that gives you his personal cell number in case you have an issue any time, anywhere and he answers it.

I hear he is a fan from a good source. Its my understanding the high end Pontiac cabs have extra fuel in the mid range. I have a Dale Cubic 1400cfm carb and talked to Dale about it. He also told me Pontiacs take a higher cfm carb due to their long strokes. Lot of "suck" to them.
I am dealing with Performance Carb and they tell me a 1050 will run better, ET better than a 1150 Vizards program tells me to run. I am sending my 1050 with their billet metering plates that turn a 3 circuit into a 2 circuit back to get calibrated and their annular billet boosters installed with double the holes the Holley ones have. Cost about 375$ to have it done. And they told me they can make sure their is extra fuel in the mid range. Will take calls at the dyno/track for tuning advice.
I hear the billet head/block Visner guys are Pontiac fellows too. Its why they make the parts. Have to love the brand, not much demand for a Pontiac billet block. Make a lot more money building parts for other brands.

[slowbird]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

I hear he is a fan from a good source. Its my understanding the high end Pontiac cabs have extra fuel in the mid range.

What is considered mid range?
On my engine i've had to lean out the intermediate circuit. Both cubic carbs, every engine is different though.

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by slowbird

What is considered mid range?
On my engine i've had to lean out the intermediate circuit. Both cubic carbs, every engine is different though.

I called him asking if the carb I have would work for a dyno test on the 461. He said there was a small chance but it would fall on its face at part throttle.
Asked about Pontiacs needing more fuel, used the term mid range and he confirmed it. Also wanted to know why Pontiacs can take so much carb and he said long stroke. The discussion never got technical just wanted to know if trying the 1400 carb was crazy or not.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

I hear he is a fan from a good source. Its my understanding the high end Pontiac cabs have extra fuel in the mid range. I have a Dale Cubic 1400cfm carb and talked to Dale about it. He also told me Pontiacs take a higher cfm carb due to their long strokes. Lot of "suck" to them.
I am dealing with Performance Carb and they tell me a 1050 will run better, ET better than a 1150 Vizards program tells me to run. I am sending my 1050 with their billet metering plates that turn a 3 circuit into a 2 circuit back to get calibrated and their annular billet boosters installed with double the holes the Holley ones have. Cost about 375$ to have it done. And they told me they can make sure their is extra fuel in the mid range. Will take calls at the dyno/track for tuning advice.
I hear the billet head/block Visner guys are Pontiac fellows too. Its why they make the parts. Have to love the brand, not much demand for a Pontiac billet block. Make a lot more money building parts for other brands.

So what are your specs and which formula or program of David's (Vizard) are you using? If I had that information earlier this morning, I could have ask David when I was talking with him.

Stan

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

So what are your specs and which formula or program of David's (Vizard) are you using? If I had that information earlier this morning, I could have ask David when I was talking with him.

Stan

Engine is the basic specs I gave you awhile back but different cam. .440 lobe, .264.274, 112.
Only thing I know about the dyno program is it is the 800$ version and you are supposed to be a engine builder to get it.
Since I bracket race the 1150 carb is not needed vs the 1050. I should dip into the 9s as is.
Since I am a Native Tribal member they are giving us 1250$ for Covid relief. I could buy the carb but a 650,750, 850, 1050 and 1400 is enough. Need to thin out my carb and intake collection as it is. I sold my NW intake but want another one, I might have a intake fetish/problem. Is there a 12 step program LOL ?

BTW, my carb guy at Performance Cab tells me wet flow on a 1050 is 1121 cfm and a 1150 has 1176cfm wet flow so its not as big a difference as you think. Its one of ghe reasons he tells me the 1050 will ET better with a heavy car vs a little more power on the dyno with 1150. Smaller bores, more velocity get the pig moving.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

Engine is the basic specs I gave you awhile back but different cam. .440 lobe, .264.274, 112.
Only thing I know about the dyno program is it is the 800$ version and you are supposed to be a engine builder to get it.
Since I bracket race the 1150 carb is not needed vs the 1050. I should dip into the 9s as is.
Since I am a Native Tribal member they are giving us 1250$ for Covid relief. I could buy the carb but a 650,750, 850, 1050 and 1400 is enough. Need to thin out my carb and intake collection as it is. I sold my NW intake but want another one, I might have a intake fetish/problem. Is there a 12 step program LOL ?

BTW, my carb guy at Performance Cab tells me wet flow on a 1050 is 1121 cfm and a 1150 has 1176cfm wet flow so its not as big a difference as you think. Its one of ghe reasons he tells me the 1050 will ET better with a heavy car vs a little more power on the dyno with 1150. Smaller bores, more velocity get the pig moving.

I have tried a number of times to get you to tell me who has this program or what this program is called so I can get a better idea of what is being used. For the past few years David has give to the people who attend his seminars his TMC (Torque Master Cams) Program which he also does sell. I did the computer programming of TMC (Torque Master Cams) for David.

