[v869tr6]

Plan to step over to the DARK side and give EFI a try.
Couple of pictures.

[marks73ta]

What control system are you planning on using? Have you calculated your injector size yet? Mark L

[v869tr6]

I picked up a set of used 160# injectors, and plan to run on e85 and maybe e98 at the strip.
Haven't picked a ECU yet.

[marks73ta]

I would love to run E85 but there are only 2 station in all of the Phornix area selling E85. I want to cruise around the city and the state and I'm not sure how one of those 100 gallon Peterbuilt fuel tanks would look on top of my trunk. Although----they are chrome, LOL!!! If my car were strip only, one of the stations is only about 8 minutes away. That I could handle. Are #160s big enough for your needs with the E85 or did you buy them because for a great deal?? I did a quick and dirty flow estimate of mine throwing 1500 HP out there just for reference and came up with 128s for gasoline. So I guess 160s should be right there?? Just wondering. Mark L

[v869tr6]

One of my buddies runs 160# with E85 and has been 160 MPH with a 3500 lb Mustang. He has also spent time on dynos and told me 160s would support about 1000 HP at the tire with E98. 1000 at the tire with my 2900lb car should be close to high 7's

[BruceWilkie]

I'm looking at two ways. Based on cost I think using MegaSquirt and building my own or spend for what I feel is the best engine management pkg out there, Electromotive.
Past few years I've been looking at all the options reading the manuals etc.. Tom Nelson Racing engines uses Electromotive on all his Turbo projects. Quite a few builders use FAST systems or Big Stuff. My main attraction to the Electromotive is on the ignition design/capability and total engine management. (and I had decided that before knowing Nelson used it)

EFI may not be a power advantage but if done right a more consistant way to go vs having to constantly change jets etc. to keep in line with conditions.

E85 has just become available at my usual fill up spot vs 20 minutes away. $2.65 per gallon yesterday vs $2.89 for 87 regular. Dual fuel capability with EFI could be done several ways. Twin tanks and separate "tune" programs would be fairly easy.

[BruceWilkie]

BTW E85 would probably want a 160 over a 120 injector for gas same approx power.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by BruceWilkie

EFI may not be a power advantage but if done right a more consistant way to go vs having to constantly change jets etc. to keep in line with conditions.

.

I did an EFI on my old 350 Corvette. You are correct about consistency, in addition it allowed me to run one full point of compression above what a carburated setup would allow. This is in part due to my use of anti knock sensors and part to the tight control you have over air/fuel ratio based on both load and RPM.

Be sure to get a sequential port injection setup and not a multi port setup. The real control comes when you are squirting into each cylinder only during the intake stroke. I used the Edelbrock Pro-Flow setup and really enjoyed the whole experience.

If the GP had not been a pure stock resto I would have gone EFI in a heartbeat.

Have fun!

-Harry

[Karch]

Just curious, what is the fuel demand for E85 vs. gasoline? Or, I guess more importantly, what is the a/f ratio of E85 at stoich?

Reason being, if E85 uses about 25-30% more fuel, and costs $2.65/gal vs. $2.87, is there a savings?

Then of course there's BTU content.

[marks73ta]

You have to compare the E85 price against the price of the highest premium available. Not the regular price. In the 2.87 regular example, the top premium would be at least 3.07 if you are lucky. Most stations now a days are adding 12 cents per upgrade. So the top premium could be as much as 3.11 or more. Now you add that the E85 is around 112 octane and you're way ahead of the game, even though you are using more fuel per mile. You can tune the car to run even more efficient (higher compression) for more miles per gallon or tune for much more horsepower that would not be possible even with the top premium. I think it is a win win situtation. The number one problem is availability. Mark L

[v869tr6]

I plan to either run a Bigstuff3 or a Fast system, the Fast system has just come out with new software in Jan. that I have heard has self tuning and even traction control.
I have two fuel tanks now and has saved me a lot in fuel costs. I run 92 octane at lower boost and 110 octane when I turn up the boost.
My friend runs lower 20 PSI boost all the time with E85 and E98 when he go's up around 30psi
So the octane from E85 is going to be great, I hear there is also a power advantage with alcohol. Plus there should be a slight advantage as far as cooling go's.

[BruceWilkie]

I suspect it might get expensive or go away if subsidies stop, however OPEC could still jack prices enough that even unsubsidized E85 could be cheaper than race gas. Its time we go back to relying on our own resources for oil/transportation fuel and start making greater use of nuclear power for heat/electricity. Hydro power also where plentiful. I dont think you can build enough windmills(kind of ugly on every hilltop) or solar power. Electric cars will then come in to their own as price of electricity becomes relatively cheap. I suspect its as simple as government doesnt want oil/energy prices down as it would hurt their tax revenue.

[v869tr6]

A 55 gallon barrel of E98 should be somewhere around $4 a gallon, if E85 go's away I can always go back to gas, but $4 for fuel I know people run 50 psi with, sounds better then C16 at $18

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by v869tr6

I plan to either run a Bigstuff3 or a Fast system, the Fast system has just come out with new software in Jan. that I have heard has self tuning and even traction control.
I have two fuel tanks now and has saved me a lot in fuel costs. I run 92 octane at lower boost and 110 octane when I turn up the boost.
My friend runs lower 20 PSI boost all the time with E85 and E98 when he go's up around 30psi
So the octane from E85 is going to be great, I hear there is also a power advantage with alcohol. Plus there should be a slight advantage as far as cooling go's.

I suggest spending some serious time here http://distributorless.com/ (Electromotive) understand their ignition system too and start reading the manuals/latest software updates
http://electromotive-inc.com/pdf_files/tec3r.pdf

http://electromotive-inc.com/pdf_files/tec3.pdf

http://electromotive-inc.com/pdf_fil...rs%20Guide.pdf

Then look again at Fast, Big Stuff, etc..

Might want to checkout Tom Nelson Racing too. Heres a link to the "f-Bomb" 406 SBC he built for hotrod. http://www.hotrod.com/projectbuild/h..._manifold.html

Tom V recently posted this in know your competition sticky above http://www.muscularmustangs.com/2010...elby_gt500.php another Nelson build. Plus iirc Nelson has a Pontiac build somewhere. I cant find my link.

[JOE DEYTON]

I like electromotive stuff, but it looks like the distributorless ignition only has scatter spark.

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by JOE DEYTON

I like electromotive stuff, but it looks like the distributorless ignition only has scatter spark.

Very long duration spark at higher amperage than you can get with CDI(about 10 times longer arc time plus the spark itself is hotter) Previous inductive systems(points, HEI, magneto) used distributor which cuts amount of spark duration available. CDI discharges too fast to get that long a spark and cant multi spark effectively at higher speeds.

Electromotive can be run in non waste spark mode if you want 8 separate coils. Most OEMs have licensed some of Electromotives technology for their coil on plug systems. Cut costs where they could.

[JOE DEYTON]

I wasn't sure if the "coil pack" system was only waste spark. I would want full sequential injection and 8 individual coils if im gonna spend the money. Anyone know much about the newest Megasquirt 3 for a something a little cheaper? I looked at it a little, but not sure how good it is.

[BruceWilkie]

Joe it depends if you build the box or have it built. You are right on it being cheaper. Cant recall what the price was and yet looked it up maybe within last 2 weeks. Wish I still had my scope could come in handy on a build it yourself box if you encounter trouble.(Basement flood and it was plugged in)
There are certainly plenty of ways to do EFI.

[Karch]

I believe Megasquirt is quite good. Krisr runs it on his 406, try looking him up.

[JOE DEYTON]

Found Megasquirt info and kits here- http://www.diyautotune.com/