[orange69]

Which poverty caps are correct for a 69 firebird, the ones that say PONTIAC PONTIAC, or the ones that say PONTIAC MOTOR DIVISION? Are they a specific GTO cap and a specific Firebird cap? Do years vary?
thanks!

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[orange69]

Which poverty caps are correct for a 69 firebird, the ones that say PONTIAC PONTIAC, or the ones that say PONTIAC MOTOR DIVISION? Are they a specific GTO cap and a specific Firebird cap? Do years vary?
thanks!

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[Jerry H.]

I think, notice I said I think that the ones that said 'Pontiac Motor Divison' came first (64). Then the 'Pontiac' caps came later. Now does that make the 'Pontiac' caps correct for the Firebird. Logic would follow that it does. Maybe some who has some documented cars will post here.

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jerry H.:
I think, notice I said I think that the ones that said 'Pontiac Motor Divison' came first (64). Then the 'Pontiac' caps came later. Now does that make the 'Pontiac' caps correct for the Firebird. Logic would follow that it does. Maybe some who has some documented cars will post here.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I have a picture of someone test driving a 64 when new and it has PONTIAC PONTIAC on it. I have a pic of a 69 and it does too.
I AM CORNFUSED

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[Jerry H.]

Well, that may disprove my theory then. I do know that there seem to be tons more of the 'Pontiac Motor Divison' caps out there than the 'Pontiac' caps. I have been collecting these on and off for over 20 years, and have had lots of the former, but just a few of the later.

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jerry H.:
Well, that may disprove my theory then. I do know that there seem to be tons more of the 'Pontiac Motor Divison' caps out there than the 'Pontiac' caps. I have been collecting these on and off for over 20 years, and have had lots of the former, but just a few of the later.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I bought 5 NOs caps, and just realized 3 are PONTIAC PONTIAC and the other 2 are PMD. One is Like flash chromed aluminum and the others are stainless....kinda weird. I want to put the right ones on my Bird!!!! thanks for the chats

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jerry H.:
Well, that may disprove my theory then. I do know that there seem to be tons more of the 'Pontiac Motor Divison' caps out there than the 'Pontiac' caps. I have been collecting these on and off for over 20 years, and have had lots of the former, but just a few of the later.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Do you think one is a production cap and the other is a dealer cap?

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[einstein]

Pictured in my 1971 Parts Illustrations Manual are the PN 9774609 "Pontiac Motor Division" caps for all 14" wheels from 1964 to 1969. Then for 70-71, it says 9774609 except Firebird, and PN 5738083 for Firebird. Can't answer later than 1971, and there is no different photo of the other part number cap.

Personally, I never noticed the difference before.

Glenn Uettwiller http://home.earthlink.net/~birdman8/index.html

A friend is someone who knows the song in your heart and sings it back to you when you have forgotten how it goes. --- unknown

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by einstein:
Pictured in my 1971 Parts Illustrations Manual are the PN 9774609 "Pontiac Motor Division" caps for all 14" wheels from 1964 to 1969. Then for 70-71, it says 9774609 except Firebird, and PN 5738083 for Firebird. Can't answer later than 1971, and there is no different photo of the other part number cap.

Personally, I never noticed the difference before.

Glenn Uettwiller http://home.earthlink.net/~birdman8/index.html

A friend is someone who knows the song in your heart and sings it back to you when you have forgotten how it goes. --- unknown
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thanks Glenn

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[Jerry H.]

Do what I did on a car years ago. Put 2 'pontiac' on one side and 2 'pontiac motor division' on the other side. I drove the car for over a year and to two 'national' type shows. NO ONE ever noticed or mentioned it to me!

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jerry H.:
Do what I did on a car years ago. Put 2 'pontiac' on one side and 2 'pontiac motor division' on the other side. I drove the car for over a year and to two 'national' type shows. NO ONE ever noticed or mentioned it to me!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hahahaha, thats a good idea, i never thought about it. I had such a bad day today, i appreciate the laugh, and the help.

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[poncho-mike]

In 1981, I bought a one owner 70 Formula 400 Firebird. I bought it from a woman, and it was totally bone stock original, down to the AM radio. I got all of her documentation and everything checks out that it was all original. It had less than 60K miles.

It had PONTIAC PONTIAC hub caps.

