[johnta1]

I would imagine they meant that the cowl tag does not make it a "GTO"
It is very easy to swap a GTO tag on a car and call it a 'GTO'.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

I agree with John .
A swapped trim tag - or reproduction trim tag - could skewer reality on a 64-65 from KC or PMD plant.

On a pure virgin car , the 5N rule holds true though.

The option codes on KC car manifests don't all match up with PMD order sheets.
PHS doesn't have the proper glossary to decode all the options.
John V. created a proper glossary for them.

Sounds like you are passing on the car.
Hope you find the right one you are looking for.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Seatbelt Code DeBunker : Trim Tag Code 5-O

These next 2 are both Kansas City plant cars.

Quote from John V. - Kansas research :

517 is the Sales Code 414 Seat Belt Deletion option.
...the Seat Belt Deletion at an option credit of $11 for those that stubbornly refused to pay for an option they didn't want.
The Group 5 Code O on the Data Plate identifies the deletion, the Fisher Trim Code used at KC to indicate that the now standard Front Pair Seat Belts should be omitted on this Body Assembly.

Pontiac made front seatbelts part of standard equipment in Jan. 64
You won't see trim tag code 5-O before Jan 1 ( KC and PMD plants ) - it was a given.
After Jan 1 there will be one of the 3 seatbelt codes on all the KC and PMD GTOs.
5-O Delete
5-W Deluxe with Bright Buckles and open spool retractors
5-Z Standard with Plastic covered buckles - no spool retractors

Car has 517 delete code , and 5-O

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Seatbelt Delete , from Kansas
Car has 517 delete code , and 5-O

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Code 5-Z on Trim Tags
Standard Seatbelts

This PMD car has 5-Z , and does not have #414 Seatbelt Delete on PHS.
He just wanted Radio and Rear Speaker . Notice no code 2-P on trim tag (aka radio code debunk)
Standard Front Belts were built into the MSRP after Jan 1

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Another 5-Z code without #414 Seatbelt Delete on PHS
This guy just wanted Tachometer , Quick Steering , and Ride & Handling , and in a Rush .
Standard Front Belts were built into MSRP after Jan 1
I have more 5-Z examples , but this should do it.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Found a 2tone car from PMD built in January , but it had a trim tag from a Kansas Car built in June.
Or the owner had 2 cars and loaded the wrong photo.

Should be able to find another with 2tone or vinyl top.
Group 1 - Code O is the only code left on the Kenth example. It has no choice but to be the 2tone molding.
And have seen that in print on a post. But would be better to document an example.

And get a couple 3-P padded dash examples too.

[John V.]

Interesting thread.

Couple things jumped out at me as I read thru it. Troubling that 2P continues to be incorrectly decoded using references that were published decades ago. Not to knock the seminal work by early researchers. But it has always been my fear whenever I’ve put something in print, bad info never goes away. I hesitated to publish my ‘64 KC/Balt decode article for that reason, tried to include caveats for anything that I was not very certain about.

BVZ, did you mean to say ‘65 in your last post? I don’t collect ‘65 data so wasn’t sure if you were referring to ‘65’s or not.

I did want to clarify the ‘64 5Z code. At the Pontiac Plant in ‘64, unlike KC and Balt, Fisher Body DID code the Standard Seat Belts on the Data Plate AFTER December’63 even though they had been made standard content. They were coded as 5Z.

KC did not code them after December. It was weird that they were coded at the Pontiac Plant at that point since the purpose was to identify modifications to the standard content.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

No , I meant Jan 64
Thanks for the correction.
At some point others will read this stuff.

And does appear PMD kept 5Z , and KC did not , after Jan 1 64.
On 64 models.

Some of the 64 PMD Trim Tags I posted even illustrate it.
Thinking cap wasn't buttoned tight enough.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Does seem that all 64 and 65 GTO trim tag codes do interchange , in for what the codes represent.

I haven't finished going through all the 65 car samples yet.
Still want to work on 3C and 3P codes too.