[ponyakr]

now, for the cam itself--my favorite for the 455 is the cam the racin boys love 2 hate & badmouth--thats rite, its the old stand-by ra4. when used with rhoads lifters, it idles smooth, revs easily 2 5000, & will run hi 11's in a lite bracket car. & it leaves hard from an idle, even with a stock convertor. we've won lots of races & 1000's of $ with the 455/ra4/rhoads combo--so its 2 late 2 tell me it won't work--you wastin yore time! today there are lots of cams that will make more power than a ra4. in '87 we switched cams & gears 2 get out of the 10 sec range & into the 9's(1000' track) if my memory is correct, it was a cc 244/253-.525" we went from 10 teens 2 a 9.85. although i haven't used 1 yet, i like the looks of the biggest cc extreme energy cam. a bird in a hpp shootout ran real low 11's with 1 of these. this will probably be the next cam i try--with rhoads, of course. lots of guys on this site recommend crower cams. there are also some good lesser known cam co out there. you can get almost any grind you want for $150 or less. rhoads rl 9518 lifters are $116 at summit--buy matching springs & your in business. summit even has some small cams for $60. most agree, its almost like comitting suicide 2 not degree your cam. but i'm such an idiot--i never learned how. always just trusted the cam co 2 put the keyway in the rite place--& used a 4 degree advance key--& got away with it! if you choose 2 degree yours--there is certainly no shortage of info avail on the subject on this site & just about every other gearhead corner. also be sure 2 observe proper lube & break-in procedures for new cam/lifters.

[ponyakr]

i posted some of this on a thread comparing 60 & 80lb oil pumps. but i'll include it here as part of my engine building specs. in the old days, nunzi & H-O were the only pontiac guys i knew about. read where H-O said 60# was needed 2 overcome the centrifical force of the oil already in the large mains of the 455 at 6000 rpm(obviously not an exact quote) so i assumed this info 2 be accurate & ordered an 80# spring & cup kit for my melling pump. later on i decided 2 just shim the 60# spring & save $. worked just as good. some recommend .060 shim--thicker shim=more press. many now talk ugly about 80# press--infering that many parts will suffer premature failure with more than 60#. many say 60# is plenty if every brg clearance is exactly correct & if the oil viscosity is exactly correct for the clearances used. maybe thats why some shops get 12 grand for a mild 455 crate motor--gettin all those clearances exactly correct--you think? if you've got the $--buy it! for the rest of us--i'll tell you what i did. if the brg & crank looked good, i just put new brgs in it, along with a 500 caddy rear seal(for big journals) & bolted it in. if the journals looked bad, i bought a reground crank/brg kit & bolted it in. either way--who knows what the clearances were? so for a little ins, i ran 80# press, 50wt racin oil & a can of stp (the thick, slick, gooey stuff). & lo & behold it worked--never lost a 455 drag motor. either just lucky or blessed i reckin!

[ponyakr]

as promised , TJ's 1st year '68 bird. notice front of goat up--because its motor was in bird. notice the channel iron motor puller between 2 trees in my outdoor shop. hey, you gotta start somewhere. this was her 1st attempt at race car lettering. she gets her 1st racin ink in the local paper.

[ponyakr]

