[Ron]

I own a 1965 GTO that has 1978 Firebird spindles and disc brakes on the front. I also have the complete HO Racing suspension including spings, shocks, and sway bars. I have been having a traction problem and believe it is spring related since the springs I have on the car are stiff. I purchased a pair of 1965 Tempest 6 cylinder Air conditioned car springs and installed them and they dropped the front end 2.75 inches, way to low. I then purchased a pair of Moroso racing springs for a big block engine. Same results. The front end dropped so much that I can not get a floor jack underneath the front cross member. I need a spring for drag racing but does not drop my front end 2.75 inches. Help!!!!!!!!

Ron

[This message has been edited by Ron (edited 10-06-2000).]

[Ron]

I own a 1965 GTO that has 1978 Firebird spindles and disc brakes on the front. I also have the complete HO Racing suspension including spings, shocks, and sway bars. I have been having a traction problem and believe it is spring related since the springs I have on the car are stiff. I purchased a pair of 1965 Tempest 6 cylinder Air conditioned car springs and installed them and they dropped the front end 2.75 inches, way to low. I then purchased a pair of Moroso racing springs for a big block engine. Same results. The front end dropped so much that I can not get a floor jack underneath the front cross member. I need a spring for drag racing but does not drop my front end 2.75 inches. Help!!!!!!!!

Ron

[This message has been edited by Ron (edited 10-06-2000).]

[Big Injun]

If you are looking for weight transfer, you need to transfer a couple hundred pounds out of the drivers seat...LOL.

For $20 a pound I will ride in the trunk. That will lift the front.

[mike nixon]

why not change the shocks to a 90/10 ratio? or has this been done? mike

[Ron]

I've got 90/10 shocks now. I think, and some other people think, the problem is with the very stiff road racing springs.

Ron

[JC455]

Ron,
I have Hotchkis Springs all around on my 68 LeMans. Upon install, the rear hop went away. These springs may not do the trick for you, as they are for handling, I just wanted to make you aware of their possibility.
One thing to remember about the F car Spindle swap- It automatically lowers the front of the car by an inch.
When you put the HO springs in, did you have to trim the springs? I'm asking this because I put their springs on my 76 T/A about 10 years ago. After installing the "lowering" springs, my car was 3 inches taller in the front. I had a friend with a 70 convert. GTO that installed the complete HO spring package around the same time. His sat way to high also. We both cured this by trimming the springs (Actually, I heated mine- rookie move!). Point being maybe you could install some new front factory or HO springs. They might drop it to the right height without any trimming.
Just a thought...
Later-->


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John

[Tim Corcoran]

I had the same problem in my 65 LeMans. Moroso springs lowered the front too much. I have tried several sets of front springs. A spring that provides the best lift for drag racing is a taller softer spring with lots of windings, like the Moroso springs are. The problem is the Pontiac front end is too heavy for Moroso's heaviest spring. I ended up findind an old set of 65 LeMans springs from the wrecking yard. They work great, set at the right level, lift well too. 1.51 60's with a 3700lb car on a 28X10.5 inch slick.

Tim Corcoran

[This message has been edited by Tim Corcoran (edited 01-01-2001).]

[Old Man Taylor]

Tim - Can you describe your combination more? My 64 is lighter, has Moroso springs up front and the same size tires you have. To date I have run 10.95, but only a 1.63 60 ft time. What is your drive train? What is the car's ET? and what have you done (if anything) to the rear of the car?

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Jim

[Bobtempest]

Ron did you ever solve your front spring problem? I have a 67 Tempest that is a street car with air that runs 11.40s with a best of 11.26. I have some 6 cylinder springs that work okay, but it still sets too low. Still much higher than any of the Moroso's. I called a spring company and the tech guy when through his catalog and picked the tallest 6 cylinder spring offered. This was the best I was able to do. Still after I put in some rubber spacers it's a little low. I have gotten a 1.61 sixty foot on a 3880 lb. Pontiac. If you ever find a better taller spring let us know.
Bob Hinson

[This message has been edited by Bobtempest (edited 12-29-2000).]

[Tim Corcoran]

Old Man Taylor

My 65 LeMans has the Firebird spindle disc conversion. I had serious problems getting headers to fit after the install. Even after grinding the corner of the A-arm to the max and denting my headers I still could not get clearance between the upper control arm and my cheesy 1-5/8 Mexican Hookers, yes I did use the off set rod in the upper a-arms. I was forced to use after market upper a-arms (Global West I think). After changing several sets of front springs (including the Moroso's)I finally found a set of old A-body OEM springs that gave me the ride height I was after, and they lift great during launch. I have 28" tall front tires and Koni adjustable front drag shocks. I have the right set softer than the left to try to compensate for body twist during launch. In the rear I have polygraphite bushings, "no hop bars", 50/50 Comp Engineering drag shocks, adjustable upper control arms and OEM lowers that I boxed. I also installed a set of those metal pieces that connect from the frame to the upper control arm mounting point to beef things up a bit. I think these were installed from the factory on certain year GTO's. I am using the factory original rear springs and air bags inside the springs. The car race weight is 3725lb. Last time out it was doing consistant 1.51 to 1.55 60's. It's not a radical combo running a mild flat tappet cam and a four barrell.

Tim Corcoran

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65 LeMans 11.22@120
going into the 10's
this winter

[Old Man Taylor]

Tim - Your suspension is very similar to mine. However, the best 60 ft time I have to date is 1.539, and that is with a 10.780 ET. The short time and the reaction times are inconsistent, which I am currently blaming on tire spin. I have been using the trans brake on all runs. Next week I will try footbraking it to see if it will launch more consistently. Do you foot brake yours?

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Jim

[Tim Corcoran]

OMT,

Are you running adjustable upper control arms? I attribute my good 60' times to two things. One is the proper setting of the pinnion angle and preloading the right rear wheel which is only attainable with an adjustable suspension, and two, making lots of torque in the low RPM band which I attribute to light pistons & rods(J&E&Eagle), long storke(4.25), and long rods(6.8).

My launch technique is basically launch off idle. I do run the rpm up to about 1100-1500 max, and I do foot brake it, I have never ran a trans brake. I have found that if I hook consistently, my RT's and my 60's are also consistent. The only reason I take it off of idle is the engine seem to respond a tad faster if I bring the R's up a bit. I have a 9" contenintial converter that flashes to about 3,500 which is real close to my max torque.

Tim

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65 LeMans 11.22@120
going into the 10's
this winter

[This message has been edited by Tim Corcoran (edited 01-01-2001).]

[Old Man Taylor]

Tim - Yes, I do run adjustable uppers. As I recall my pinion angle is -2 degrees. I also have no-hop bars, but I have to use the lowest hole to keep it from "bunny hopping" too bad. I believe the transbrake launch is too violent for the 10.5" tires I have, and the shocks. I have the Koni race shocks (SPA-1), but they only adjust on extension, and the stiffest setting does not keep the rear from dropping down from the car. I will try a foot brake launch this weekend to see what difference it makes. Although I do have air bags, I don't need to use different pressures. The combination of a 12-point roll cage and a rear torsion bar makes the car launch very straight. My converter stalls at 4200 and I was launching at 4000 on the rev limiter. Again, I think the violence of the transbrake start is a different ball game.

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Jim