[RLEngland]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

All of it is interesting to me .
I'm not from Missouri , but I have to see the oddballers .

Just to note , we can't totally judge a 70 TA by its VIN
They only built 3196 , but the VINs don't run from 100001 to 103196.
Was just looking at an 03A TA and it's VIN is N107375
And 03A has always been considered ultra early for 70 TA
I'm just sticking with Norwood cars for this investigation - I know Van Nuys built some also.

The wildest thing besides the body dates on these two 01A cars ,
other than their body dates ,
Is they are sequential VIN - AND - same options / colors.

But that doesn't make them TA #354 and #355 out of 3196 - or out of however many TA's were built in Norwood. fwiw

I'd like to know if the VIN sequence clicked up at each plant (Van Nuys and Norwood) separately, or if they were assigned to each plant in batches. I've got 380 VINs documented from both plants and none have the same last 6 digits. Anyone every see the same last 6 digits on a Van Nuys and Norwood car for the model year 1970? I'm from Missouri.

[johnta1]

The 2 plants have their own VIN sequence. Could/would be a L100001 and a N100001.
The VIN's are also for all the Birds at that plant, not just TA or Formula or whatever. One could be a plain Bird next one a TA then plain Bird or Formula or whatever.
2 in sequence together would be OK I'd think, but a lot in sequence would be problematic, I'd think?
A lot of 'stuff' to build one right after the other and another etc?
(takes longer time to do all at once, slowing line down)

PS. I think I have some but not sure what year?
May take awhile to find them.

[RLEngland]

Originally Posted by johnta1

The 2 plants have their own VIN sequence. Could/would be a L100001 and a N100001.
The VIN's are also for all the Birds at that plant, not just TA or Formula or whatever. One could be a plain Bird next one a TA then plain Bird or Formula or whatever.
2 in sequence together would be OK I'd think, but a lot in sequence would be problematic, I'd think?
A lot of 'stuff' to build one right after the other and another etc?
(takes longer time to do all at once, slowing line down)

PS. I think I have some but not sure what year?
May take awhile to find them.

That makes sense. If I had money to burn, I would submit two of the same VINs to PHS and see what I get back. I'd like to hang out with them for a week looking at the files. John, thanks for what you do. I really enjoy your website.

[johnta1]

Glad you like my site!

So the 997 means internal use? Meaning the dealer held onto it for awhile as a promotion car?

Usually a Zone type area or some specific use.
It would also mean their would be another PHS for it. The earlier one to this PHS. That one may have what the 997 was.

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by RLEngland

That makes sense. If I had money to burn, I would submit two of the same VINs to PHS and see what I get back.

I've done this (accidentally).

I was researching a GTO VIN 237375P115814 and it came back as "not a GTO".

After some time I realized that PHS mistakenly sent me the packet for 237375Z115814. Fremont vs Pontiac final assembly.

Took me about a year to figure out what was wrong, and why none of the option content made sense.

I contacted PHS and they made it right, without additional cost.

K

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by RLEngland

I need to go hang out with the PHS folks and find a duplicate.

Originally Posted by RLEngland

I'd like to hang out with them for a week looking at the files.

There's not a lot to see.

Just going through punch cards: one, by one, by one, by one, by one....

And - they are filed in INVOICE order, not VIN order. Recall these were financial documents originally (not saved as a boon to future historians).

K

(this was a couple locations ago, when they were in Sterling Heights. Might look different now).

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by johnta1

The 2 plants have their own VIN sequence. Could/would be a L100001 and a N100001.
The VIN's are also for all the Birds at that plant, not just TA or Formula or whatever. One could be a plain Bird next one a TA then plain Bird or Formula or whatever.
2 in sequence together would be OK I'd think, but a lot in sequence would be problematic, I'd think?
A lot of 'stuff' to build one right after the other and another etc?
(takes longer time to do all at once, slowing line down)

This is correct.

a) - yes - there is a L100001 and a N100001. Similarly there would be a L123456 and a N123456, counting up independently at each plant to end of production.

b) - You are correct about option content. Great care is taken to make sure you don't have too many high content vehicles in row and overload the downstream assembly line workers. As such I would be surprised to see two T/As in a row, but it could happen, albeit not often. Or maybe four speed followed by an auto, for example. Or T top followed by no T top.

But you have to be careful. If it brings attention to itself the guys WILL start counting, and WILL write up a shop grievance.

K