Nothing's changed! - Page 11 - PY Online Forums

disc0monkey · #1 12-06-2004, 07:29 PM

how can u be a true pontiac fan and be 100% behind the monero/gto

David Jones · #2 12-11-2004, 08:17 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>What are you guys talking about???? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Talking about making cars that people want. 400 hp is great. Selling enough of a model to keep it in production would help. Design a car that appeals to a large group of people. Bringing the 64 GTO back in this day and time wouldn't work. Ford didn't bring back the 69 Mustang, just a few styling cues to remind you of earlier models. If Pontiac doesn't alter its thinking, the GTO won't be around long enough to make a difference. The 05 changes help, but they need a clean sheet of paper and a car that appeals to a broader cross section of people. Whats wrong with a model line that includes a 6 cylinder? 300 hp is easy these days with a 6.

disc0monkey · #3 12-08-2004, 02:14 PM

i like the spoiler though

red70goat · #4 12-14-2004, 08:35 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by ozzy:
Don't y'all just love watching red70goat aka whatza monara aka "mr I know nothing about cars" making an ass of himself.
I know I do :-)
I would like to sincerly thank him for making me laugh out loud everytime I read one of his "wonderful contributions" to the forum.

A thousand thanks to you red70goat. Please keep up the good work.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No Thank you Ozz! You people in the GM Monaro Glee Club keep proving my point time and time again. Since I've been voicing my opposition to the GM Monaro I've been criticized for the cars I drive, for the car I don't drive, for not keeping it in "showroom condition" after 30+ years of daily driving (I guess it doesn't matter after 30 winters it still runs like a top, is all original and arrow straight), derogatory comments about my profession, my family, my supposed lack of knowledge about cars (still haven't figured out where you're coming on that one...I guess you have to win awards or something to be an "expert"

)Tell ya' what: I'll dump a bunch of money into my 70, get a few awards, claim Bob Lutz as a my personal Savior and Hero and then I'll be a bonafide "expert" like ya' all in the GM Monaro Glee Club. fiddly fart. BTW: Name me one post where I made any mention to anybody on this forum of their family, what they do professionally, the condition of their GTO and how and when they should drive it. Nearly all of my posts have been aimed at GMs lack of effort in reviving the GTO.

HUMBLER · #5 11-26-2004, 10:12 AM

Good lord, you caved already??

Nickv · #6 12-06-2004, 08:02 AM

Everyone wants the new GTO to

1. Look like (pick a year) GTO
2. Have it's own engine
3. Built in the states

1 and 2 ain't gonna happen, ever. Even if GM decided on a Northstar V8 instead of the LS1/LS2 many would still be pissed off. number 1 isn't gonna happen either. The new GTO will never be retro look-a-like similiar to the 05 Mustang. More aggressive in appearance? Sure, I'm all for that. Number 3 is gonna happen in 07, so that will at least be one hurdle for the haters to get over.

And this bickering about what constitutes a "real" GTO is lame. Here are the 2 reasons some 'old school' guys hate or dislike the car.

1. Not made in America
2. Styling

Those are the ONLY two reasons.

red70goat · #7 12-08-2004, 05:25 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by The Champ:
I just figured out who whatzit is...

He's that idiot from Illinois that was trolling here last year, and claiming that he drives 140 MPH on the streets of Chicago or something like that and that he had driven Indy cars....

I think he wanted to street race his Lincoln on the streets of Chicago against an '04 GTO and was frustrated that no one would take him up on it. Of course, he refused to take his Lincoln to the strip and run a GTO... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nope, sorry champ. I live in SLC and I don't have anything that I'd put up against a GM Monaro except maybe my C5. But it has highway gears, so it would probably lose in a 1/4 against a GM Monaro. The 740i is a luxury cruiser not a musclecar and my 70 is retired for now. My original username was red70goat (I think. I can't remember the password) Never been to Chicago, never owned a Lincoln, never driven an Indy Car. Sorry.

