[JoeF]

OK, I've seen lots and lots of good posts about making torque, making HP, carbs, cams and headers (OH MY!). But, how do you get the power to the ground in a street car? I'm not talkin' ET tires, just looking to find out what can be done to the average street cruiser to make it hook better. My '67 has a pretty mild 400 and it has no problem spinning the tires. Yes, it's cool, but in the end I'm just converting gas into noise. How do I convert it into motion?

[BILTIT]

Softer tires (I use MT drag radials), adjustable suspension, some spray on sticky stuff.

[triathlonx13]

Mickey Thompson Drag Radials are far superior to your basic Radial tire on the street. If you know your going to get into a street race - lower the pressure to 17/21 pounds. Is your car a stick car? What's your estimated horse at the crank = 360 ??

.

[TIN TIGR]

the guys you see really bite on the street, in any situation, have balanced their car..they may claim its just some old stock suspension stuff, but it aint..and they know how to drive..back in the day, my old firebird, running 1968 pigtail shocks and stock springs would 1.9-2.0 60 ft..but at 100 ft it was rolling like a southbound freight and ran low 10's..before the advent of drag tires..the secret was in moving weight around as much as i could, and getting the pinion angle just right for spring wrap/engine torque values..of course we lied, and just said "look it even has stock shocks, dont be scared"...take some time to measure your car, and do it up..the results will be very satisfying..

[TinjunTribe]

Weight Transfer, as much as you can. Are your running a front sway bar? Handling stinks around turns when you remove the sway bar, but big difference when your front suspension can let the front rise and transfer all that weight rearward.

[JoeF]

Originally Posted by TIN TIGR

getting the pinion angle just right for spring wrap/engine torque valuestake some time to measure your car, and do it up..the results will be very satisfying..

This is more like what I meant. Do you need an adjustable suspension to change the pinion angle? or can it be shimmed? What about "no hop" bars?

[andrewb70]

Pinion angle has zero effect on traction.

Andrew

[BILTIT]

I disagree, pinion angle can affect traction if it is not properly set.

[Slick 50]

I see the pinion angle as something to get right for efficiency and to not tear equipment up but not traction.

[TIN TIGR]

iffen the spring wraps more than it should, you will find it easier to snap stuff..oh damn im not even gonna try..your the expert bozo boy..you tell him how to go fast on street tires andrew..thrill me with your vast intellect..show me why i dont know nothing..


(sorry, but every part of a car must be dealt with to acheive proper balance..you want the torque to bring driveline to perfect alignment with torque curve of engine..if its not correct the spring will try to unload car ..those with brains can figure out what im saying..the cats that are fast already know it..)

this all pertains to street type perfomance with a "sleeper" image..

(i love to cool2 image..thats my signature look,over the glasses, as if to say, "try again")

[andrewb70]

Originally Posted by TIN TIGR

...you tell him how to go fast on street tires andrew..thrill me with your vast intellect..show me why i dont know nothing..
....

I never said you don't know anything. I never said that I can offer any suggestion as to how to make a car fast on street tires. All I am saying is that changing the pinion angle will not effect traction one way or the other. If you have an explanation as to why changing the pinion angle effects traction I am all ears. I strive to learn something new every single day.

Andrew

[Slick 50]

JoeF, I too am doing the education on traction. I don't want to build a drag car but a sleeper for the street. I'm thinking Cal-Tracs, 17" Nitto drag radials on 9" rear and 8" front. I have replaced all body mounts, changed over to 1 1/8 front sway and added a 7/8 rear sway from Addco, KYB shocks and frame connectors. Not sure where to go from there but maybe some of the helpful people here will help.
Are we thinking the same thing?

[younggto]

Joe, I am by no means a rear suspension expert but I did some reading last winter and learned a LOT from from Dave Morgan's "Doorslammers" book, which I highly recommend. I also bought the Dick Miller book (pamphlet) but it was by no means technical, but was a good starting point.

I would have to agree that pinion angle will have an effect on traction because the greater the pinion angle, the more the tires will "hit." The greater hit will shock the tires, thus potentially giving you no traction due to wheelspin. But this hit will likely cause more worn out and broken parts over the long run.

For coil sprung rear suspensions I have heard good thing about lift bars and no hop bars. For lift bars Southside Machine Co used to make them but Lakewood is now marketing their design. For no hop bars Lakewood, Edelbrock, and Dick Miller now make them, but I believe Genuine Suspension may have been the first (back in the 60s). These bars place the instant center above the nuetral line, causing the tires to be pushed into the pavement and raising the back of the car. When the instant center is below the nuetral line the car will squat on acceleration, which is common with these cars when they were new. The suspensions were set up from the factory to "do everything", but not any one thing better. Tradeoffs must be made. To adjust pinion angle you will need adjustable upper control arms (or you could lengthen the uppers, shorten the lowers, or a combination: depending on how crazy you want to get, haha). -Jesse

[formulabird428]

I've had great success w/575hp and traction.

I use Cal-Tracks setup (the bars, split mono-leaf springs, and shocks). I also have ET streets (28x11.5xR15 w/15lbs pressure), 90/10 shocks on the front w/soft v6 springs, polyurethane bushings everywhere (except on the rear spring, front spring eye, where it's aluminum bushing). The top front control arms are torqued only 75% of standard, and there's no front sway bar.

good luck.

www.formulafirebird.co.nr

for any specs, click on the "engine" section, suspensions' at the bottom.

[TIN TIGR]

ok andrew..i misunderstood..see above posts..ponder the moment, it will become clear to you..

[78 GHOST]

I read in the August 2008 HPP about Pure Stock chassis tips regarding shimming the anti-sway bar mounts. I think every car could benefit from this as really you just want the bar to be free to pivot as the front end lifts.

This technique would permit the anti-sway bar to remain properly attached at each lower control arm, and to link both sides of the suspension together, while permitting the weight transfer that is desirable.

The picture indicated just installing washers between the anti-sway bar and the frame.

[andrewb70]

Originally Posted by TIN TIGR

ok andrew..i misunderstood..see above posts..ponder the moment, it will become clear to you..

I am still waiting for an explanation of how changing the pinion angle on a 67 A-body effects traction. In your previous post you talk about "spring wrap," which has nothing to do with a 4 link setup using coil springs.

Andrew

[TIN TIGR]

naw andrew, you figure it out..then we can discuss it..my post was an example..pinion angle will make a difference in bite..efficiency counts

thats partly why all those adjustable link setups are made for factory 4 link cars..

[70lemansport]

Since it seems that not having a front sway bar is beneficial, is there a way you could just temporarily disconnect it like with 4x4's? possibly somethin like this? http://store.jksmfg.com/merchant2/me...ar_Disconnects

[BILTIT]

Yup.