[NBF823]

I really should get one. It's a pretty bad enviroment around here. I window shop alot, even made a descision on what one to get a few times.

For me, it's a balance of fear. I know that if somthing should happen, I'll be sorry I don't have one. One the other hand, I don't want to be sorry I had one. My freind got hit with a bat about a year ago, I still don't know how I feel about that. He came out ok. But was it a bad thing I didn't have a gun, or a good thing? I guess that's thing about it. You have to make that descision, I try to avoid making that descision. One of these days when I have a few hundred not to spend and if the enviroment worsens I'll get one. Better to have a descision to make I guess. I hope to hell I never have to make that descision.

[4dblnkldude]

I've had my permit since I was 21. I did alot of work in the city of brotherly love. I am sure some of you can attest as to what goes on in some bad neighborhoods. So now I carry only when needed, and I'll carry a revolver during small game season.

[73LeMans]

Originally Posted by johnsma22

The only thing that people need to know about the right to bear arms and carrying a concealed firearm is that it is better to be tried by twelve than carried by six!

Just ask the scumbag that grabbed my wife from behind a parked car with a broken wine bottle. We were on our way back to our car in a parking garage after dinner in the city when this guy grabbed my wife from behind and held the broken bottle to her neck.

I didn't have any time to think about it, I just pulled my gun and shot the guy in the abdomen and promptly urinated in my pants. I'll never forget that moment as long as I live! My wife and I sat on the floor holding each other and crying as the guy kept screaming "why did you shoot me?". I kept screaming back at him "because you were going to cut my wife's throat!". He then started begging me to help him, which I did. I took off my shirt and used it to apply pressure to the wound to try and stop the bleeding. Finally, after what seemed like an eternity, the cops arrived and had him taken to the hospital and arrested me, urine soaked pants and all!

I was jailed, bailed out and charged with assault with a deadly weapon! A friend who is an attorney offered to defend me for free, but it never came to that. The district attorney decided to drop the charges. The guy who I shot recovered from his injuries, and because he had quite a lengthy criminal record, was sentenced to three years for his actions that night.

If I had it to do over again the only thing I would do differently would be to shoot him in the head so I wouldn't have to stand there and listen to him tell the cops and EMT's that I SHOT HIM FOR NO REASON!!!!

Since Brockton could be considered North Taunton and Taunton South Brockton, Im taking the class a week from tomorrow. This is exactly the type of thing I worry about happening.


EDIT = sorry should have kept reading! didnt know it happened in Boston, but those same types of jerks are everywhere! And Brockton is all too close.

[JackF]

Both my wife and I have CCPs.

My442, I hope you never come across a situation where you wish you had a firearm for protection but if you do and you don't, I hope you survive. If you or a loved one don't survive, shame on you.

Jack.

[gtoric]

According to the Second Amendment we don't even need a permit to keep and bear arms. Any arms. Seems to me a permit is an infringement on that right. Here are some additional thoughts on the need to bear arms, courtesy of Ted Nugent from his book, Ted, White, and Blue and retired Marine Major Caudil.

Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another; Reason and Force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or forcing me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that’s it.
In a truly moral and civilized society, people exclusively interact through persuasion. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction, and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some.
When I carry a gun, you cannot deal with me by force. You have to use reason and try to persuade me, because I have a way to negate your threat or employment of force.
The gun is the only personal weapon that puts a 100-pound woman on equal footing with a 220-pund mugger, a 75-year-old retiree on equal footing with a 19-year-old gang banger, and a single guy on equal footing with a carload of drunk guys with baseball bats. The gun removes the disparity in physical strength, size, or numbers between a potential attacker and a defender.
There are plenty of people who consider the gun the source of bad force equations. These are the people who think that we’d be more civilized if all guns were removed from society, because a firearm makes it easier for a [armed] mugger to do his job. That, of course, is only true if the mugger’s potential victims are mostly disarmed either by choice or by legislative fiat—it has no validity when most of a mugger’s potential marks are armed.
People who argue for the banning of arms ask for automatic rule by the young, the strong, and the many, and that’s the exact opposite of a civilized society. A mugger, even an armed one, can only make a successful living in a society where the state has granted him a force monopoly.
Then there’s the argument that the gun makes confrontations lethal that otherwise would only result in injury. This argument is fallacious in several ways. Without guns involved, confrontations are won by the physically superior party; inflicting overwhelming injury on the loser.
People who think that fists, bats, sticks, or stones don’t constitute lethal force watch too much TV, where people take beating and come out of it with a bloody lip at worst. The fact that the gun makes lethal force easier works solely in favor of the weaker defender, not the stronger attacker. If both are armed, the field is level.
The gun is the only weapon that’s as lethal in the hands of an octogenarian as it is in the hands of a weight lifter. It simply wouldn’t work as well as a force equalizer if it wasn’t both lethal and easily employable.
When I carry a gun, I don’t do so because I am looking for a fight. But because I’m looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don’t carry it because I’m afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn’t limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force. It removes force from the equation…and that’s why carrying a gun is a civilized act.
So the greatest civilization is one where all citizens are equally armed and can only be persuaded, never forced.

Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret)


If one does decide to own a firearm, please keep it in safe containment when not bearing the weapon. Even if you don't have your own children in the household, visiting children should be protected from curiosity and the danger a weapon, loaded or not, presents.

[400 4spd.]

WOW John, good for you! That's quite an experience! I've also heard of people vomiting after having to shoot.
Did that happen in Mass.? I'm also curious if you explained your side to the cops or did you refuse to speak without your attorney present? It's widely held now that if involved in a shooting you should never offer anything but your name/ID and request an attorney.
"ANYTHING you say CAN AND WILL be used AGAINST you in a court of law." Nothing mentioned about anything you say being used in your favor.

[johnsma22]

Originally Posted by 400 4spd.

WOW John, good for you! That's quite an experience! I've also heard of people vomiting after having to shoot.
Did that happen in Mass.? I'm also curious if you explained your side to the cops or did you refuse to speak without your attorney present? It's widely held now that if involved in a shooting you should never offer anything but your name/ID and request an attorney.
"ANYTHING you say CAN AND WILL be used AGAINST you in a court of law." Nothing mentioned about anything you say being used in your favor.

Yes this happened in Boston. When the cops arrived I was holding my shirt on the perps wound. He was screaming that I shot him for no reason. I stated that he jumped out from behind a car and held a broken bottle to my wife's neck. I was asked point blank if I had shot him. I said that I did in defense of my wife. I was then asked where the gun was. I had dropped it on the ground after firing as I went to separate my wife from him as he fell. When I went to help him my wife put my 9mm in her purse. When the cops asked me where the gun was my wife told him it was in her purse. He said for her to place her purse on the ground in front of her. He retrieved the gun.

Then one of the cops asked if I really needed to shoot him. I was confused by the question and then the EMT looked right into my eyes and shook his head and mouthed the words "don't say another word". I listened to that advice and didn't say anything other than I want to speak with my lawyer before I say any more. The cops were very cool and told me that arresting me was procedure and they had no choice.

As I stated, the charges were dropped and my bail money returned. There was some grumbling that the perp was going to sue me in civil court, but that never happened. It's not something that I ever want to go through again, but I wouldn't hesitate to do it again if I had to.

[mike nixon]

CCP holder here for several yrs and currently hold a lifetime Concealed Carry Permit. I got one because **** happens. I've pulled it once and didn't fire it but thought about it seriously just to rid the world of one more vermin.Dirtbag ran away when he stared down the Barrel of the 357mag with a cocked hammer.

I hope to never have to fire it but I will if I have to as will Jen.

MIke

[DiamondJim]

I have one. Some nights I am in the office late alone, 45 makes me be cuddly and warm. I have been shooting my entire life, was even on the Pistol team in the military. Protect yourselves and your family. Support the 2nd amendment while we still can. Join the NRA. -Jim

[Cobrabill]

I carry because i CAN'T carry a cop everywhere i go.

[Radman]

I have a CCW and do carry. Why, because the bad guys can be anywhere. Shot people in Nam, hope I never have to do it again. That said, remember the police will be there in minutes at best. Better to have something to stop the bad guy than be the bledout body when the finally arrive on the scene.

[lust4speed]

Originally Posted by 6t7goat

..I even happen to walk up on someone breaking into a cars and stealing stereo's one nite. I saw them before they saw me so I startled them and they took off. Thinking back it probably was not the smartest thing to do. What do you think?

