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#261
10-31-2007, 07:24 AM
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The latest known (publicly) as-cast 2506 blocks are dated C118.
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Some guys they just give up living And start dying little by little, piece by piece, Some guys come home from work and wash up, And go racin' in the street. Bruce Springsteen - Racing In The Street - 1978 |
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#262
10-31-2007, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Look back a few posts I provided copies(pic) of the complete retail sales prices that came out of one of my dealer sales albums. I also included a page from the Accessorizer showing seat belts prices. You couldnt get a Camaro spoiler on a Firebird. I bought mine from local Chevy dealer list price was $17,my price was $14. |
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#263
10-31-2007, 09:51 AM
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I saved the pix you posted from sales manual when they went up. Basically same thing I have from the FGF website. Except for the base list price page - I didn't have that one.
The sheets I'm using for Fbird are the ones that say "revised 1-1-68 at bottom", and Feb.20,1968 along side border. It's good to have the Sept.67 sheet also. But have gone as far as they will take me on BlkBrds Car. I need the sheets from section (u) Trailer-Hauling Eqpt and (v) Miscellaneous His totals are off - and his BHC has an amount in the Miscellaneous Amount box (first one - so far). I might can find the difference in those (u) and (v) sections. But they are not functional on the FGF website. http://firstgenfirebird.org/firebird...l/t_index.html (t) Prices Index This section lists price information for all the Pontiac series. Firebird Sport Options, Group Prices, Paint, Engines, Transmissions, Tires Subsection Index: (t) Prices (u) Trailer-Hauling Equipment (v) Miscellaneous Section Index: Series Availability Selling Feautures Sales Information Main: 1968 Pontiac Sales Manual |
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#264
10-31-2007, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Anyway theres not much info on that page but here it is. I believe that when Geoff did the FAQs on the FGF he used my copies of dealer albums and the one with Feb 20,1968 doesnt have the U section in it. U section I provided is in the other sales manual which has the Sept price sheet. I also have the accessorizer for Feb 68 which would have all the 1/1/68 price increases included. Thats the one I show the shoulder belts in. There is no section in U for Firebird trailer towing only special equipment  
Last edited by Cammer-6; 10-31-2007 at 12:17 PM. |
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#265
10-31-2007, 01:48 PM
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1968 FIREBIRD RA PRICING
Gentlemen,
I did some research years ago on pricing several RA Firebirds and was able to match the Billing History label price exactly. I used information from a 1968 Firebird price guide dated 2/20/68 and other sources (some I've seen posted on this thread). (1) 1968 FIREBIRD 400 CP RA/AUTO INVOICE DATED 4/24/68 LABEL PRICE $3937.53 PAINT CC CAMEO IVORY NC TRIM 252 RED BUCKET SEATS NC MODEL 22437 H.T. CP STD INTERIOR 2781.00 400 OPT. (REQ'D W/ 347) 273.83 347 R.A. ENG (RA I) 342.29 351 HYDRAMATIC TRANS 236.97 361 SAF-T-TRK H.D. 63.19 37P AXLE SP. ORD. (3.90) NC 453 RALLY II WHLS 84.26 472 FL. CONCOLE 50.55 481 DUAL EXH. NC 621 RIDE & HANDLG PKG 9.48 671 UNDERHOOD LAMP 3.16 692 HD ALT. 55 AMP 15.80 702 SPARE WHL & TIRE, CONV NC MC F70x14 RED WIDE OVAL NC TOTAL 3860.53 HAND. CHG. W/RA OPT 15.00 DEST. CHG. 62.00 TOTAL PRICE 3937.53 (2) 1968 FIREBIRD 400 CV RA II/4-SPD INVOICE DATED 5/22/68 LABEL PRICE $4101.34 PAINT R2 SOLAR RED/BLK TOP NC TRIM 262 PARCHMENT BUCKET SEATS NC MODEL 22467 CONVERT STD INTERIOR 2996.00 400 OPT. (REQ'D W/ 347) 273.83 347 R.A. ENG (RA I) 342.29 358 4 SPD CLO. TRANS 184.31 361 SAF-T-TRACK H.D. 63.19 37P AXLE SP. ORD. (3.90) NC 382 RADIO P/B FR. ANT. 61.09 434 TACH-HOOD MTD. 63.19 481 DUAL EXH. NC 521 DICC BRK.