Tripower455 · #8 12-08-2004, 02:31 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Ok, if you want to call me a troll for whatever reason then go ahead, I really don't care. In fact, I'm thinking of changing my user name to "Proud Troll" just to make you happy. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I call you a troll, because, you're a troll.

Your only contributions to this forum are of a negative and argumentative nature.

Your only interest/agenda is in arguing with people that don't hold your opinions on the new GTO.

That's the definition of a forum troll.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Where in my post did I say my 70 didn't run? Actually the last time I checked my 70 was running just fine. I just haven't started (aka actively driven it) in a quite awhile because it's showing some cosmetic wear that a 34 yr. old car that had been driven daily for nearly 3 decades would show.( Gee, I guess I do know how to keep it running. Thank you for that insight ) There is no rust, the vinyl top is starting to fade and peel, paint is faded as well, etc. The salt they put on the roads here is murder to an old car finish. So it is not seeing any daylight until it can be brought up to modern specs and suitable to drive on a semi-daily basis. That will happen when I take it to Customs and Classics here in SLC and give them a check for $40k or around there. In the meantime it is sitting in my garage with a car cover on it I bought from Target. P.S.: If you're going to answer my posts, don't make your reply so long. I don't read half of the drivel that you write. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wow, you're such a GTO enthusiast that you don't even drive it, even though you can......... A tubbed rear, driven on a "semi-daily basis"? LOL, that's pretty funny if true.

Short enough response for you? Should I type in all caps? Use smaller words?

I should have realized that a troll's attention span and attention to detail are as severely limited as his ability to comprehend basic english.

I apologize.....

I'll try to type slower for you from now on.

Better yet, I won't even bother.

red70goat · #9 12-09-2004, 09:27 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Heff:
man, that gtohurstjudge sounds like a major jerk! i wonder how many miles a top-scoring GTO would get driven...
so now, not only does he dislike the 04 GTO, but to have some kind of opinion of a Pontiac, you have to own a slew of them, and have them in competitions? Screw perfect scores.... this whole subject was kinda fun, then some guy comes on here tring to cop a really serious attitude over who can or can't have an opinion. people like gtohurstjudge are why car shows aren't any fun. sure, i've only onwed two pontiacs, a 78 Grand Prix Sj, and a 79 Grand Prix Lj, but still pontiac power as much as you won't admit it, and the 79 is getting a gt-37 350. While not a points-placing GTO, it's still a 'real' pontiac, and while i'm not making big money doing what i do now, it will get me by for a while.
If anything, whatza-monaro is more of car enthusiast than the majority of this board. A guy who owns a GTO, a vette, and a 740i? Wow, sounds like he likes some pretty cool cars. I guess because i've owned a datsun 510, a renault, and two mazda rx2, and my dad raced a mazda rx3-sp, i can't have an opinion here either without being a troll? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What's interesting about all this Heff is that depsite having owned 3 GTO's and 1 '67 Firebird ( those would be Pontiacs for those of you in the GM Monaro Glee Club ) because I've owned a Chevelle, a C5 Vette ,a Dodge, and a Ford and my daily driver is a BMW ( an import!, better tell TriPower to dump his Mazda ) that somehow makes me not a Pontiac guy. I guess the same would apply to Champ who also owns a Chevy and a Lincoln. Or TriPower who also owns a Ford ( in need of a paint job...his own words. Oh My!,he must not be a "car guy" if he lets his vehicles "deteriorate" like that ) and a Mazda ( that would be an import TriPower, sorta like my BMW ) as a daily driver. Give these guys enough space and they will eventually show the rest of us the hypocrites that they really are.

red70goat · #10 12-07-2004, 07:53 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by David Jones:
The internet super sleuth mr_gto so eloquently typed.......

