[Bill Boyle]

From what I can tell, most if not all, Firebirds from 77-79 are still subjected to emissions testing in some shape or form in all 50 states as well in the provinces of Canada. Passing emissions is also linked to automobile licensing as well. I for one am curious to learn what the emissions requirments are for your specific 77-79 TA or Formula. Also, how often your car must be tested for pollutant emissions. Tell us if you've had any problems and what you did to pass will be enlightening. We'll address performance mods on these smogger cars in a later topic. Bill Boyle

[This message has been edited by Bill Boyle (edited 03-14-2000).]

[Jon Dailey]

Here in SE Ohio, no one is ever tested for emmissions. This is the poorest part of the state. If we had emmissions testing, everyone would be fined and there would be about one-tenth of the cars on the road.

[Trevor Jordan]

Oakland County Michigan. No emissions testing for any vehicles. I guess there are some good things about living here!

[mike nixon]

Here in ind we don't have to get tested to get our tags, although i have seen spot check stickers on the windsheilds of cars from the Indianapolis area . I've also heard of this going on in the Gary/South Bend areas. I believe that the state of tune that the car is in has more to do with passing the sniff test than what the actual emissions equipt does. Back in 88 the dealership sent some of us to a sun electronics school in Indy for 2 days.The second day we took my 72 gp with a built 455 dual exhaust and no emission equipt down to sniff it out of curiosity. When we ran the test on it and it passed for the 87 model year emission standards. The instructor said it was a rare case for a car that old to run that clean, but like i said i think tuning is everything. Also i saw a 73 cat advertised in the ohio trader, in the ad it said no e-check required. whats up with that? mike

[Bill Boyle]

TinIndian--The charcoal canister is new and the overlap on the 270H cam is merely 50 degrees. This engine has less than 1,500 miles on it. Carbon monoxide you say is high, now that you know the canister is new and properly attached plus the mild overlap, what are your thoughts? I am curious. Bill

[KevinDush]

Oh yeah! I second that!! Michigan has it's downs (namely that crap called salt that they use so often in the winter), but at least we don't have ANY emissions testing! Woo hoo!!

Later,
Kevin

[Brian Baker]

Mike,
In Maryland you used to be able to get an emissions exemption sticker if you could prove it was equipped with a pre-emissions engine. I had one for my old '78 T/A as it had a 350 Pontiac in it out of a '73 LeMans. Ten years ago there were guys with pre-fuel injected 5.0 Mustangs ('85 and older I think) that were dropping 351 Windsors in them that were pre-76 (which is what MD tested back to at the time) and getting exempted. This can't be done anymore as the feds are no longer allowing states to do it (at least MD, isn't). Maybe your state still is?

[SLOW 77]

I am glad we don't have the dyno around here, D/FW TX. We still have to pass at idle and 2500rpm. As for visual depends on the shop. I can't wait till 2002, I will be getting antique plates, and have to pass only the visual.

[Larry Navarro]

bill, we have emissions testing here in harris county,houston tx.
if the vehicle is 25yrs and older, it is exempt from testing. i had a problem meeting the parameters of the test on the '79 bandit(455HO), just a little over on the nox emissions; but passed upon rejetting the carb. oh yes, no cat converter either.

[Skip Fix]

Bill, I like Larry live in the Houston area. There are a few counties that all touch. I live in Ft. Bend(by a few blocks) . We don't get a sniffer as Harris county get. Larry and you are both correct about the visual. ALL Texas cars in every county are to get a visual. Most of the guys in Harris that do the inspections feel that if it passes the sniffer it is ok regardless of what's missing.To get your yearly inspection your VIN is coded in to the sniffer and modemed to the state. The state DPS regulates the onspectors and pop in at any time so most won't put the sniffer in another car and key in your VIN. Harris county teset idle gases as well as at 3000 rpm. My roller motor 455 passed the 3000 rpm test but pegged the HC at idle, but the Q jet idle is a little leaner than this motor likes.

One thing around my area is they do spot checks on freeway entance ramps with an infared detector. I am not sure if its just for surveys on compliance or if the get you plate # and contact you if "dirty".

1981 cars have to match a higher criteria than 1980 and earlier. I can get exact numbers on the 4 gases if you want. That's why the 400 I'm building for the new project is a pretty tame cam.