-FR. 63.19 MD F70x14 WHT-WIDE OVAL NC TOTAL 4047.09 HAND. CHG. W/R.A. OPT 15.00 DEST. CHG. 39.25 TOTAL PRICE 4101.34 PRICE ADJ. (W/RA II ENG.) 101.65 (probably dealer cost diff.) (The first 10-15 RAII Billing History's have a hand-written price adjustment dated 7/9/68) (3) 1968 FIREBIRD 400 CP RAII/4-SPD INVOICE DATED 7/10/68 LABEL PRICE $3985.78 PAINT I I AUTUMN BRONZE NC TRIM 253 BLACK BUCKET SEATS NC MODEL 22437 H.T. CP. STD. INTERIOR 2781.00 400 OPT. (REQ'D W/ 347) 273.83 347 R.A. ENG. (RA II) 473.94 358 4 SPD. CLO. TRANS 184.31 361 SAF-T-TRACK H.D. 63.19 37P AXLE SP. ORD. (3.90) NC 382 RADIO P/B FR. ANT. 61.09 434 TACH-HOOD MTD. 63.19 481 DUAL EXH. NC 621 RIDE & HANDLG PKG 9.48 MC F70x14 RED WIDE OVAL NC 754 FR. SHLDR BELTS NC TOTAL 3910.03 DEST. CHG. 75.75 TOTAL PRICE 3985.78 (Shoulder belts became standard (no charge) for 1968) Maybe this can help in your research. Good luck! Jim Mino |
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#266
10-31-2007, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Jim just curious where you got the info on the handling charge of $15 for RA option. |
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#267
10-31-2007, 10:11 PM
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VERY helpful information from Jim Mino.
1. Unlocked the mystery to option code 37P = 3.90 gear on Fbird with option 347. (Which probably unlocks the mystery to option code 375 = 4.33 on the GTO with option 347. 2. Now have 2 Fbirds and 2 GTO's confirming $15 price increase for Ram1 at later point in year. 3. Now have 3 Fbirds with 347 confirming $9.48 charge for option 621 RideHandle option - rather than $4.21 discounted price listed with 345. Great Stuff Jim ! P.S. Jim: we have one Ram2 Bird with option #742 (no charge) - do you have anything that might help with that ? |
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#268
11-01-2007, 12:37 AM
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1968 Ram1 Bird - White
Invoice 4/24/68 Paint CC Cameo Ivory Trim 252 Red Bucket Seats - Standard Interior 347 Ram Air................................... blank 351 THM tranny..............................236.97 361 STT HD Posi...............................63.19 37P Axle spcl order (3.90)....................n/c 453 Rally II......................................84.26 472 Console Automatic......................50.55 481 Dual Exh.....................................n/c 621 Ride Handle................................9.48 671 Underhood Lamp.........................3.16 692 HD ALT. 55 AMP........................15.80 702 Matching Spare Tire.....................n/c 71M-72C F70x14 RED WdOval..............n/c Option Total....................................463.41 Destination...................................... 62.00 Base price.....................................2781.00 Subtotal.......................................330 6.41 347 Ram Air1..................................631.12 (345-400= 273.83 + 347 Ram1 357.29 = 631.12) TOTAL ........................................3937.53 =================================== Label Price....................................3937.53 This one verifies again, the $15.00 increase in Ram1 option at later point in year. Original Ram1 option listed for $342.29, later it became $357.29. This is the second Bird, along with two GTO's that conform with this. Lacking option 754 Frt Shldr Belts on this Hardtop dated after Jan.68. Would have been n/c if listed. Could be one like I mentioned we might see with "shoulder belt delete". 
Last edited by Baron Von Zeppelin; 11-01-2007 at 01:51 AM. |
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#269
11-01-2007, 12:51 AM
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Jim, in no way do I wish for this to upset you.
