[superdutybob]

Originally Posted by njsteve

What was that old line from Bob Seger in Night Moves? "Points way up firm and high"?
:-)

"Points all her own, sitting way up high" as I recall. Love that tune! Mostly because of that line. I wonder what he was referring to?

[njsteve]

The answer is R-rated. ;-)
A lot of people have commented over the years that the Formula hood looks very "female" in its aesthetic design.

[OVERULD]

Especially when viewed from the driver's seat! Agree with others on this song! Think we've all been there.

I was a little too tall
Could've used a few pounds
Tight pants points hardly reknown
She was a black haired beauty with big dark eyes
And points all her own sitting way up high
Way up firm and high

Out past the cornfields where the woods got heavy
Out in the back seat of my '60 Chevy
Workin' on mysteries without any clues
Workin' on our night moves
Trying' to make some front page drive-in news
Workin' on our night moves in the summertime
In the sweet summertime

We weren't in love oh no far from it
We weren't searching for some pie in the sky summit
We were just young and restless and bored
Living by the sword
And we'd steal away every chance we could
To the backroom, the alley, the trusty woods
I used her she used me
But neither one cared
We were getting our share

Workin' on our night moves
Trying to lose the awkward teenage blues
Workin' on out night moves
In the summertime
And oh the wonder
Felt the lightning
And we waited on the thunder
Waited on the thunder

I woke last night to the sound of thunder
How far off I sat and wondered
Started humming a song from 1962
Ain't it funny how the night moves
When you just don't seem to have as much to lose
Strange how the night moves
With autumn closing in

BJ

[njsteve]

She's painted! Now awaiting curing, color sanding and buffing.

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by njsteve

She's painted! Now awaiting curing, color sanding and buffing.

.....and the race is on - can he get it on the car for the PY open house?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

The assembly line Formula hoods got a thicker Grey primer sealer applied - not the thin black coat that over counter / replacement hoods got.

I've stripped a couple of these hoods with top-coat stripper.
It leaves the grey primer sealer intact .

just an FYI tidbit

[Formulabruce]

looks great!!

[The Boss]

Now you tell him?

[njsteve]

The body shop guy used modern supplies anyway, so it doesn't change the outcome. The NOS hood did seem to be in an unfinished state as the molding seams along the sides of the scoops were still pretty rough. So it probably got pulled out the production line before they did final finish work for installation on the assembly line.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Now you tell him?

woops ... sorry if that was late for something .
i would have used a black primer on your hood too, Steve .
Was not implying anything towards that end.

Was just chiming in regarding the black coating and white underneath it , comments .

The assembly line hoods were smooth white mold under the grey primer too .
Still have one of the hoods here that i top-coat stripped in late 80's , resting peacefully in the faktry dark'ish grey primer.

Had a previous breather stud hole repair, and one rear corner touch-up repair.
Its smooth white mold where it was sanded down around those repairs.
74 Bird it was going on - lost second gear - car parked - hood went into cold storage unfinished . Car later sold as a donor body for a 74 SD.

[njsteve]

Just got back from the PY Show in Hatfield, PA. It was about a 100 mile roundtrip. The car ran great and the A/C was blowing cold. 700 miles on the engine now.

A local friend of mine brought his Quetzal Gold 72 455HO, four-speed, A/C equipped, Formula and we caravaned there and back.

The new hood is on and the paint looks much better than the rest of the car...now what do I do?

[3tas4me]

Repaint the rest! What are you waiting for? LOL

[Tonyqt]

Steve, your car took 1st place. And yes your car is very nice!

[njsteve]

Originally Posted by 3tas4me

Repaint the rest! What are you waiting for? LOL

What am I waiting for? Someone I can trust who can paint the car and not imprison it. I'm a bit gun-shy after the last project was stuck in body shop prison for 5 years.

