[71 T/A]

I have the Old Faithful HR cam and race ported 62 iron heads in my 69 GTO's 461.
Dave at SD Performance told me he didn't like solid rollers in street cars. Mine is mostly street. What do you all think?

[skunkfunk]

Do you drive it much?

[BigB]

I drove mine on the street many miles with a HR cam and solid roller lifters. If you are driving cross country or a couple hundred miles at a clip it might be a little rough on the valvetrain. If you are just doing local rides etc. should be fine from my experience.

[Formulajones]

That's totally up to Dave but I disagree. Also seems odd coming from someone that will promote solid rollers on hydraulic roller sticks. And with so many people doing that hybrid thing here with success stories?? :shrug:

Solid rollers on a street car doesn't bother me a bit. With reasonable spring pressures and ramp profiles that close the valves gently, and tight lash setups now, I really don't think it's as big of a deal as it used to be.

Didn't even phase Tony Bischoff when my father had him build a 571 Pontiac, and told him it was a street car primarily that would see a few thousand miles a year. Tony went right to the solid roller lobe profiles and used the Crower enduro rollers.

[Navy Horn 16]

I was doing the hybrid thing, and it is less than a success story.

I ended up with the combo that I did out of chance more than anything else. I started with mostly stock rebuild but with HYD roller cam. Then I got a great deal on some nice E-Heads, but they were set up for solid rollers. Instead of swapping out valve springs for the proper tension, I got solid roller lifters. The HYD profile cam (a Howard's cam) could not handle the higher spring tension, and the rollers were etching grooves in all of the lobes.

I had full roller rockers with polylocks, so having to adjust the valves wasn't really an issue. The valve train was getting noisy because the cam was being eaten by the spring pressure.

FWIW, I did drive the car a lot. It was street driving, and I did put a lot of miles on it. I'd take it to work in Pensacola at least 2 times a week, and that was 45 minutes to an hour each way. That setup may have lasted 10K miles. I only went to the track once, and that was to test a fuel setup shortly after I got a $400 ticket on HWY 98. The drive to Atmore, Alabama and $10 test/tune fee was a lot cheaper.

Fortunately for me, I didn't have a total failure on the street. I noticed that I was down on power a little, but was building a 469 anyway. My plan to sell the previous short block and lifters went away when two of the head bolts stripped out and we found that it was full of metal. Don't be like me. Match your stuff and start with a plan. Take 2 is going to be much better.

[Steve C.]

"I have dozens of customers bolt the combo together with hyd. roller lifters and not mess with anything. I personally prefer to run hyd. roller lifters vs. the hybrid set up."

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...=784905&page=5

"I don't go out of my way to recommend people run solid roller lifters on hyd. roller cams, in fact less than 5% of the hyd. roller cams we sell end up with solid roller lifters on them, my personal preference is to run hyd. roller lifters."
Dave Bisschop

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=774971


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[nas t eh]

Ok, so I get that using solid roller lifters on a hyd. roller cam is probably a compromise so you don't have to go and buy a $300 solid cam when you have a nice $300 hyd. one already.

But, what about running a solid roller cam and lifters on the street? Any concerns except keeping an eye on lash. My motor is together now so too late for me to make changes without spending some money, but if I need to do something else it would be nice to know.

[TCSGTO]

You should always monitor lash on any solid setup as a part of routine maintenance. It will show any unusual wear before it causes major damage.
The newer street rollers should last a long time if set up right with matching parts. They are milder than a max effort solid so performance wise there is not much to gain over a HR. It's more of a personal preference.

[Lemans64]

My Street roller motor ate a camshaft after about 10,000 miles. Did not eat the top of the lobe but rather the opening ramp. Machine shop say too much idle or slow speed. This is a 4spd car with 3.9 gears, but does see stop and go traffic. Mind you this is a SBC. Dart block, AFR heads and was a Bullet Billet cam. Johnson axle oiling lifters as well. Luckily I co aught it before any major damage was done, but still it slightly tweaked a valve and went thru a set of springs. 2nd set of springs in a year. Same cam lobe as bad spring.

[tom s]

Since you already have the hyd roller cam and the new lifters from Comp are proving out to be reliable just put them in and be done with it.Tom

[Steve C.]

