[jcruz]

Ok, I'm at my wits end and on the verge of throwing something heavy in the garage if I don't get my brakes working!

Can't get the brakes properly bled and get pressure in the system. My experience is non-existant and here's the background:

Complete new front disc upgrade (old drums in back) from inlinetube including a new master and all new brake lines.

Installation seemed to go very well. A few leaks at some of the fittings but I sealed those no problem.

At first I tried manually bleeding the system, but that didn't work at all. Next, I bought one of those Might-Vac systems for about $40. Pumped that dang thing until I couldn't squeeze my hand anymore. No pressure. Next, I spent $80 on a power bleeder from Motive Products. I pump and pump and pump and can't get it past 5 psi!

There are no leaks that I can see and I really, really tried to follow the directions when I bench-bled the master.

I'm clueless at this point except to take the master off and start over by bench-bleeding it again. ugh.

Anything else I can test or try to solve this problem????

Thanks,

John

[jcruz]

Ok, I'm at my wits end and on the verge of throwing something heavy in the garage if I don't get my brakes working!

Can't get the brakes properly bled and get pressure in the system. My experience is non-existant and here's the background:

Complete new front disc upgrade (old drums in back) from inlinetube including a new master and all new brake lines.

Installation seemed to go very well. A few leaks at some of the fittings but I sealed those no problem.

At first I tried manually bleeding the system, but that didn't work at all. Next, I bought one of those Might-Vac systems for about $40. Pumped that dang thing until I couldn't squeeze my hand anymore. No pressure. Next, I spent $80 on a power bleeder from Motive Products. I pump and pump and pump and can't get it past 5 psi!

There are no leaks that I can see and I really, really tried to follow the directions when I bench-bled the master.

I'm clueless at this point except to take the master off and start over by bench-bleeding it again. ugh.

Anything else I can test or try to solve this problem????

Thanks,

John

[digger1978]

I experienced a similar problem to yours. First, I assume you properly bench bled the master cylinder. If you didn't, you just be pushing air into all the lines.

Again, make sure all the lines are properly fitted and tightened. Even a small pinhole leak can suck in air.

You may want to try leaving all the bleeders open and do a gravity bleed. Leave them open for 1/2 hour or so and then close them all. Next start with the back of the car. Put the rearend on jackstands to elevate the backend of the car and get a buddy to pump the pedal or use one of the tools your bought. Bubbles travel up easier and this should get the rear lines bled. Put the car back down then bleed the fronts.

Also you mentioned this is a disc upgrade. Did you also install a new proportioning valve? Disc/drum is different from drum/drum. One other thing to check is that your brake pedal rod is fully pushing the master cylinder piston all the way in. I am not sure what brand master cylinder you purchased.

You replaced all your lines and there is going to be a lot of air in them at first. Just buy lots of brake fluid and you will eventually get all the air out.

Hope this helps.

[george kujanski]

I would re-bleed the master first. Do it on the car by having an assistant move the pedal while you loosen/tighten the fittings at the master.

Next do as digger suggests; do a grivity bleed to get the lines full. Try it then, if still no joy, do a normal bleed sequence.

The biggest problem I have always had was to get the master bled.

George

[Josh H]

I would also check your rear wheel cylinders. Typically when they go, they will leak inside of the drum. Sometimes they don't. I would pull the push rods out of the wheel cylinders to make sure there is no fluid sitting inside of the dust boot. Occasionally they will leak but not enough to get past the boot.

Key thing to know about brakes, is that they will do nothing until all of the pressure is equalized. The rears could be way out of adj, for example, and you won't have much of a pedal because most of its trvel is being used to equalize the pressure until the very end.

[Droptop64]

How about getting the calipers on the wrong sides (left on right and vice-versa)? It's usually pretty easy to accidently reverse them without knowing it - especially when everything came in a big box.
Reversing them puts the bleeder lower than the top of the cylinder in the caliper, and the air will never get forced out totally.

