[tjs72lemans]

Many of my hot rods I've owned for 40 years with flat tappet cams I've run Valvoline 10-40 and never an issue. My Fiat Spider, I ran Rotella diesel 15-40 oil, as that is what the Fiat guys push. My Pontiac I started with 10-40 Brad Penn and then switched to Driven 10-40, since that is what my engine builder suggested. I asked why the Driven oil stays so clean looking compared to my Valvoline? He said the Valvoline type oils keep contaminants suspended in oil, while Drive oil, the contaminants lay in the bottom of oil pan. I learn new things on oil here and other places I had no idea about. I'm no engineer.

[geeteeohguy]

Originally Posted by tjs72lemans

Many of my hot rods I've owned for 40 years with flat tappet cams I've run Valvoline 10-40 and never an issue. My Fiat Spider, I ran Rotella diesel 15-40 oil, as that is what the Fiat guys push. My Pontiac I started with 10-40 Brad Penn and then switched to Driven 10-40, since that is what my engine builder suggested. I asked why the Driven oil stays so clean looking compared to my Valvoline? He said the Valvoline type oils keep contaminants suspended in oil, while Drive oil, the contaminants lay in the bottom of oil pan. I learn new things on oil here and other places I had no idea about. I'm no engineer.

Detergent oils keep dirt and contaminants suspended in the oil, so that they get drained out of the engine with an oil change. Resulting in a clean, gum-free engine. Non-detergent oils of yesteryear don't, and the dirt and contaminants settle into nooks and crannies and the bottom of the pan. An oil drain leaves them there. Have serviced and worked on many, many engines that ran non-detergent oils back in the day, and they were always a gooey, encrusted mess internally. I seriously doubt that the new Driven oil is non-detergent, but I could be wrong. I would not run ANY non-detergent oil in an any engine I cared about. Brad is right about the by-pass filter, they flat-out work, but most don't want to bother plumbing one into the system for whatever reason.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by geeteeohguy

. Brad is right about the by-pass filter, they flat-out work, but most don't want to bother plumbing one into the system for whatever reason.

Yes, there is no arguing bypass filters work. I don't think anyone here has ever said otherwise. But the reason you're wondering why most don't bother plumbing them in are actually more simple. Being a classic car forum, the majority don't want or can't have that system hanging off the car. It's honestly just not something most can or are willing to do. Most of the restorations I do the customers would be appalled if I even suggested something like that.
Couple that with the fact that most don't drive these cars much more than a couple thousand miles a year at the most anyway, it's just not an absolute necessity.
The by-pass setup is a great system where they make the most sense.

Now if they made something very small and compact and very easy to hide so it's completely out of site, more classic car owners would jump on board. As far as I know there isn't such a system and probably never will be since they generally don't market these things for the classic car world.

On the other hand, if one were to do an oil analysis as I suggested earlier, you could find that optimum oil/filter package and change interval that works best and extend those oil changes to a safe interval and save some money that way, so you aren't changing the oil as frequently and unnecessarily.

That's exactly what I did years ago in an attempt to find a longer safe change interval as my car habit grew, because as mentioned above, it's really not practical to be under the car every 1000 miles changing oil. That's a lot of time and money spent, especially when you have multiple cars. An oil analysis will tell you when it's time, and which brands of oils or filters are working best. It's honestly the next best solution.

[Jay S]

Detergents tend to strip the zinc and Phos off metals. That is why most break in oils are non-detergent oil, and why racing Oils tend to have less detergent. Oil designed for Diesel’s are meant to run with older and newer equipment. The older equipment with mech. injection pumps does not like high detergent because it is hard on the injection pump. On the other side of that, zinc levels were lowered in Diesel oils a few years back when OEM’s started using EGR’s and cats. Higher zinc is not friendly for those. They found other additives the fill those gaps when the zinc levels were lowered. For a gas engine, more or less detergent isn’t necessarily a bad thing, depend on what you doing with your engine. If the oil claim’s “extended milage”, chance are it is really high in detergent. If it is a racing oil it is likely the opposite. It is hard to beat testing the oil to see if it is doing it job.

[Sirrotica]

For the "I could never hide a by pass filter", crowd, I just went out and measured mine. It's just about the size of a one gallon can of paint, not really, I lied......

It's 4 inches in diameter, and 5 1/2 inches tall, with 2, 1/4 inch I.D. lines going to, and from it. I can see why no one could possibly hide one........LOL

I have no idea of how big the opponents think one is, but that's the measurements I just took. In comparison an AC PF 24 is 3.77 inches in diameter, and 4.21 inches tall. To summarize, it's 1/4 inch larger in diameter, and an 1 1/4 inches longer than a stock Pontiac PF24 oil filter.

BTW, I do run one on my 05 GTO, so for the notion that you just have to have an 18 wheeler to run one, not so. I don't have to mount it in a trailer to haul it behind me either............... It's nestled below the master cylinder, between the inner fender, and the left exhaust manifold. If I wanted to hide it, it would be under the front bumper, but that would defeat the ease of changing the media from the top, and not having to raise the car up.

Adding up to 8 times the engine longevity is well worth the effort of a proper filter on anything plus I don't have to crawl under the car to change oil constantly either. I can safely run my oil for years, just putting in a new roll of TP in every year or two. Last time I priced a roll of TP, under a buck even after covid jacked the price of toilet tissue up. It saves me money, time, and I don't have waste oil sitting in gallon jugs to dispose of. Another bonus, virtually zero engine wear, compared to a conventional filter.