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>I'll challenge you as I do with everyone else, find on GM's website where it states the LS1/LS2/LS6 as a "Chevrolet" engine. PLEASE. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://www.gm.com/company/gmability/...ll_blocks.html

and these folks mistakenly think it is......

http://hotrodparts.com/chev_small__block.htm

and these folks mistakenly think its a Chevy....

http://www.carcollector.com/dept_det...rytype=Hotwire

this guys all wrong......

http://www.corvettesbyrickdaniel.com/gmpowerplant.html

Hard to celebrated 50 years on something that wasn't around 50 years ago. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

DJ: Don't you know you have officially classified yourself as a troll for challenging and correcting the GM Monaro Glee Club elite? Shame on you. Bad troll.

rabon008 · #11 12-07-2004, 10:02 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by disc0monkey:
baby got back?http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=ws...S6/WS6Rear.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://ultimategto.com/cgi-bin/showc...rant04/05_0005

Yeah. Baby got back.

455HOGT37 · #12 11-27-2004, 08:38 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Snowbound:

If the car was sold as a Monaro or a Pontiac X would the sales be higher? QUOTE]

Yes! And Lutz would be widely acclaimed as a visionary for bringing us a great car instead of cramming a fraud down our throats. He also would be freed from rethinking his "retro" position. Now, because it is a "GTO" he's stuck with a serious challenge to make modern retro work.

Mr_GTO · #13 12-07-2004, 03:53 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by David Jones:

http://www.gm.com/company/gmability/...ll_blocks.html

and these folks mistakenly think it is......

http://hotrodparts.com/chev_small__block.htm

and these folks mistakenly think its a Chevy....

http://www.carcollector.com/dept_det...rytype=Hotwire

this guys all wrong......

http://www.corvettesbyrickdaniel.com/gmpowerplant.html

Hard to celebrated 50 years on something that wasn't around 50 years ago. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Danny, this is what that GM site said

In the past 50 years, GM has improved the small-block engine to make it both more powerful and more fuel-efficient. Here are the two latest engines, considered the fourth-generation:

The 325-cubic inch (5.3 liter) 5300 Vortec V-8. This engine has a fuel-saving technology called Displacement on Demand (DOD), which uses only four of the engine’s cylinders during normal driving, instead of eight. GM will put the new DOD engine in several sport utility vehicles.

The LS2, an all-aluminum 364-cubic inch (6.0 liter) engine. This powerful engine is found in the 2005 Corvette and produces 400 horsepower. But it still manages to be fuel-efficient: it gets 18 miles per gallon in the city and 28 miles per gallon on the highway.

Find where it says Chevrolet LS1...please. And I couldn't care less about the other sites, they are not GM.

Tripower455 · #14 12-09-2004, 11:07 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR> In a previous post you had accused me of not really being into cars because I drove a BMW and not being a "true Pontiac enthusiast" because I didn't drive my 70 Goat on a daily basis, but rather chose to garage it until it coud be restored. You further blathered on about how I didn't take care of it because the paint was faded, etc. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I never mentioned your Beemer. Ever. In any context. I made comment that your apparent lack of enthusiasm for your '70 (hasn't been started in years) called into question your claimed status as a GTO fanatic.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>As far as the GM Monaro: Pontiac built their design reputation on a "wide track" format. I would like to see them incorporate this into a modern day GTO similar to what Ford was able to due with the 2005 Mustang. The front end of the 'Stang looks aggressive with the hood extending over the headlights and a full length recessed grill. The backend still has some retro cues. The boys designing the c5 and c6 'Vette have wisely kept the distinctive tail light treatment retro as well. Hopefully GM will follow suit with a newly designed GTO. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I completely, 100%, agree with everything in this paragraph. I wish that Pontiac had done the GTO with a more retro look. I have stated many times that I feel that the '04 GTO would make a perfect Grand Prix or Grand Am.

That said, I feel that the '04 GTO is the perfect car for me (affordable, V-8, RWD, manual with a back seat), in spite of it's misnomer. I can see past it's ONE limitation as a GTO (looks) and appreciate it for what it is. A LOT of performance car for the money (sounds a lot like the original GTOs).

So I ask you, how am I a hypocrite. I've never changed my opinion or posted anything different regarding this vehicle.

