[MXTex]

Originally Posted by MXTex

If I understand correctly; when the motor let go on the dyno, the crankshaft and two connecting rods were damaged. If/when this motor gets disassembled (which I think is inevitable), I'd recommend looking very closely at the pistons that were on the connecting rods that were damaged on motor #1. A failed connecting rod could apply some very strong and abnormal forces on a piston. Assuming that the piston locations from motor #1 were duplicated in motor #2, I'd look very closely at these two holes.

[grivera]

Who knows what the noise is...but I seriously doubt it’s fuel related. I’ve used older gas in my engine and never had any ticks, taps or knocks as a result

[Va68goat]

Region Warrior,
This was a custom carb that was built by Jeff Koerner. I'm assuming the carb is fine. The carb was on the motor at the time it was dyno'd. Once the knocking noise is eliminated, we'll work with Jeff to get this carb dialed in.

[HWYSTR455]

Missed that previous post on the runout, and lean, yeah, my dyslexia kicked in. I didn't touch the idle mix screws after setting them to 3/4 each, I was just trying to get them even for an initial start. Being extremely lean could cause a lean knock tho. Can easily go to 1 & 1/4 turn on all.

Replace the line leaving the pump, but I'm pretty sure I saw fuel splashing in the bowls when it was running, someone asked me to look at that.

Maybe some casting flash or something at the top of the trans bell striking the plate?

Just throwing stuff out there, thinking out loud, but running out of ideas.

.

[Va68goat]

STEELCITYFIREBIRD,
I think we're doing some testing tomorrow. Thats is definitely on the list.

"QUICK-SILVER",
We've been down the road of the valves sticking. We all should remember that this noise has been present since the very first day this motor was started. I purchased the gas and gas container on the way over to the shop where the car was started. Paul also sugessted that I get the heads inspected which I did and they gave the heads a clean bill of health. Paul communicated with the guys at the machine shop regarding the heads.

chiphead,
I have kept notes on a legal pad regarding the testing that we have done since the knocking noise was discovered. I have more pictures of this motor torn apart than I have of me driving this car! I've documented everything....pictures, video, notes, receipts and I've printed out every page of this forum. I can't help but bring up again that the only common denominator between all my friends that have worked on this car is that none of them had this motor apart to inspect.

Formulajones,
The gas when the car was first started was new. The gas that is in there now is only a few months log. I had the heads inspected at a local respected machine shop and Paul spoke to them as well. They complimented Pauls work and gave the heds a clean bill of health.

NeighborsComplaint,
I think tomorrow is going to be telling. My buddy is going to address a majority of the recent thoughts that are on this thread. I hope it's something simple but I'm not holding my breath.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Va68goat

STEELCITYFIREBIRD,
Formulajones,
The gas when the car was first started was new. The gas that is in there now is only a few months log. I had the heads inspected at a local respected machine shop and Paul spoke to them as well. They complimented Pauls work and gave the heds a clean bill of health.

I understand that. I was just giving the example to those that don't believe something like that is possible, because it most certainly is.

[Sun Tuned]

Off come the heads again...

I never got an answer on the guide material but I'm going to assume bronze just like any other Jew/ aluminum head.

Not in this case but due to the advanced age of some of our customers up the street, coupled with the fact that most have numerous vehicles stored driving regularly is not an option for most. So I get to see first hand how quick this gas we have gets and goes all funky. Which was why I asked in first place. May not be case here, but since most other venues have been beat to death repeatedly, that's about all that's left. One way to find out though...

Pull heads and see.

We've seen several instances of gas heading south and bronze guides that didn't want to play well together. That was why I asked. I've got access to over 200 cars to make notes from. And once folks get them fixed properly it's hard to keep em that way if they aren't driven regularly or the gas completely drained. Kinda a huge pain in the ass.

However the ones that show up or at least the 4-5 worst ones that were shipped in and had issues before or after they got there and were started by delivery truck drivers or salespeople that weren't privy to the stale gas deal... almost all had valve issues and that one yenko bent some junk that cost some money to fix.

Easy to check for.