Since we quit drilling for oil here, the price of oil has doubled over what it was a few years ago. I buy very little oil for my vehicles that have a by pass oil filter on, and though I do own 3 diesel trucks, they only are dually's, no 18 wheelers in my stable....

The Franz by pass filter is also used as an auxiliary transmission filter by some people, and a diesel fuel filter to remove sub 10 micron particulate that will trash an injection pump in a flash. Generac now includes them in all their units currently, gas, propane, or diesel to help with engine longevity. If anything sits longer than a hobby car without constant running, it's probably an emergency genset.

One other thing is, moisture tends to accumulate in engines that get run infrequently, (hobby cars, gensets). The Frantz, because the media is cellulose, will absorb up to 6 ounces of water, and hold onto it until the oil reaches a high enough temperature to vaporize the moisture to steam, or the media is changed, and it gets tossed.


FRANTZ FILTER ON 396 CHEVY, I BELEIVE ITS A CHEVLLE



On racing, the early Baja 1000 VW based buggies were not able to finish races due to the fine dust ingested during the race because VW only used a mesh screen in the crankcase for filtering oil. Enter the use of Frantz by pass filters, and the engine longevity was increased so they could complete the race. Probably about the furthest use from an 18 wheel diesel you could come up with.

That probably ruins the theory that only OTR 18 wheel tractor trailer diesels can benefit from them.........

I really don't care one way or the other if anyone on this board uses a by pass filter, or not, but the facts about them is what seems to get distorted from reality. They may not be for everyone, and I'm perfectly fine with that. I only wish I had tried them back in the early 70s when I first saw one demonstrated to me. It would have saved me some engines, money, and time. As the Amish say, "Old too soon, smart too late."

[Formulajones]

Um yeah, I don't want to stare at that sticking up in the engine compartment
LOL

It's an accessory that's not originally on a classic vehicle, so it'll look out of place if not hidden. Not something I'd be able to talk the next guy into that comes in here with a 6 figure car. It's not so much that I couldn't hide it, it's more of a question of who wants it on some of these high dollar cars where appearance is just as important, and not driven enough anyway.

For that to work, it literally has to be completely out of site, lines and all. I'm not apposed to doing that, I just haven't found the need for me personally, and have found very few others that even care enough to go through the effort.

Maybe they need to design something a little less intrusive or....??

Probably the reason I don't see this stuff marketed towards the classic car world, there just wouldn't be enough interest in it's current state.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

Um yeah, I don't want to stare at that sticking up in the engine compartment
LOL

It's an accessory that's not originally on a classic vehicle, so it'll look out of place if not hidden. Not something I'd be able to talk the next guy into that comes in here with a 6 figure car. It's not so much that I couldn't hide it, it's more of a question of who wants it on some of these high dollar cars where appearance is just as important, and not driven enough anyway.

For that to work, it literally has to be completely out of site, lines and all. I'm not apposed to doing that, I just haven't found the need for me personally, and have found very few others that even care enough to go through the effort.

Maybe they need to design something a little less intrusive or....??

Probably the reason I don't see this stuff marketed towards the classic car world, there just wouldn't be enough interest in it's current state.

If you want to talk about day two equipment, there were a few original owners that did install them in musclecars. I would have, if I wasn't so resistive to using a by pass oil filter back in the 70s....Yes, I too didn't use them then, didn't believe it would make a difference.

I know what type of cars you work on, and no they weren't offered. The only exception was on the 4 cyl 194 Tempests, Pontiac had a provision that eliminated the oil filter with a block off plate so that the owner could use a aftermarket by pass filter. Pontiac didn't install the filter, they just made the provision for the owner to install the by pass filter of their choice, and only on 194 engines, although the block off plate will fit Pontiac Stratostreak V8s.

Being the media has to be about the size of a roll of TP, (4 X 41/2) the current size is about as compact as it can be. For a brief time Frantz made one that would accept a half roll, but they had to be cut in half for the smaller unit.

On the Rat Rod circuit, many guys seek out the old Frantz units to install.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

If you want to talk about day two equipment, there were a few original owners that did install them in musclecars. I would have, if I wasn't so resistive to using a by pass oil filter back in the 70s....Yes, I too didn't use them then, didn't believe it would make a difference.

I know what type of cars you work on, and no they weren't offered. The only exception was on the 4 cyl 194 Tempests, Pontiac had a provision that eliminated the oil filter with a block off plate so that the owner could use a aftermarket by pass filter. Pontiac didn't install the filter, they just made the provision for the owner to install the by pass filter of their choice, and only on 194 engines, although the block off plate will fit Pontiac Stratostreak V8s.

Being the media has to be about the size of a roll of TP, (4 X 41/2) the current size is about as compact as it can be. For a brief time Frantz made one that would accept a half roll, but they had to be cut in half for the smaller unit.

On the Rat Rod circuit, many guys seek out the old Frantz units to install.

I absolutely do like the vintage stuff, and day 2 speed parts are cool. I could see the old Frantz unit on a Rat Rod.

[Jay S]

Our newer 5.9 and 6.7 dodge Cummins do use up the oil like my older 97’ 5.9 Cummins. They are all fuel up and around 300K miles. I never go less than 8000 miles on an oil change on any of them.

I have ran my 6 liter LS to 356,000. 100K on that had a 15w40 Deisel oil in it after it got dusted. It was using oil some, so I jumped up to 10w30 from 5w20, then to 15w40. Eventually it quit using oil and I dropped back to 10w30. Oil always looked like new.