PLEASE do not be angry with me. I have been a Full Fledge Fan of yours since the mid 80's. You may personally know this Convertible, and it may in fact be a matching numbers Ram2 Bird. I'm just running numbers for interest, not implying any type Official origin or otherwise status of this Car. For what its worth, by the numbers. Sort of reminiscent of The Boss's Voodoo Green GTO Ram1 Auto Hdtp. 1968 Firebird Convertible Invoice 5/22/68 Paint R2 Solar Red / Black Top Trim 262 Parchment Buckets - Standard Interior 347 Ram Air..........................................blank 358 4 Sspd.........................................184.3 1 361 STT HD Posi...................................63.19 37P Axle spcl order (3.90).........................n/c 382 AM Radio/Frt Ant............................61.09 434 Tach Hood Mount...........................63.19 481 Dual Exh..........................................n/c 521 Disc Brk Frt...................................63.19 71M-72D F70 Wht WdOval........................n/c Option total (less RA).......................434.97 Destination......................................3 9.25 Base price....................................2996.00 Subtotal......................................3470 .22 Ram Air II....................................747.77 (conforms to bulletin dated 4/29/69) (345-400 = 273.83 + 347 Ram Air II 473.94 = 747.77) TOTAL........................................4217. 99 ($116.65 above Label of $4101.34) ================================= Label Price...................................4101.34 ----------------------------------------------------------- Subtotal.....................................3470. 22 Ram Air 1......................................631.12 (345-400 = 273.83 + Ram1 357.29 = 631.12) conforms to $15 increase in Ram1 option at later point in year. TOTAL.......................................4101.3 4 ================================ Label Price.................................4101.34 It "appears" this Convertible was a Ram1 machine (by the numbers/math). For what its worth. Possibly the third Fbird to conform with $15.00 increase in Ram1 at later points in year. Autumn Bronze II looks pretty cut and dry. I'll run it later just for pleasure. Last edited by Baron Von Zeppelin; 11-01-2007 at 02:20 AM. |
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#270
11-01-2007, 01:35 AM
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1968 Firebird Ram Air II 4spd Hardtop
Invoice 7/10/68 Paint I I Autumn Bronze Trim 253 Black Buckets - Standard Interior 347 Ram Air........................................blank 358 4spd ...........................................184.31 361 STT HD Posi...................................63.19 37P Axle Spcl Ordr (3.90).........................n/c 382 AM Radio/ Frt Ant...........................61.09 434 Tach Hood Mount...........................63.19 481 Dual Exh.........................................n/c 621 RideHandle.....................................9.4 8 71M-72C F70 Rline WdOval.......................n/c 754 Frt Shldr Belts.................................n/c Option total (less Ram Air)...................381.26 Destination....................................... ..75.75 Base price.......................................2781.0 0 Subtotal.........................................3 238.01 Ram Air II.........................................747.77 (conforms to bulletin dated 4-29-69) TOTAL...........................................39 85.78 ==================================== Label Price......................................3985.78 |
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#271
11-01-2007, 12:10 PM
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Here is most recent updated version of the Voodoo Green Ram2 Bird.
We still have option code #742 to unlock. Revised Edition : # 3 (lol) 1968 Firebird Ram Air II 4spd QQ Voodoo Green / Black Notchback Bench Custom-Deluxe Invoice 6/27/68 347 Ram Air ................................blank 358 4spd Manual Close Ratio........184.31 361 STT HD Posi.........................63.19 37P Axle Spcl Order (3.90)..............n/c 383 (381 Rear Ant........................9.48 -----(382 AM Radio pbtn.............61.09 481 Dual Exh...............................n/c 531 Soft Ray ALL.......................30.54 554 Custom Option...................114.80 568 Notchback Bench.................31.60 71M 72C (MC) Redlines...............n/c 742 ?.....................................n/c 754 Shoulder Belts....................n/c (standard on post-Jan.68 Hardtops -at the least) Options total .............................. 495.01 Destination...................................83.0 0 Base price.................................2781.00 (Jan.68 $115.00 increase over initial base of 2666.00) Subtotal....................................3359.0 1 Ram Air II.................................747.77 (conforms with 4/29/68 bulletin) (#345-400 option 273.83 + RamII 473.94 = 747.77) Total........................................4106. 78 ================================= Label price...............................4106.78 |
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#272
11-01-2007, 12:19 PM
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This is Brians Ram1 Bird Hardtop.