Oh, and $40k will be a good starting number for a frame off on the '70, depending on how much you do yourself, and how many of the original parts you can use and how far you go with it.

It is worth it in the end, but I estimated about $20K when I started my '66, and I am rapidly approaching $40k and I did a lot of the grunt work myself. Those $200 boxes from PY add up quickly.... At least it was spread out over a bunch of years.

It seems we have more in common than not....... btw.

red70goat · #15 12-10-2004, 04:17 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by disc0monkey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by red70goat:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Nickv:
... In 07 with the GTO being built here in the states... Much if not all the GTO bashing will disappear. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's going to take much more than being built in the states to save the GTO. If the 04 had been instantly recognizable as a GTO I doubt anybody would have cared much where it was built. From what I've seen the 07 doesn't look much better. If GM doesn't correct this there probably will be no GTO in 2007. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

your telling me you saw a 07? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I went on the google search engine and typed in "2007 GTO Renderings" and saw several prototypes. Of course, that's not to say that is what GM is going to do, but it appears it may be close to the current format.

Nickv · #16 12-11-2004, 12:01 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR> Because they ran out of styling ideas. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If that's so, why are they selling so well...?

PS: Are you saying the '04 has style of it's own? Get real....

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think you misunderstood. Blatant retro designs are in my opinion a deadend design. The 05 Mustang is not slated to get a major redesign till 2010MY, if you don't believe that I can point you to the website and doc from Ford. The new GTO has a bland style compared to the 05 Mustang. But the new GTO's can and will change over the next 2-3 yrs.

In 2 or 3 years the "new" Mustang will be dated. Hell, it's already dated circa 1967.

disc0monkey · #17 12-08-2004, 10:45 AM

let me remind all of you we are talking about the 2004 GTO not the 2005. So don't bring the '05 into it, that car was made with pontiac's tail between their legs. the 2004 was the result of a cocky company that doesn't care about their loyalists. period. There is nothing like the feeling i get when i pop the hood on my '71 and I see the blue motor stairing at me. I know it will not happen again, but it would be cool if they did something like the intake or something a vintage blue.

heff · #18 12-08-2004, 08:48 PM

man, that gtohurstjudge sounds like a major jerk! i wonder how many miles a top-scoring GTO would get driven...
so now, not only does he dislike the 04 GTO, but to have some kind of opinion of a Pontiac, you have to own a slew of them, and have them in competitions? Screw perfect scores.... this whole subject was kinda fun, then some guy comes on here tring to cop a really serious attitude over who can or can't have an opinion. people like gtohurstjudge are why car shows aren't any fun. sure, i've only onwed two pontiacs, a 78 Grand Prix Sj, and a 79 Grand Prix Lj, but still pontiac power as much as you won't admit it, and the 79 is getting a gt-37 350. While not a points-placing GTO, it's still a 'real' pontiac, and while i'm not making big money doing what i do now, it will get me by for a while.
If anything, whatza-monaro is more of car enthusiast than the majority of this board. A guy who owns a GTO, a vette, and a 740i? Wow, sounds like he likes some pretty cool cars. I guess because i've owned a datsun 510, a renault, and two mazda rx2, and my dad raced a mazda rx3-sp, i can't have an opinion here either without being a troll?

Goathead · #19 12-10-2004, 02:25 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR> I think GM would find there are quite a few "haters" that would quickly accept this car as a GTO if GM made the effort to give it some minor retro cues in the grill and tail light area. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

judge_jury_executioner_69 · #20 12-13-2004, 12:44 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Rabon:
judge_jury wrote: look at the grand am.

Oh, so my '04 Grand Am with the ALL the bells and whistles is compareable to the GTO? Grow up a while...My '04 GA with the 175 HP ram air package and racing rims does 0-60 in the mid 8's...its a toy compared to my GTO...nice looking little v6 but not even in the class of my GTO...try again... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

you were talking about the taurus's sales. i mentioned the GT's. next time youre driving around count how many are on the road. then compare that to the 04 gto. might be a V6 but i bet youll see more of them the 04 GTO.