[TinInjun]

Bill:
Looks like some carb work is in order to get those CO numbers down. Leaning the idle mixture using the mixture screw will help some(as lean as you can go and maintain a good idle). Next would be to check Power piston for wear. Too much clearance between the power piston and the piston bore will cause improper operation. Check the power piston spring, too much of a spring will keep the piston up during all engine operation. And the last thing to check in the power piston circuit is the vaccum passage. Make sure it isn't plugged.
Of course the primary metering rods and jets will make a difference if they are changed.
Last but not least, those pain in the butt well plugs. I have never seen a Q-Jet yet that they haven't leaked.
I have gotten engines without cats under 1.20 CO, and engines with cats to 0.00 CO. It takes some time and a gas analyzer, but that Q-Jet can be made to run very clean.


------------------
"Run wild with an Indian, not with the crowd in a Chevy"
Check out my restoration at http://members.aol.com/jetmech15/gto

[Bill Boyle]

You guys in Michigan are truly free, perhaps blessed. Having clean air is everybody's business and new cars should meet all the rigid critera. Technology has advanced the automotive high performance cause and the fight for clean air. Clean air and performance can be included in the same sentence, that's great. However, our earlier cars, should now be exempt from emissions testing, in my humble but biased opinion. With less than 44,000 original miles on my 21 year old TA, it hasn't been a source of pollution. Clean air should be a bottom line test when emission testing is required. Either it passess or fails on these older cars to the standard of that year. My preference is for emission exemption on antyhing over two decades old. Bill Boyle

[Bill Boyle]

Last saturday I was finally able to get a base line emissions run performed on my 79 TA. Both engine banks were tested at 15 and 25 mph on a dyno. From what I can see, the car may be very close to passing Hydrocarbons and oxides of nitrogen (NOX). Anyone have a printout of a 400 79 TA that has passed a dyno run emissions test--would love to get the passing numbers to compare. Email me at the [email protected] -- or post here. I will post my numbers this weekend.

[Bill Boyle]

TinIndian--Yep, I came up with an overly rich carburetor that needs adjustment too. My plugs clearly show a rich condition. You're also right about using an analyzer. That would make the chore less hit and miss. Lean the mixture screw and backing them out in small matching increments will test my patience but that's the way to go.

[Bill Boyle]

Larry--so in Harris County, TX, they aren't conducting a visual inspection. That is, they aren't checking for the equipment first before testing. How extensive is the test--a mere tailpipe sniffer at idle or an IM/240 conducted at idle and at 2500 rpm while on a dyno? Interesting result without the cat since Pontiac discontinued the 455 because of emission standards tightening. Larry, is the testing and passing directly linked to tags and registration as well? Bill Boyle

[This message has been edited by Bill Boyle (edited 03-14-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Bill Boyle (edited 03-14-2000).]

[irishman]

Bill,

I just picked up a '78 T/A a couple of weeks ago. It's pretty much bone stock, with the cat and other emissions gear in place. I live close to you, in the Alexandria City limits. I wasn't sure where I was going to keep the car the majority of the time, so when I registered it, I got the 2 year tags, and indicated it's garaged in Fauquier County. There's no emissions testing of any type down there. So, every once in a while, I'll tuck the car away down there for a week or two.

I'd be more than happy to run 5.0-style dual cats, but that's not legal according to the state standards, so I plan to run true duals, and desmog the motor (I'll retain all of the original parts in case). For my own sake I know I'll never drive some smoke belching POS, because if for no other reason a poor running car ticks me off. I'd much rather be given a set of standards that had to be met, regardless of how you went about it. As some of the posters to this thread indicated, they can pass the spec, even though the way they did it isn't totally legit.

I suppose my "garaging" the car out of county may not be in keeping with the spirit of the law, but it does meet the letter of the law. Just my .02.

[rphel]

I am like the lucky guy in Minnesota. I reside in Tennessee and we have no inpsections or emission checking systems. Its all a load of #### anyway. They also did away with it in South Carolina. In Georgia, I got by due to to age the of car(i forget the details). In North Carolina, I had to get inspections in the neighboring county(Wake County still regulated it).

[David]

Bill, my first 79 had true dual exhaust. My last two had single a cat. My latest is on my 81 turbo SE which is a daily driver with 77,000 miles and still running the original cat. I'll let you know how it goes this year in a couple of weeks.

[77TA]

NO test here in ARkansas !!!

[Bill Boyle]

From what I can tell, most if not all, Firebirds from 77-79 are still subjected to emissions testing in some shape or form in all 50 states as well in the provinces of Canada. Passing emissions is also linked to automobile licensing as well. I for one am curious to learn what the emissions requirments are for your specific 77-79 TA or Formula. Also, how often your car must be tested for pollutant emissions. Tell us if you've had any problems and what you did to pass will be enlightening. We'll address performance mods on these smogger cars in a later topic. Bill Boyle

[This message has been edited by Bill Boyle (edited 03-14-2000).]