once i saw H-O's oil galley plug set, i made it standard equip for all 455's. 1 had a small hole in it 2 squirt extra oil onto the cam & dist gears. i never lost 1 455 bracket racing--1000's of passes. didn't keep records of each motor, but i estimate i built 8-10 455's like this. raced em all, then either sold em or gave em away. the only 1 that failed was our last drag motor from '87. after retiring the bracket car, i let a dirt racer put the motor in his 2nd gen dirt car. if i remember correctly, he had a flat in his heat race, so had 2 start the feature from the rear. he passed everybody but the leader before the brgs got tired of runnin without oil & gave up. i was so dumb about dirt racin, i ran the stock oil pan--that won't work--will suck the pan dry. must have extra capacity & kickouts at the bottom 2 keep the pick-up submerged in oil at all times. i wasted a good 455 thru ignorance! i also ran H-O's oil filter bypass plug in all my motors. many think you should keep the bypass. another 1 of those back & forth debate topics. after 1 ballooned filter, i always used napa 1258 filter. i've read that a wix 51258 is the same filter & it is cheaper than the napa from many sources. i also used pipe cleaners in the pushrods 2 slighty restrict flow 2 the top end. i know this gags some of you guys--so if you got the $--buy restricted pushrods any way you want em. when i 1st read about the pipe cleaner trick, it made sense 2 me. it imediately reminded me of the metering rods in a q-jet. the bigger the tip--the smaller the passage--thus less flow. it worked great for me in lots of motors--never melted a spring or anything terrible like that. another word about oil--everybody has their favorite. most of the good stuff is 10-$15 a quart now--if you got the $, buy it. if not, you can use the diesel oil-- 15w-40--rotella t is higher--delo is cheaper--both have zinc. otherwise you'll have 2 buy a good oil additive with the zinc & stuff needed 2 keep flat tappets alive. ps: i am well aware that a motor will make more power using thin oil ,with the proper clearances & lower press. having said that, i'll remind all readers that what i am presenting here is what i did because i didn't have the big buck 2 do everything precisely correct.

[ponyakr]

the last 455 i built was the only 1 that had forged rods. i found out they were runnin off another batch of 455 sd rods. it may have been the last batch ever--don't know for sure. some of you guys may know those production dates. seems like i remember buyin a set & keepin em for several years before using em--sorta fuzzy on that. anyhow, all the other 455's i built had stock, cast rods--& i don't ever remember having 1 rebuilt. i do remember always takin several extra rods 2 the machine shop when it was time 2 press on the new pistons. & i remember buying new rod bolts, but can't remember the brand. again, just replaced the stock ones--never had 1 resized--yes, i know that ain't rite, but thats what i did, & got by with it. i tried 2 make 5000 rpm the red line on stock rod 455's, & set the rev limiter at 5500. i guess it worked--never lost a cast rod 455. could have gone quicker with more gear & higher rpms--but that would have been just a waste of $--same class--same purse. "oogene"(a friend i've memtioned) put 4.56 gears in his 68 bird(the 1 i have now) & said he crossed at 6000 rpm with his cast rod 455. i told him he'd better hold his breath when he crossed--but it never blew. i think he got into the hi 11's--i'll ask next time i talk 2 him. i've wondered how the stock class cars are going so fast now with 40 year old cast rods--then found out nhra started allowing aftermarket forged rods some years back. just wonderin--what is the upper limits you guys have heard of--whats the highest rpm you've heard of anybody turning a stock rod 455 & having it thrive & survive? now, we don't have 2 worry about stock rods anymore--there's plenty of cheap chineese rods now. but, again, if you've got the $, buy the best american made stuff money can buy!

[ponyakr]

as best i can recall at this moment--when i bought my goat in the spring of '69, i had never seen a pontiac piston. after racin that car thru the '73-'74 seasons, i had still never seen a pontiac piston--the heads & intake had never been off. when i decided 2 rig that car & a 68 bird up 2 run nhra stock elim competitively, i didn't have a second 400 2 build for the bird. so i decided 2 kill 2 birds with 1 stone. so i borrowed my dads truck & me & a local chevy racer(ys) went 2 big d & checked out some big area junkyards. found & bought a complete 400 with the chrome vc & q-jet still on it. also bought a good muncie 4-speed. that second bird that was killed on this trip was 2 stop in terrel & pick up 35 cases of coors on the way back home. we stashed them in ys's shop. the nhra rule book said factory gm pistons only--but as i've mentioned, gm was out at the time. now, at this point, my total ignorance & lack of experience surfaced again. if i could go back & do it now, i'd just order trw forged replacement pistons--since they were never checked. but i knew the stock pistons were cast-- so the closest thing(in my mind) was napa cast replacements--which were not up 2 the task of drag racin. so i suppose the napas were the 1st pistons i ever saw that would fit a pontiac. after i got the bird on the track, gm got their new batch of pistons--so i bought a set & took em 2 the machine shop. that was the 1st gm pontiac piston i ever saw. after that, trw forged were the best pistons i ever bought. never bought any ross, venolia, etc. hi dollar stuff. i did have a machine shop cut a set of trw's for locks for the roller motor in 76. they either did it wrong or used bad snap ring locks, cause 1 came out imediately & messed up a cylinder wall. they had 2 install a sleeve, which they botched--well i won't go there again rite now. from that time on, i used nothing but press on, forged, trw flat tops. plenty good for hi 11-12 sec bracket motors. but with the current price of trw's(or whatever they are called now) crowding $400, there are probably better values out there. maybe KB or? never used 1 of the hyper-whatever type pistons so i can't comment on those. if you got plenty of $--don't give it another thought--buy ross like you want em & lite pins--why not?