[Seventy3TA]

Is the new master cylinder and quick take up design? Those are a little trickier to bleed. Also did you check for leaks around the power bleeder cap? got to make sure that it has a good seal, also check around the lines and fittings the power bleeder is hooked up to. Are you just not getting enough brake line pressure after bleeding till the cows come home? Might want to check your MC bore diameter,(since this is a disc brake upgrade) may not be moving enough fluid (too small a bore, not enough stroke)or generating enough line pressure (too large a bore) in addition to the other tips given above.

[jcruz]

Thanks gentleman, that gives me some things to check and options to try!

I'll get back with results....

John

[Bad Karma]

Buy some Speed bleeders from summit if ya dont have A buddy to help. They are worth the 8 dollars each IMO.

[Tempest]

I agree with everyone above when they say to start with the master cyl. The easiest way to bleed the master is to disconnect the lines and install the 2 plastic fittings with the 8 inches of CLEAR tubing that you should have received with the kit. Fill the master up, have a buddy slowly pump the pedal while you hold the ends of the plastic tubes submerged in the brake fluid , in the master. When you no longer see bubbles in the clear tubing, your master has been bled. Then, loosen the right rear bleeder (it's farthest from the master) and have the buddy slowly push the pedal to the floor. Close the bleeder whenever the pedal has reached the floor. Continue to bleed until fluid comes out(open during downward travel, closed when going up)Then go to driver's side rear, then pass. front and finally driver's front. Be sure that master never runs out of fluid, and you should be set. Remember, a soft spongy pedal means air is in the system, but a low hard pedal, usually means that the air is gone, but the rears need adjusting.
Good Luck and I hope this helps.

[Tempest]

After reading my post I forgot to say to reconnect the lines after the master has been bled.

[THEGTOCHISM]

Make sure those bleeder screws are on top as mentioned. you can install the calipers on the wrong sides that would put your bleeder screws in the wrong position. they will hold air that way. I had a similar situation happen to me 3 months ago. like you on a complete brake replacement on my 68. but not disc brakes. Couldn't get very much pressure on bleeding . Turned out they gave me the wrong master cylinder [twice] the dept in the rear where the rod contacts the plunger in the rear of master cylinder was deeper than the one i replaced. Darn rod had a 1/2 free travel before contact.Drove me nuts. it felt like it was full of air, when it was only getting a little contact at the time the pedal hit the floor. unbolt the master cylinder and Check the rod distance to dept in the hole in the master cylinder.

[PMDRACER]

Few more things to add. If you installed the calipers 100% dry, you'll have one helluva time trying to bleed them.
Get a large c-clamp, open the bleeder, and slowly compress the piston back into the caliper until you get fluid out the bleeder, then close the bleeder.
Don't worry about the large rotor to pad gap. When you get brake pressure the pistons will be forced back into place.

On a rebuilt system I have a trick to save some effort if using the buddy system when bleeding.
Open a bleeder and hold your finger over it. call out to the buddy on the pedal "down" and when they push down, take your finger off. Put your finger back on and call "up" and they let their foot of the pedal. Keep going until you see fluid, then go back to your normal bleeding procedure.

Lastly, make sure you continually check your master cylinder. If you run out of fluid you'll be starting all over again.

[mikeb]

I had the same issue and tempest hit the nail on the head.

I had replaced everything but the lines, bench bled the MC, and still couldn't get fluid to come out anywhere, by any means. I finally re-bled the MC on the car as tempest described (you can do this by yourself actually, lean out and watch the bubbles and fluid level, pump slowly). Once the MC was bled the rest of the system bled as you would expect and then I had brakes.

[mike65]

one more thing -- it may be an old wives "tail" but start your bleeding from the furtherest point from the master cyl that is the right rear,(passenger side), then left rear, then right front, then finally left front.

[chiefbigb]

I have done what mike d mentioned years ago please dont overlook his post.Brian