One thing that will be hammered into you in class is your CCW only gives you the right to protect yourself and others from grave bodily harm. I'm not talking about the castle doctrine where you are on your own property - no CCW needed there and a whole different set of rules apply.

If you do shoot someone, you will be arrested, your weapon confiscated, and you will be subject to prosecution the same as johnsma22 went through. You will be up to your neck in S***. Johnsma22 was fully justified in the shooting, but still had to endure the aftermath. As was stated above "I'd rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6" -- well you better be able to prove you were preventing yourself or your friends from being carried by six. Even then the surviving family can sue you.

[T A 70]

Originally Posted by lust4speed

One thing that will be hammered into you in class is your CCW only gives you the right to protect yourself and others from grave bodily harm. I'm not talking about the castle doctrine where you are on your own property - no CCW needed there and a whole different set of rules apply.

If you do shoot someone, you will be arrested, your weapon confiscated, and you will be subject to prosecution the same as johnsma22 went through. You will be up to your neck in S***. Johnsma22 was fully justified in the shooting, but still had to endure the aftermath. As was stated above "I'd rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6" -- well you better be able to prove you were preventing yourself or your friends from being carried by six. Even then the surviving family can sue you.

That's right, and if there's an opportunity to retreat without using that weapon you must do so or you will end up in jail, sued, and probably lose everything you've worked for all your life.
In John's case, he was protecting another life from imminent grave bodily harm or death which is legal here in California. But!! If the guy was a relatively "safe" distance away with that glass and she could have ran off he couldn't legally shoot him. You absolutely cannot predict what a jury considers "reasonable" and could be convicted of murder/manslaughter by shooting anyone.
In a different scenario, let's say you're carrying and someone has you with both hands choking you out: You know your lights are going out soon, you reach and put a round in his chest...better hope someone witnessed it or you may be in deep..
Doesn't sound fair but that's the risk.

[Sporter]

All non-felons have the right to a conceal carry permit in Florida. Don't need a reason, don't need to list weapons or serial numbers. Its your RIGHT to carry, but you do have to take a gun safety course unless you have either military or law enforcement experience. I had one for years but let it expire since you don't need it to carry a weapon in your car. Most states will honor a carry permit so it is helpful if you travel on the interstates. I never travel unarmed.

Why do I carry? In 1980 I and 2 other GIs unwittingly rode our motorcycles right into the Liberty City Riots in Miami. 20,000 crazy, rioting, killing, raping, burning, thieving animals running all over the place. Idiots were attacking people with machettes. Very ugly scene. We only survived due to the other two riders being military police and both had their 45s on them. They only had to shoot once to clear a path to escape. I learned two hard lessons that night; 1: The police were nowhere in sight - the only one responsible for your safety is YOU! 2: everyone respects the gun!

[goquick]

Read the Bill Of Rights. Fuc permits and the unConstitutional aholes who want us to have one. If I feel like keeping arms of my choosing that day, I will and there is not a single unConstitutional restriction by any state or federal law I'd consider as higher than my Constitutional Right to do so. To hell with these pu$$ifed weak kneed idiots in elected office thinking their unConstitutional bs laws is not an act of Treason.

[Jack Gifford]

Here in NYS it's merely called a pistol permit, but it allows concealed carrying. Although I got mine only because I wanted to carry a compact varmint weapon on my forty acres of fields/woods- usually on a tractor, where a long gun is a pain. However, I admit to feeling better-prepared in other situations, also- such as sleeping alone in the back of the Suburban on trips.

[gtoric]

I don't understand where the Constitution differentiates between the right to bear a stick or a blade or a concealed Mac10. we have the right to bear ANY ARMS, ballistic or not; deadly or not. If you want to walk around with a fully automatic MooseRaper strapped to your back, as long as you can carry it, you should be legally allowed to possess it and bear it, no infringements attached -- according to our Constitution. Unfortunately, the Founding Fathers, in their age of flintlocks and muzzle-loaders, did not envision today's diabolical firearms and their deadly portability. So today all we can ask for is the unfettered ability to protect ourselves and our families.