" I've run solid rollers on the street a bunch of times, one I know for 225k+ miles, one for like 90k+ miles, both looked almost brand new when removed. Ran them in both auto and manual cars, and did run a slightly higher idle, usually shot for 950 or so, auto never slammed into gear, but generally didn't run really tight converters. The recent, 90k mile one I sold, and that is in service in another engine without issues."
HWYSTR455
PY Street Section



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[Steve C.]

My engine builder checks new valve springs before he installs them with a Rimac machine at their intended installed height and with a retainer in place. Never trust the published specs !

Once the baseline pressure is known we use a LSM tester and monitor them while on the cylinder heads. And note they can vary slightly as measured on the cylinder heads vs a bench tester like a Rimac machine. Personally we check my valve springs once a year at the same time we check the valve lash.

http://www.lsmproducts.com/lsm_produ...essure_testers


Already mentioned, keep an eye on the valve lash if it goes away or won't stay consistent there is a potential issue. Also the lack of adequate valvespring pressure to control the valves is a potential killer on a solid roller street set up. And do remember valvesprings lose some pressure after initial run in and over time.

Use solid roller lifters with the optional pin oiling. Feeds oil directly to the needle bearings.

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[Steve C.]

Street use in conjunction with solid roller lifters, not brand specific....

Inadequate oiling, excessive spring pressures and the hammering effect associated with VALVE LASH play a significant part in the failure of the roller, needle bearings and axle. BUT again very important, the lack of adequate valvespring pressure to control the valves is a potential KILLER.

This from many associated tech articles and discussions.

" I know from experience with our race car, that when the springs were getting to the end of their life (borderline valve float going through the traps) if we tightened the lash up a few thou from the .028/.030" recommended by the cam manufacturer it would help at least finish the race weekend, which leads me to believe that less lash reduces lifter bounce "
Dave Bischopp

Run the smallest amount of lash that you can live with. Because reduced lash will allow less clearance slop for the lifter to bounce around in. And not being so far out of position on the lobe’s ramp, can help to somewhat reduce the shock loading/bouncing/hammering that the lifters will see, no matter how well that cam lobe ramp is designed.

In conjunction with a conversation of solid roller cams and control of the valves. On the Speed Talk forum a statement was made by a gentlemen with experiance and a lot of authority in the area of valvetrain stability. In part, he mentioned that often the term 'valve float' could be mis leading and went on to address the issues of a valve bouncing off the seat as it closes, in part due to inadequate spring pressure to control the situation. And he mentions, and this is very important, that if the situation continues the valve springs will further degenerate. If so now destruction starts !


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[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by nas t eh

Ok, so I get that using solid roller lifters on a hyd. roller cam is probably a compromise so you don't have to go and buy a $300 solid cam when you have a nice $300 hyd. one already.

But, what about running a solid roller cam and lifters on the street? Any concerns except keeping an eye on lash. My motor is together now so too late for me to make changes without spending some money, but if I need to do something else it would be nice to know.

That was my point. I don't recommend the hybrid setup at all. I'll run a solid roller with all matched components, good lifters and proper spring pressures and I don't worry about. I run quality oil, check lash once a year, that's it.

[pastry_chef]

I prefer solids to hydraulics.

Any future plans to upgrade to CNC aluminum heads?

[61-63]

Would any of you care to state what open and closed spring pressures you were running on these "street" roller setups. I am having a set of heads built and will use a Lunati hydraulic roller in it. I was thinking 160# on the seats and ?? 385# open.

[Torquewar]

Ran a OF for yrs now and had 4 of the older 857s that were on there way out. Tried the hybrid route with a set of Morels . Installed a set of Crower Vasco jet springs at 165/400,no issues last year but only about 2k(many spirited blasts) for mileage and 30 passes down the track. Lash set at 4 and nothing moved, it is reliable.
I'm hoping Dave at SD can spec , another cam but prefer to go back to hydraulic .

[68blackbird]

I have a 455 with a Solid Roller. 242 - 248 and about .575 lift on a 112 LSA

My machinist speced a crower valve spring that is about 195lbs on the seat and 400 lbs open.

Rich

[Formulajones]

571 ci solid roller

269-279 @ .050 .719-.727 lift 110 lsa. Using 200# seat pressure.

[61-63]

Thanks for the responses and to 71 T/A for hijacking your thread.