[Formulabruce]

Great looking hood/job Steve! I thought the cars there at the show were in the parking lot like sardines,( PY Facebook pics show this) your pics put me a lil more at ease...
On the Paint job. I did, and prefer a 3 stage. Base, clear, wet sand and block with 900, and re clear, buff. Black looks a mile deep that way...
1. If your doors have dings, most shops will want to "Block" them on a rack./stand. same with the nose, front valence, same with trunk lid.
2. I would remove the wiring harness to the doors and put down the windows, remove inner door panels, lights out, and marker lights, send the side marker light bezels with car. Remove the lower valence, bumper and tail panel and lights
3. Obviously since you already had to "source" some correct hardware for the front end, IF they want anything besides the nose off, you better have zip lock bags handy and supervise...
4. Your car looks like a good candidate for a "leave it semi together" type job, if your happy with the Jams. Look for a shop WITH a lift, even a body lift , they can block the doors on the car easier, fenders and quarters as well. You can easily eliminate any paint lines/edges in jams by using sponges packed in the jams before paint.
5. Make a contract,WITH Dated Goals .. pay 500 up front, then pay as they work, in 500-1000 increments. I have actually SHOWED them all the money before they started..I worked in a body shop before and know exactly how it goes... starts fine,then insurance work, more quickies, then BLOW out the restoration the guy wants it...Body shops are no different than most builders ( no offense BOSS!! LOL) they often start new work before finishing work they are on.
I want your car on the road too, I want my AC ride someday!!
Edit: may want to stick with same brand of paint your hood guy used, what brand was it? PPG?, Dupont? Martin Seynor? Napa? Sherwin Williams?

[bossbirdta]

both of those Formulas look real nice!!! really like the Quezal Gold color too....

[takid455]

You got my noggin in the row shot above ! 2nd up from bottom I'm down low on the windshield. Fellow behind me was a customer and fellow in front was random fellow I spoke with for a bit. A quick funny. Didn't think the processing plant would smell so bad and thought it was the guy that smelled. Later realized it wasn't him.

[70RAlll]

Steve-

Nice construction on the shield..But I am confused?? All A6's leak? I don't think I agree with that statement..How would GM have installed 100,000's of this design A/C compressor over the years if it was a always leaking?? I think if they are not rebuilt or prepped correctly they will leak. I have installed and charged many many A6's.. I too have had A6's that leaked, a few times went through 3-4 different compressors until getting one that does not leak.. NAPA sells one with warranty for something like $79, use the rear plate from your original and it is dead on. There is a procedure to get the seal oiled before charging, also pulling a vacuum for an hour or so will help seal initially, plus will show any leaks before wasting valuable R12 charging.....If your front seal is leaking oil, then the entire system is exposed to the outside air..You will eventually leak out your Freon and your oil-you cannot replace the sprayed oil unless you open and de-charge the entire system- the oil is not separate from the Freon....So the shield may help for a 100 mile trip, but this kind of fix is guaranteeing you will end up with trouble down the line in the form of a burned up compressor or rusted inside of the A/C system.. Especially confusing when you consider a NAPA rebuilt unit is $79 with a warranty.. Don't get it..Would be like putting a shield on an oil leak that is hitting the exhaust but not fixing the leak?? Trust me..you can get an A6 that does not leak..

[njsteve]

Originally Posted by 70RAlll

Steve-

Nice construction on the shield..But I am confused?? All A6's leak? I don't think I agree with that statement..How would GM have installed 100,000's of this design A/C compressor over the years if it was a always leaking?? I think if they are not rebuilt or prepped correctly they will leak. I have installed and charged many many A6's.. I too have had A6's that leaked, a few times went through 3-4 different compressors until getting one that does not leak.. NAPA sells one with warranty for something like $79, use the rear plate from your original and it is dead on. There is a procedure to get the seal oiled before charging, also pulling a vacuum for an hour or so will help seal initially, plus will show any leaks before wasting valuable R12 charging.....If your front seal is leaking oil, then the entire system is exposed to the outside air..You will eventually leak out your Freon and your oil-you cannot replace the sprayed oil unless you open and de-charge the entire system- the oil is not separate from the Freon....So the shield may help for a 100 mile trip, but this kind of fix is guaranteeing you will end up with trouble down the line in the form of a burned up compressor or rusted inside of the A/C system.. Especially confusing when you consider a NAPA rebuilIit unit is $79 with a warranty.. Don't get it..Would be like putting a shield on an oil leak that is hitting the exhaust but not fixing the leak?? Trust me..you can get an A6 that does not leak..

The sad thing is I have been through a dozen rebuilders (NAPA, too) and even brand new Delco units and they all eventually seep oil from that front seal. This covered the gamut from regular passenger vehicles, trucks and the recent Pontiacs. This particular one held a perfect vacuum for an hour with no leakdown whatsoever pror to filling it with the proper amount of R12. We did the proper oil seal run in by hand turning the compressor clutch for a couple minutes to lap it in. I even pulled the vacuum down, and then it held the vacuum for 2 months while I did other work to the car prior to the refilling day.