[ponyakr]

i have a tech ? for ya'll--concerning rods/pistons. while dirt racin, i began rounding up parts 2 build a 350p. a quick check revealed that no cheap forged pistons are still avail for the 350. i eventually found a set of nos trw's. but, before that, i discussed the situation with my engine builder. he checked a few specs & determined that some trw's to fit other makes with about the same bore size just mite work & would be cheaper than other currently available forged 350 pistons, even with the extra machine work that mite be involved. this concept was totaly out there 2 me--i'd never heard of such. i assumed that the pin height & offset had 2 be rite or they wouldn't work. i've since read where some run pistons backwards in order 2 gain a slite advantage of some sort-- so there went my pin offset theory. & by using big block chevy rods, many lenghhs are avail.--so that makes the necessaary pin height variable. all this means that there may be several rod/piston combinations that will work on pontiac motors without the rod or the piston having been originally designed 2 fit a pontiac. but all the math & measurements required 2 figure out these combos are way out beyond my knowhow. but i feel sure that there are several who post on this site who can easily make these calculations & some who may even enjoy the exercise. if you already know the part #'s & exact specs for these combos--please share. i'd like 2 know the best combos for the 350 up 2 as much as .070" oversize(i'm told most 350's are safe that big--some a little more) keep in mind--the idea is a cheap combo, for those who must do things on a tite budget or not at all(& i can tell from the posts that many on this site fall into this catagory). this may be helpful--a couple of sites have chineese bbc 6.535" h-beams for $250 delivered--ohio crank has same length i-beams even cheaper. & of course there are the 5140 rods for $240. & as for the pistons--they need 2 be cheap enough 2 make the rod/piston combo at least $100 cheaper than whats already for sale 2 fit the 350. since ppr is closed, i don't know what the best price is for stock stroke 350 pistons. if all this sounds rediculous 2 you--don't feel alone--it sounded far out 2 me when i 1st heard it! its just 1 more in a long line of subjects i know nothing about. but there are lots of 350 blocks out there that nobody seems 2 want. its e-z 2 make 350+ hp out of a stock stroke 350. so, if we can come up with a cheap rod/piston combo, they mite be just the ticket for a low budget street or bracket build. they'll easily run low 13's on the street & hi 12's in a decent bracket car--without breaking everything behind it, like the long stroke motors are prone 2 do. i just sold a 69 tempest that ran 12.60's with a stock rod/trw 350. so, how about it guys--can some of ya'll help figure this out--it mite help some of the new guys get started cheap. most just say--forget it--go with more cubes. that won't help any here! & quite frankly, i'm tired of hearin it. me & everybody else on this site know that a 455 makes more torque & hp than a 350--SO WHAT?

[ponyakr]

i'll say another word here about balancing. as i've said, i put trw flat tops in all my 455's. sd rods in 1, stock cast in the rest--all with pressed pins. i read that the trw's were exact replacements for the factory cast pistons, even avail in singles, for less than full set replacement. so, i figured they must be close enuff 2 the same weight 2 not require balancing--especially for the low rpm's i'd be turning. i'd also seen the sbc guys use trw's, even domes--never balancing anything--then turn em 7000 & they lived! so i took a chance that i'd be ok 2. never had a problem or noticed any bad vibrations or anything negative from not balancing. & again, thats thru 100's of races--1000's of passes. so, i have 2 say from my experience that if you use stock rods or replacements of = weight & trw flat tops--you'll be safe, unbalanced 2 at least 5000 rpm. but, if you've got the extra $--balance it. better safe than sorry--rite?