The right to bear arms was set down in doctrine to enable the United States of America's citizens to protect their lives, their private property, their State and their Country. The right was created to enable citizens to maintain a free state. To me, that means protecting themselves against those who would do us wrong by force, be it criminals or politicians, mobs or just a single bully in a dark alley with his own weapon and a mad-on grudge against you, and with no respect for your rights.

The second amendment has not itself been amended since it was ratified in 1791, but it sure has been infringed.

Why do we allow our government to continue to infringe upon our right to bear arms via the requirement of various carry/conceal permits? Permits primarily serve the government to record where the arms are held. How do you control a militia? Take away their weapons. How do you know where the weapons are? Record ownership via permits.

The most dangerous places in the country are those locations that are weapon-free zones, because the bad guys know that those are the sanctuaries where someone who holds a weapon is absolutely and uncontestably in control. By virtue of walking into a school, church, government office or any such weapon-free zone, these thoroughly detestable and cowardly criminals are assured to be in charge of any situation as long as they are the only ones who bear an arm. As soon as one other arm comes out of a holster or purse, the odds are evened.

All of that said, the consequences of pulling a trigger or swinging a nunchuk are subject to many and various forms of prosecution. If you pull out a weapon and use it, laws will have something to say about how you are treated afterward, whether you are using it in self-defense or not.

One more thing-- is ammunition considered to be a component part of the arm/weapon? In other words, are bullets and shells protected under the umbrella of the Second Amendment, or can they be restricted and banned without constitutional protection? Be aware of the bullet police confiscating any and all ammo so that your arms will be rendered useless without violating your rights.

Wow, don't get me started

[400 4spd.]

Originally Posted by gtoric

I don't understand where the Constitution differentiates between the right to bear a stick or a blade or a concealed Mac10. we have the right to bear ANY ARMS, ballistic or not; deadly or not. If you want to walk around with a fully automatic MooseRaper strapped to your back, as long as you can carry it, you should be legally allowed to possess it and bear it, no infringements attached -- according to our Constitution. Unfortunately, the Founding Fathers, in their age of flintlocks and muzzle-loaders, did not envision today's diabolical firearms and their deadly portability. So today all we can ask for is the unfettered ability to protect ourselves and our families.

The right to bear arms was set down in doctrine to enable the United States of America's citizens to protect their lives, their private property, their State and their Country. The right was created to enable citizens to maintain a free state. To me, that means protecting themselves against those who would do us wrong by force, be it criminals or politicians, mobs or just a single bully in a dark alley with his own weapon and a mad-on grudge against you, and with no respect for your rights.

The second amendment has not itself been amended since it was ratified in 1791, but it sure has been infringed.

Why do we allow our government to continue to infringe upon our right to bear arms via the requirement of various carry/conceal permits? Permits primarily serve the government to record where the arms are held. How do you control a militia? Take away their weapons. How do you know where the weapons are? Record ownership via permits.

The most dangerous places in the country are those locations that are weapon-free zones, because the bad guys know that those are the sanctuaries where someone who holds a weapon is absolutely and uncontestably in control. By virtue of walking into a school, church, government office or any such weapon-free zone, these thoroughly detestable and cowardly criminals are assured to be in charge of any situation as long as they are the only ones who bear an arm. As soon as one other arm comes out of a holster or purse, the odds are evened.

All of that said, the consequences of pulling a trigger or swinging a nunchuk are subject to many and various forms of prosecution. If you pull out a weapon and use it, laws will have something to say about how you are treated afterward, whether you are using it in self-defense or not.

One more thing-- is ammunition considered to be a component part of the arm/weapon? In other words, are bullets and shells protected under the umbrella of the Second Amendment, or can they be restricted and banned without constitutional protection? Be aware of the bullet police confiscating any and all ammo so that your arms will be rendered useless without violating your rights.

Wow, don't get me started

Precisely why this is taking place!!
http://secondamendmentmarch.com/

[Region Warrior]

In Indiana, your take'n in for questioning.
Once inside out of public sight, it's hand shakes and high fives.

Permits/licenses are just for revenue.
Indiana has "life time" licenses for about $100.
Or every 4 yrs for about $12.
Thier think'n bout drop'n life time do to loss of revenue.

[Region Warrior]

Dead perps cant sue let alone lie.