Stan

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

I have tried a number of times to get you to tell me who has this program or what this program is called so I can get a better idea of what is being used. For the past few years David has give to the people who attend his seminars his TMC (Torque Master Cams) Program which he also does sell. I did the computer programming of TMC (Torque Master Cams) for David.

Stan

Stan, it does not really matter to me what the program is called. Only thing I care about is the cam recommendation and the estimated horsepower. And that my friend took the time out of his day to do all the inputs. This cam will work with my converter, tires and gears as it. Get it all done under 6700RPM.
If I can make the 720 or so horsepower in a 6500RPM 461 I think it will be an accomplishment. Getting it done on pump gas, no high RPM and without having a bunch of head work with all the expensive offset rockers and lifters would be something.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

Stan, it does not really matter to me what the program is called. Only thing I care about is the cam recommendation and the estimated horsepower. And that my friend took the time out of his day to do all the inputs. This cam will work with my converter, tires and gears as it. Get it all done under 6700RPM.
If I can make the 720 or so horsepower in a 6500RPM 461 I think it will be an accomplishment. Getting it done on pump gas, no high RPM and without having a bunch of head work with all the expensive offset rockers and lifters would be something.

Yes it clearly matters to me as the released version TMC which is David's present software only works for SBC and SBF. There is a beta version which has Pontiac and to the best of my knowledge only 4 people in the world have a copy of it.

Stan

[scott70]

Years ago I bought a brand new standard 2 circuit 1050 dominator from summit and did basic tuning on it for best ETs. Couple of years later I bought a pro systems new from them set up for my combo. Ran exact same numbers at the track. Tried tuning it but it didnt make any difference. The only difference was the PS carb idled a little cleaner/smoother.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

I hear he is a fan from a good source. Its my understanding the high end Pontiac cabs have extra fuel in the mid range. I have a Dale Cubic 1400cfm carb and talked to Dale about it. He also told me Pontiacs take a higher cfm carb due to their long strokes. Lot of "suck" to them.
I am dealing with Performance Carb and they tell me a 1050 will run better, ET better than a 1150 Vizards program tells me to run. I am sending my 1050 with their billet metering plates that turn a 3 circuit into a 2 circuit back to get calibrated and their annular billet boosters installed with double the holes the Holley ones have. Cost about 375$ to have it done. And they told me they can make sure their is extra fuel in the mid range. Will take calls at the dyno/track for tuning advice.
I hear the billet head/block Visner guys are Pontiac fellows too. Its why they make the parts. Have to love the brand, not much demand for a Pontiac billet block. Make a lot more money building parts for other brands.

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

So what are your specs and which formula or program of David's (Vizard) are you using? If I had that information earlier this morning, I could have ask David when I was talking with him.

Stan

Scott,
Just finding to find out what he used. As I would ask David Vizard about it.

Stan

[Scott Stoneburg]

Ok. Just wondering. I didnt see what difference it made. Whats the point of calling Dave V? To prove his formulas wrong or to check to see if Dragn is actually using them?

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Scott Stoneburg

Ok. Just wondering. I didnt see what difference it made. Whats the point of calling Dave V? To prove his formulas wrong or to check to see if Dragn is actually using them?

Scott,
Why would I think David's formula is wrong? How would David even know who Dragncar is? I wanted to talk to David to see if he ever had software that does what Dragncar says he is doing or maybe the software Dragncar is using was not done by David.

If you call Comp Cams give them your specs and they recommend a cam and then you call Lunati give them your specs and they recommend a cam. The 2 cams are not the same. Who is wrong, who is right? Just like with the carb recommendations you would need to dyno or race them to know.

Stan

[Scott Stoneburg]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Scott,
Why would I think David's formula is wrong? How would David even know who Dragncar is? I wanted to talk to David to see if he ever had software that does what Dragncar says he is doing or maybe the software Dragncar is using was not done by David.

If you call Comp Cams give them your specs and they recommend a cam and then you call Lunati give them your specs and they recommend a cam. The 2 cams are not the same. Who is wrong, who is right? Just like with the carb recommendations you would need to dyno or race them to know.

Stan

Dont know how David would know Dragn. But he names drops all the time.

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Scott,
Why would I think David's formula is wrong? How would David even know who Dragncar is? I wanted to talk to David to see if he ever had software that does what Dragncar says he is doing or maybe the software Dragncar is using was not done by David.

If you call Comp Cams give them your specs and they recommend a cam and then you call Lunati give them your specs and they recommend a cam. The 2 cams are not the same. Who is wrong, who is right? Just like with the carb recommendations you would need to dyno or race them to know.

Stan

Get you panties un bunched Stan. This is a thread about Pro Systems. You are fishing and I will not let you dig. Its your problem, not mine.
Don't know David V, know someone who knows him and thats it. Not giving it up either.