[Stuckinda60s]

In 1997, I had a conversation with Bruce Fulper. I was intrigued by the 350 and thought it had potential, was thinking of doing one for a friend and asked him if he'd had any experience with one. I got the same tired old mantra from him that you always got if you were thinking of doing one. "Don't waste your time, build a 455 and tear everybody up."

There have been a lot of NHRA class records set by those poor old 350's despite being factored up just about every year. Bill Rink got his '74 GTO down into the low 11's running Stock. He's running S/S now, holds the SS/LA record at 10.51.

Oh, yeah, remember Fulper telling me to not waste my time? Well, he built one and got 632 hp out of it, naturally aspirated. There have been a couple of magazine articles written about it.

[ponyakr]

here's what TJ recorded in our scrapbook about this mopar(will have pics soon) april 6, '75--she was #3 in an 8 car qualified field--a y/sa 6 cyl chevelle was #2--& the b/sa national record holder from houston was #1. so they finished like they qualified--the y/sa beat TJ in the semi's, then lost 2 the cuda in the final. they built the straight 6 chevelle because of a super low hp factor. if i remember correctly, somebody bombed the record with this combination, so nhra refactored the hp, which moved him up a class. anyhow, for what ever reason, the car disappeared. this happened 2 a lot of old muscle cars thru the years. some super smart class racer would figure out a way 2 coax a little more out of a certain combination & set a new national record, which would bring it 2 the attention of the nhra officials, & they would increase the hp factor on that combo. then everybody else runnin that combo would have 2 go quicker, switch combos, or quit. only the strong(smart) survived. lots of class racers would watch the hp factors & records closely & quickly switch 2 another combo if what they were running suddenly became non-competitive. i figure thats the main reason we saw all the 4 cyl, 6 cyl, & wagons. so many people flogged the popular musclecar combos that very few could be competive with them after a few hp refactors. but, the refactoring had 2 be done 2 keep the classes competitive. pontiacs are a good example. in '68 & '69 base 400's were rated at 330 hp in birds, but 350 in goats. or how about '69 ra4--345 in bird--370 in goat. or ra3 in goat 366--ra4 only 4 hp higher. so you can easily see why somebody had 2 sort all this out & come up with more realistic #'s. anyhow, in mid season our local track went back 2 running off local track records instead of the nhra index(i guess they got tired of TJ winning all the races) & cenla at forrest hill,la closed for good--so we hung it up for '75--no more stock elim for us--although it was fun while it lasted! Thank God for bracket racin that was rite around the corner!

[ponyakr]

here's the b/sa record holder, a 6cyl chevelle, & TJ's bird at cenla, still in red primer.

[ponyakr]

this lil injun is goin 2 do battle in the east texas bracket wars--lookin 2 take some chevy scalps. ba with the snorkel is the last early bird i had. mb's wife drove it. i got it from him after he started dirt racin. he likes red & white, so naturally, it had 2 be painted before we could race it(black is beautiful)(& quicker 2!) but hey, thats just my opinion--you are entitled 2 yours(even if its wrong!) ps: just noticed the '66 goat in the background is the 4-speed car i sold 2 my 1st girl friend & her husband in the late '80's. it was a nice ride after a tranny swap.

[ponyakr]

looked thru a paper sack full of old racin pics & found some more 2 share--a few went thru then they stopped--pics won't upload now--i hate it when that happens--don't ya'll. oh well, i'll just try it again tomorrow. thanks for lettin me vent & good nite!

[Greg Reid]

Keep 'em coming. Post some more of that '66 if you find any.