A buddy of mine was a GM line mechanic for 20 years back in the 60s and 70s and is still a great mechanic. He is the one that worked on this car's system. He laughed when I asked him to place a bet as to when the oil would start leaving the telltale line under the hood. He said that in all his years of working on A6 equipped cars, he never found an original compressor or even a replacement seal that would not eventually leak oil from the front hub. Some of it has to do with the rebuilders that soak that piece of felt/sponge that is in the center of the hub. The sponge is supposed to hold the oil in place and keep it from wicking out onto the clutch, but most rebuilders oil the sponge first, so it gets oversaturated and just throws oil out forever.

Hopefully this car has the oiled up sponge situation and not an actual leak. It stills blows really cold. I just get irritated because I really notice the oil droplets on a flat black underside of the fiberglass hood.

I will check out NAPA and see what they have. The problem is my buddy doesn't have an R12 recycling machine anymore so I'd be wasting the R12 fill in order to swap out to another (probably leaky) compressor.

I will say that maybe it has to do with the higher pressures that R12 makes in the original system. My Gramma's 75 Esprit runs an A6 but is filled with Freeze12 which was a replacement refrigerant. With this refrigerant you only used 2/3 of the factory fill spec, so it is not running at the factory high pressure. That car has an almost nonexistant oil throw off and has held the charge for 5 years now.

70RAIII, I really do appreciate your technical input. You have helped me out a bunch over the years with brake and alternator parts/repairs. You don't happen to have a "pre-run in" compressor sitting around do you? :-)

[70RAlll]

Originally Posted by njsteve

The sad thing is I have been through a dozen rebuilders (NAPA, too) and even brand new Delco units and they all eventually seep oil from that front seal. This covered the gamut from regular passenger vehicles, trucks and the recent Pontiacs. This particular one held a perfect vacuum for an hour with no leakdown whatsoever pror to filling it with the proper amount of R12. We did the proper oil seal run in by hand turning the compressor clutch for a couple minutes to lap it in. I even pulled the vacuum down, and then it held the vacuum for 2 months while I did other work to the car prior to the refilling day.

A buddy of mine was a GM line mechanic for 20 years back in the 60s and 70s and is still a great mechanic. He is the one that worked on this car's system. He laughed when I asked him to place a bet as to when the oil would start leaving the telltale line under the hood. He said that in all his years of working on A6 equipped cars, he never found an original compressor or even a replacement seal that would not eventually leak oil from the front hub. Some of it has to do with the rebuilders that soak that piece of felt/sponge that is in the center of the hub. The sponge is supposed to hold the oil in place and keep it from wicking out onto the clutch, but most rebuilders oil the sponge first, so it gets oversaturated and just throws oil out forever.

Hopefully this car has the oiled up sponge situation and not an actual leak. It stills blows really cold. I just get irritated because I really notice the oil droplets on a flat black underside of the fiberglass hood.

I will check out NAPA and see what they have. The problem is my buddy doesn't have an R12 recycling machine anymore so I'd be wasting the R12 fill in order to swap out to another (probably leaky) compressor.

I will say that maybe it has to do with the higher pressures that R12 makes in the original system. My Gramma's 75 Esprit runs an A6 but is filled with Freeze12 which was a replacement refrigerant. With this refrigerant you only used 2/3 of the factory fill spec, so it is not running at the factory high pressure. That car has an almost nonexistant oil throw off and has held the charge for 5 years now.

70RAIII, I really do appreciate your technical input. You have helped me out a bunch over the years with brake and alternator parts/repairs. You don't happen to have a "pre-run in" compressor sitting around do you? :-)

Steve.. don't have one I would use. I have a couple NOS units, but truth betold I think I would rather use a recently rebuilt unit.. NAPA is a good deal, and like I said.. they will honor the warranty is the seal is leaking.. As far as your system having higher pressures, R12 runs close to 134 pressures, and 134 is actually the higher.. If your system held vacuum for so long, then I say you over pressurized the system and the front seal blew.The front seal accesses oil from the same place as the main system, so it is all connected...I have always put a 1/2 can short of suggested capacity on the R12.. If you are getting high side pressures over 220ish/low side >30, you have most likely too much oil or Freon installed.As far as shields being made..I assure you GM did not make a oil catcher vs fixing an engineering issue causing the leak. They just don't do that and thinking any car manufacturer would sell new warranted cars with a known leak.. just didn't happen.. The shields were for another reason, not for oil spray..