It also has the mystery option code #742 on it. 1968 Firebird Ram1 4spd Hardtop Paint EE Aegena Blue / Standard Interior / Brian S. Invoice 2/23/68 347 Ram Air.................................blank 358 4spd...................................184.31 361 STT HD Posi..........................63.19 37P Axle Spcl Order (3.90)...............n/c 382 AM Radio/Frt Ant...................61.09 394 Stereo Tape........................133.76 414 Dual Horns.............................4.21 481 Dual Exh................................n/c 503 (501 Pwr Str........................94.79 ----- (502 Pwr Brks.....................42.13 621 RideHandle...........................9.48 71M-72C (MC) G70 Redlines............n/c 742 ? .......................................n/c 754 Frt Shldr Belts.......................n/c Option total................................ 592.96 Destination...................................96.2 5 Base price................................ 2781.00 Subtotal...................................3470.21 Ram Air 1...................................631.12 (reflects $15 increase in Ram1 option) (345-400 option + 347-Ram Air1 option) TOTAL.....................................4101.33 ================================= Label Price...............................4101.33 This one also conforms to the $15.00 price increase at later point in year. Also has the mystery 742 option like the QQ Ram2 Bird. |
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#273
11-01-2007, 12:30 PM
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I smell a vacation or two coming on from this thread..... haha
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#274
11-02-2007, 02:18 AM
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This is BlkBrds Firebird that won't work out - yet.
1968 Ram1 Firebird 4spd Hardtop BlkBrd A2 / 259 Black /Black Vtop /Black Custom-Deluxe Bucket Interior Invoice 12/14/67 Killer Killer Car ! If they had waited 5-6 more months before ordering - no doubt they would have spared no expense and forked up the extra bit for Ram2. 347 Ram Air.........................................blank 358 4spd...........................................184 .31 361 STT HD Posi..................................63.19 37P Axle Spcl order (3.90).......................n/c 383 (381 Ant Rear.................................9.48 ------(382 AM Radio..............................61.09 435 (431 Seat Belts Custom...................9.48 (fr & rr lap belts only) ------(434 Tach Hood Mounted..............63.19 444 Rally Gauge Cluster........................31.60 453 Rally II Wheels..............................63.19 (discount with Custom option from 84.26) 472 Console.........................................50 .55 481 Dual Exhausts..................................n/c 525 (521 Disc Brakes - Front.................63.19 ------(524 Custom Shift Knob..................4.21 532 Soft Ray WS.................................21.06 554 Custom Option..............................114.80 604 Rear Seat - Folding.........................42.13 634 Shocks - Koni Adjustable.................52.66 671 Lamp Underhood.............................3.16 702 Matching Spare...............................n/c 71K-72M (KM) White Radials...................10.53 SPR Paint Code A - Starlight Black..........10.53 SVT Vinyl Top.....................................84.26 Option total......................................942.61 Destination....................................... 150.00 Base price......................................2666.00 (pre-January) Subtotal........................................37 58.61 Ram Air1.........................................616.1 2 (345=273.83 + 347=342.29 = 616.12) TOTAL.........................................4374 .73 ================================== Label Price...................................4456.20 Amount under Label.........................81.47 -------------------------------------------------------------------- BHC has 7.00 amount in Miscellaneous Amount Box. The difference between Special Order Paint charges is 72.67 (83.20 vs 10.53 for Black - code A) The difference between non-discount Rally2 charge is 21.07 (84.26 vs 63.19) A possible theory = an $8.80 retail Miscellaneous Item would put this one right, if you consider the Special Paint charge may have actually been charged as 83.20 instead of 10.53. On a 7.00 dealer cost item, a retail price of 8.80 would "seem" fitting. Purely just a theory at this point. No way for me to know how to apply the $7.00 Misc Amt. The entire $81.47 could be related to the Misc Amt. idunno ------------------------------------------------------------------ Miscellaneous Items include: Child Safety Seat Decklid Luggage Carrier Removable Luggage Carrier - Karpak (roof mounted-shown on a GTO) Ventialted Cushions (old style basket weaved seat cushions) Cushion Topper (covered the back seat lower cushions - from UV etc...) Tissue Dispenser Compass Gas Cap Lock Spare Tire Lock Litter Basket Fire Extinguisher Highway Emergency Kit Engine Block Water Heater Source (towards bottom of page) : http://firstgenfirebird.org/firebird...tions.html#554 http://firstgenfirebird.org/firebird...tions.html#554 They have pix link next to each item (click Bird icon) I have no price information. And no one else seems to either - yet. |
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#275
11-02-2007, 12:28 PM
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I asked over on FGF about the 742 item.