[ponyakr]

don't know of any more pics of the 66--just happened 2 see it in the background. but i can give ya a little more info on it. i bought it from the man who built super bee speedway dirt track about 20 miles from here. i think it opened in '87. when i started racin there & he saw i was a pontiac freak, he thought i might be interested in this goat he had--& of course, i was. the engine compartment looked clean & almost stock--almost original--but at that age probably wasn't. anyhow, it had a 4bl afb & a 4-speed with a bad gear(either 2nd or 3rd--not sure) it was clean, inside & out--so i was purty sure i could put a good tranny in it & make a few bucks. me & TJ decided 1 day 2 cruise up town in it & make a few loops--just like in the old days. i thought--most of the young people who see this car want even know what it is. the only '66 i remember was a black 3x2 4-speed--but it led a hard life with a hard drinker & his buddies & was gone from our streets soon. anyhow, back 2 our cruise--i soon figured out how 2 bypass the bad gear & we had a smooth & enjoyable cruise--made several loops around the old musclecar route we'd made so many times, 20 years or so earlier. but it just wasn't the same--we were the only musclecar in town that day. well, we were still busy racin so the '66 had 2 set awhile. one day the brother of my 1st girlfriend was passing & saw the car. her husband was a car salesmen at a big dealership in shreveport, if i remember correctly. anyhow, the brother told the husband about the car & he was interested & came 2 look. he liked it & i suppose told his wife 2 call me about it , thinkin she'd get a better deal--just for old times sake--he was rite. i sold it 2 them for exactly what i paid--which i think was $3500. the brother put a good tranny in it for them & they took it back 2 shreveport. don't know from there. that was the last time i ever talked to her. after they had raised a family, her husband died of an illness. but i heard she is now remarried & doing well. so i wish them the best! that's all i know about that '66 goat.

[ponyakr]

here's the Colt that TJ took her 1st solo flite in at age 16. then when she got her license at age 17, i went on a few flites with her in this little plane. it was purty slow & real bumpy. i thought flyin would be real smoothe--now so! a little turbulance can rattle yore teeth! TJ added that all our race cars were faster than its top speed of 100 mph!

[6x400gmc]

Originally Posted by ponyakr

here's the Colt that TJ took her 1st solo flite in at age 16. then when she got her license at age 17, i went on a few flites with her in this little plane. it was purty slow & real bumpy. i thought flyin would be real smoothe--now so! a little turbulance can rattle yore teeth! TJ added that all our race cars were faster than its top speed of 100 mph!

I thought I saw you mention a V-Tail Bonanza a few posts back. This is a pic of a buddy of mine's 1955 F-35. My car is in the background.

Britt

[ponyakr]

thats sorta what his looked like all rite--septin his'n didn't use boomerangs fur props--his were straight! lol. TJ don't know fur shore where 2 find any bonanza pics. but if she runs across some, i'll post.

[6x400gmc]

Cellphone cameras capture moving props oddly. Either that or in 1955 they used rubber propellers.

Britt

[ponyakr]

pics won't upload--logjam at py tonite i reckin--so i'll just hunt-n-peck awhile. i think i've decided what 2 call this latest series of old school tech stuff. its "get by tech", which from now on i'll refer 2 as "gbt". i started 2 call it low buck tech, but then i thought, no, you can't "get by" with some of the low buck tech. if a part won't hold up 2 the stress of racin, at the level you want 2 compete, then you can't "get by" using that part. here's some examples that i've already used. in the old days you could "get by" with gm cast pistons--but not napa cast pistons. today, for a 455 bracket motor, i consider trw(or whatever they are called now) forged flat top replacement pistons "gbt"--but 2 me, cast pistons of any kind should not be considered. yes, they are cheaper initially, but soon as 1 fails that initial savings quickly disappears(& then some!) now here's an example that has changed in later years. i now consider the 5140 forged rods "gbt" & stock rods no longer worth the risk. 30+ years ago i would have considered cast rods with good bolts "gbt"--but 30+ years & many heat cycles later, i don't consider them worth the risk--although i realize there are probably thousands of pontiacs still out there runnin stockers. & as i've said, thats what i used in the old days--but back then, the 5140's were not available. if you're in the boat with most others, you need 2 stretch your street/racin $ as far as you can. if so, some of this "gbt" mite help. but if you have the extra $, i'll usually mention some "h$t" overkill for a little ins. again, not the last word--just MY ideas & opinions.