I also parted an older gentleman's 68 or 69 Executive. It was excellent shape except he had ran into the back of someone. It was a pretty base model car, with 400-2V, poverty caps, 4-dr, etc. It had the PONTIAC MOTOR DIVISION hubcaps. It was about 75K miles and all original.

I know the Firebird had never been wrecked because the lady lived right down the road from me. I assume the hub caps on the Executive were original. I hope this helps.

Mike

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by poncho-mike:
In 1981, I bought a one owner 70 Formula 400 Firebird.
It had PONTIAC PONTIAC hub caps.

Mike<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes it does, Thanks!!

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

['ol Pinion head]

The Pontiac-Pontiac style did not appear till at least mid '70. This would agree with what Mike has related. I also have nearly a complete set of the Pontiac-Pontiac style. They came of a rel low mile 6 cylinder '71 Pontiac (05D Pontiac plant) T-37 partscar in '86.

In doing a ton of yarding, comparing notes with other low option '71 GTO & Firebird owners & several 455HO T-37 owners, we have basically come to the agreement that the Pontiac Motor Division style were correct from beginnings in '64 production up into to mid '71 production. We also have agreed that the Pontiac-Pontiac style was previously used on base model '70 1/2 & '71 Firebirds, & was used on '71 Ventura II's & eventually was phased into use on some '71 Pontiac A-body models. From cleaning out dealer stocks, also believe it is the Pontiac-Pontiac style that was used as a service replacement when the Pontiac-Motor-Division style ran out.

To clear up (or confuse) matters more, the '72 poverty caps are another style, no ribs, no writing, just smooth with a Pontiac arrowhead emblem in the center.

[WallyB]

Hub caps or wheel covers?
I have the PMD on record (see pic) for wheel covers for 69 like the black Rally II center caps - dunno for sure though - looks good to me.

Wally

[einstein]

Those caps are 1967 Tempest/LeMans "DeLuxe"; PN 9786453...

Glenn Uettwiller http://home.earthlink.net/~birdman8/index.html

A friend is someone who knows the song in your heart and sings it back to you when you have forgotten how it goes. --- unknown

[orange69]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ol' Pinion head:
The Pontiac-Pontiac style did not appear till at least mid '70. This would agree with what Mike has related. I also have nearly a complete set of the Pontiac-Pontiac style. They came of a rel low mile 6 cylinder '71 Pontiac (05D Pontiac plant) T-37 partscar in '86.

OK, but I have controversy. I have a Magazine article date 1964. It has a test drive of a 64 GTO trip car w/ 4 spd. I enlarged the thing, an low and behold, it has PONTIAC PONTIAC dish caps.
I dont know how to post pics.

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
OK, but I have controversy. I have a Magazine article date 1964. It has a test drive of a 64 GTO trip car w/ 4 spd. I enlarged the thing, an low and behold, it has PONTIAC PONTIAC dish caps.
I dont know how to post pics.

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
By the way, my nos Pontiac Pontiac caps have
1964 Catalina in grease pencil written on the inside, they have never been installed.?????
more confusion.

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!

['ol Pinion head]

Orange, I have never seen Pontiac-Pontiac versions on an original early car. Have occasionally ran across them mix & matched, & occasionally ran across the Pontiac-Pontiac version in dealership stock buyouts.

Further, In ck'ing out large Pontiac colections, & going through hundreds of yards, in the last 23 years, I've examined or pulled poverty caps off everything from '64 Tempests to '77 Police Enforcers. The last dozen years, the vast majority of original Pontiac poverty cap cars I've run across were either missing the best examples of their original caps, or the caps were split on the edges. In nearly every case, the poverty caps were the Pontiac-Motor-Division style.


Any early useage of, & acceptance of in concours judging circles, of the "Pontiac-Pontiac" style would probably be best directed to the head of the GTOAA judging committee. Realize your car is a Firebird, but believe it would be easier to get a more concise answer out of GTOAA, than it would be anywhere else. Hope this helps.

[orange69]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ol' Pinion head:
Orange, I have never seen Pontiac-Pontiac versions on an original early car. Have occasionally ran across them mix & matched, & occasionally ran across the Pontiac-Pontiac version in dealership stock buyouts.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
OK thank you. I will hunt up a couple more PMD's.
I appreciate you help, and experience, thanx everyone! Mark

NOOOOO! it's not a freakin' Chevelle!