[Lerry: The Body Ventura..]

If we're talking hydraulics for street/strip. I surely wouldn't do it. Once they're adjusted there is no more adjustments needed as with a solid lifter motor. It's less work just to wipe off any oil if does run down. One can always position rags against head for spillage while adjusting. I lay valve cover on side I'm not doing until I get there and then cover the side I just did. If worse comes to worst. You can always shut motor down for a spell to let oil drain back down before other side is attempted. This is the way I do it and just my opinion on the matter. As the saying goes: Opinions and a--holes, we all have them..

[Big Mike]

I had problems, added the external lines. Some people have problems, others don't. My machine shop told me some early small block Chevy heads from aftermarket manufacturers had problems too. They added lines like I did.

See:http://community.webshots.com/album/87435012aFFiai

Picture of what I did. I had problems with oil pressure in the traps until I added these drains.

[Lanny]

Harry K I'm going to street most of the time some strip .
The reason I asked about the oil return is the guy I got the heads from puked his motor 5 times rebuilt by 3 different shops and I'm not going to have that kind of $$$$$$$ to blow up motors like that ;and I do have a 8 quart pan but if 7 of them are in the heads THAT would not be good either.
My plan do it once and do it right !!!!!
Thanks Lanny

[harry k]

Lanny: thats very good that you are being carefull and doing your homework up front and avoiding the saying " you don't have the time to do it correct now,but you have the time to do it twice later" cool

well the guy who had the problems were not due to the heads . there are so manny people out there runing heads "out of the box" without adressing oil drain back isssues and have no problems ,as you read from some of the posters here on this topic also .

good luck

[Jack Gifford]

Originally Posted by Tim Corcoran

This has been a greater concern for the high end motors that are turning a lot of RPM, like 8,000 plus shift points.

I'm curious who that is? I assume you're talking about Edelbrock heads on a Pontiac?

[Lerry: The Body Ventura..]

I have more concern of getting oil to instead of oil from. Although I'm running a 8 qt. pan.

[joes455]

Nice info.Ok where should the oil be returned to at the pan,above the oil line or below it?

[BVR421]

joe it doesnt matter whereever its convenient to plumb it in below the crankshaft level
Im not siure its much of a problem now, wasnt the oil drains improved in later Eheads? about the same time as they changed head bolts?
FWIW, I dont think you would see any oil burning if the stems have the proper seals. I understand NASCAR motors typically totally flood the valve cover to keep the springs cool and they run 9000rpm for hours on end. Of course they hold several gallons of oil LOL

[Steve C.]

Related- and a question of sort, how much oil is "in" your motor while going down the track ? ? A recent comment to me from a very respected source involving a higher rpm race application, he stated "going down the track with 8 qts total you only have 4 in the pan".

How much oil do you need. Put the oil pan on the assempled motor, start with zero oil with an empty filter. Start spinning the pump drive and keep adding oil untill you have a constant oil pressure. That is the bare minimum amount of oil. On some engines it could take 3-plus qts, 4 to be safe. And remember this is with no motion, wheel stands or braking hard on the big end.

All part of oil control.

Maybe Pontiac Dude will chime in on his experiances with a Small block Chevy and how much oil it will suck up inside.

[455-4+1]

I put them in the iron heads on my sprint boat.

Main reason was to get the oil back to the pan quicker and in better condition(6000 rpm for 60 seconds requires a bit of oil to return to the pan)

Blocked the rear 2 drainbacks on each head and installed -10 fittings at the rear with -10 hoses to the sump

Most of the oil in the heads now drains back to the sump without going past the cam, rods, crank etc. Direct path to the pan and no airation of the oil on the way back down

[White Warrior]

I have -8 return lines on both my wentzler heads and the E-head on my 4 cylinder. I have the drain line as low on the pan per Smokey Yunick . He said to return oil to oil. less windage,I guess.

[Tim Corcoran]

Yes I was referring to E-heads on Pontiac motors. Dave Bischop from SD Performance enlarges and chamfers the oil return holes on all the E-heads that he sells. Why? Because oil return is a known problem with E-heads. Things you can do, if you run a solid lifter cam you can use oil restrictors in the lifter bores, you can run thinner oil or go synthetic, you can work the oil return holes in the heads (make sure you know how much metal to remove), you can use a larger pan, you can use an oil accumulator, you can make an external oil return system. Depending on your performance level you may not need to do anything at all or everything you can. My car has a solid roller and e-heads, I shift at 6200. I run oil restrictors and my heads had the oil return holes worked by Dave at SD. I also have a 7 quart pan. I have no problems with oil returning to the pan, that I am aware of. I have a friend who turns more RPM than I do and he runs a stock pan, oil restrictors and is running heads from SD Performance. He has no oiling problems. When Bill Takanabe went to E-heads he ran his pan dry and damaged his engine first time out. He shifts his 541 at 8,000+, I don't know what kind of oiling mods he has done to solve his problem but I did see a big Moroso oil accumulator on his engine. He also pre-heats his water and oil before he runs. I think it depends on the RPM you turn that would determine what oiling mods you need to do. It may also have something to do with if you have a 60 or 80psi oil pump too. If you run a 60 you will start bypassing oil sooner and send less oil through the motor at RPM.

Tim C

[Tom Vaught]

Quote:

"I have -8 return lines on both my wentzler heads and the E-head on my 4 cylinder. I have the drain line as low on the pan per Smokey Yunick . He said to return oil to oil. less windage,I guess."

That is very true, except in the case of a blown engine (turbo drain or supercharger drain).

There is a seal on the turbocharger between the bearing section and the compressor section that must not see pressure or it will fail and the turbo/blower will push oil through the engine. In the case of a Centrifugail supercharger or turbo you want the oil drain to enter the pan above the oil level. This will keep the oil line from having a pressure build-up and causing the seal to leak.

Tom V.

[75TA]

Here are pictures of my returns. I am running a solid roller with restrictors and a canton oil pan. I will also be running an accumsump in the near future.

[Tom Vaught]

75TA,

I personally would put a 90 degree fitting in the right head with a short 2" piece of tubing that would then go into your "Tee". By having the "Tee" lower you could angle the line from the left (driver's head) more downward which would help flow out of that head a lot. From the lowered "Tee" then on to the oil pan. Nothing wrong with what you did except that oil doesn't like to travel on a horizontal plan very well for any distance.

If you were starting from scratch, I would make a plate that bolted on to the right head that had a small 1"x1"x4" welded "collection box" with three nipples on it. A short formed line would go from a fitting in the right head to a fitting in the top of the box. A second formed line (like you have) would go from the left head to a fitting in the middle left of the box, and a large drain line would go from the bottom of the "box" to the oil pan.

Tom V.

[75TA]

Tom V,

Thanks for the suggestions - always looking for better ways to do things.

[7T2]

ll be trying a 3/8" npt fitting tapped into the distributor pad with a ''T" fitting that runs up to the back of both heads. this will be advantageous due to the clean simple application. not sure if the % of drop over run length will provide adequate drainage, though. well see.
jim

[Jack Gifford]

Originally Posted by 7T2

... tapped into the distributor pad...

????