A respondent from FGF came on PY and did a search for it - and found it. (lol) Sort of like your neighbor coming into your house and finding your car keys for you. This was asked of PHS/JM - by a guy owning a 68 GTO - in July 2000. """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" The information on these Billing History cards can be very confusing. That is why we do the decoding for you and high-light the options and equipment for you. Box "37" gives the axle ratio, which on your car is a "H" or 3.36:1 ratio. The box "74" with a "2" in it is for an internal assembly operation on your vehicle and is not an option. I believe that "742" is the operation for installing seat or shoulder belts. Jim Mattison Pontiac Historic Services """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" |
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#276
11-02-2007, 01:41 PM
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That would make sense.
In beginning of 68 model year (before Jan 68), seat belts weren't required by the gov't. Some came with the bolt holes, but no belts.
__________________
John Wallace - johnta1 Pontiac Power RULES !!! www.wallaceracing.com Winner of Top Class at Pontiac Nationals, 2004 Cordova Winner of Quick 16 At Ames 2004 Pontiac Tripower Nats KRE's MR-1 - 1st 5 second Pontiac block ever! W.E.C moment "Every man has a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts." "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid." – Socrates |
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#277
11-03-2007, 10:27 PM
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BVZ,
On the Black RA I Bird (my ex car btw :-)..... Special paint was a MID production year change for starlight black. It may not have even been an extra charge on that particular car. I dont think this helps you though/ If it wasn't an add on cost for BLKBRD's car then you are even FURTHER in the hole with regard to getting on top of the price discrepancy! |
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#278
11-04-2007, 01:32 PM
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Thanks RamAir2. I'm gonna let that one go in the unsolved file. lol
But it's laid out up there for anybody who wants to try. Only thing that would help that one is if the window sticker came un-glued and fell down in between the glass and the door panel. 
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#279
11-05-2007, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Jim: Please tell us more when you get a chance. You may have another piece of this puzzle. If I am reading this right, the 5/22/68 Conv’t has a label price of a RA1, but a hand written adjustment to the RAII price. Do you have a copy of the card that you could post? What is the build date on the cowl? I am still trying to figure out when the dealers knew to charge the new price and that might help? Also do you have something related to the $15 RA1 handling charge? Quote:
RA1John or anyone: Does anyone have a mid May RA card GTO or F/B??? Brian |
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#280
11-05-2007, 08:22 PM
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A sampling from the 67-69 Firebird Registry....
((more later)) Inv.Date: 8/6/68 8U17764X EUN: 82424X RAII/4sp/Cp Last RAII Firebird 8U16608X RAII/4sp/Cp 8U16473X RAII/4sp/Cp Trim Tag: 05D 8U16427X RAII/4sp/Cp Trim Tag: 05D Inv.Date: 5/22/68 8U16427X EUN: 65882X RAII/4sp/Cv Inv.Date: 6/3/68 8U16425X EUN: 66451X RAII/4sp/Cv Trim Tag: 05D Inv.Date: 4/24/68 8U15790X EUN: 58268X RAI/Auto/Cp Inv.Date: 4/23/68 8U15633X EUN: 45803X RAI/3sp/Cp 8U10872X RAI/4sp/Cp Earliest known RAI Firebird ? Inv.Date: 10/31/67 8U11534X EUN: 15652X RAI/4sp/Cp Inv.Date: 11/21/67 8U11972X EUN: 21482X RAI/4sp/Cv Trim Tag: 11B
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John '68 Firebird Ram Air 4-spd Conv. John 14:6 Semper Fi 
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