[Va68goat]

HWYSTR455,
Remember the knocking was present with the Street Avenger carburetor that was on there before I got the Jeff Koerner carburetor. The knocking has always been present and the signature has always been coming from the distributor area. The witness marks on the oil pump shaft and the damaged distributor bushing may be a clue to where the knocking noise is really coming from. We replaced the rockers, lifters, pushrods and flexplate and had the heads inspected...still the same knock!

[Sun Tuned]

Damn spell check don't know what a KRE head is???

Fresh gas won't cause a knock obviously but I can show you plenty what snug guides and stale gas will
do...

[Sun Tuned]

Joe I do hope you figure it out. It should not be this hard at all. I think everyone is about to have a fit to find out what it is. Nobody wants to see issues like this at all.

[Sun Tuned]

I wasn't talking about the first go around.

I meant this last time. How long did you wait from first time till now was what I was asking.

If it stuck a valve and it hit a piston, you'll have a knock for sure allright... I can give u a phone number of a guy with a yenko knows all about that deal.

I'm not defending anybody just trying to help u find it. Y'all looked at everything else 12 times already. Distributor bushing thing was just crappy parts. I got one here I can show u.

The rest of what you described so far I don't know what you could say other than something ain't right. But hell, we all already know that.

[Scott Stoneburg]

The reason I suggested removing the plugs and turning over with starter is because the noise seems to be more noticeable at lower rpm. With the plugs out the starter will spin the motor over easy. I don't know what else you can try without just removing the motor and pulling apart again.

[STEELCITYFIREBIRD]

Short(ground) or eliminating spark(pull plug wire) to one cylinder at a time, if the noise goes away, you found your problem hole/s, and possibly the misfire also if that is still present(based on RPM drop).

You can do this manually at home or take it to a shop with the equipment to data log the rpm drop of each cylinder.
Known as a cylinder kill or cylinder balance test.

I believe your only after a noise at this point? Misfire/shake at idle remediated.

Ignition base timing has been set at this point , correct?

FWIW ...From the video, I hear a wrist pin knock.

Wish you were close by, I'd gladly stop by.

Keep diggin!

[TedRamAirII]

I hear no abnormal noises when cranking it over without spark plugs installed. Does it have a knock when cranking, with them installed? I dont know about all that shaking, it should be smooth, as its all balanced and all. Has anyone "felt" the knock anywhere? or just hear it? Could it be the valley cover?

[64speed]

The engine builder I chose has an excellent reputation, does excellent work and I can attest personally to his work on pontiac engines as well as Caster1. If you want to drive it down here one day and crash the night before heading back you are more than welcome. When the engine is done wayne will break it in in FRONT of you and will not let you leave till you’re square. If you get it back home and put it in the car and it knocks then I don’t know what to tell you.

[STEELCITYFIREBIRD]

I sense your frustration, and likely building anger.
I was the guy that went and diagnosed our field problems (leaks, noises, other oddities) and when our fault, I often fixed them in our warehouse, sometimes in vehicle or I pulled it. (The plus side of having a mechanic assisting running a machine shop)

Try the cylinder cutout/wire pull, many noises related to piston skirt clearance, pin and rod bearing can be isolated by this method. It only takes about 10-15 minutes maximum to complete.
When you eliminate the ignition the heaviest load on these components is greatly reduced, and usually, if any inadequacy is causing a noise, that noise can be greatly lessened, pointing to the causeusual area..

HTH

[P@blo]

Originally Posted by STEELCITYFIREBIRD

I sense your frustration, and likely building anger.
I was the guy that went and diagnosed our field problems (leaks, noises, other oddities) and when our fault, I often fixed them in our warehouse, sometimes in vehicle or I pulled it. (The plus side of having a mechanic assisting running a machine shop)

Try the cylinder cutout/wire pull, many noises related to piston skirt clearance, pin and rod bearing can be isolated by this method. It only takes about 10-15 minutes maximum to complete.
When you eliminate the ignition the heaviest load on these components is greatly reduced, and usually, if any inadequacy is causing a noise, that noise can be greatly lessened, pointing to the causeusual area..

HTH

Great information SteelCity

[Va68goat]

The gas that is in the tank is not the gas that I put in when it was first started. The motor has just shy of 250 miles on it. The tank was completely empty right before we discovered the witness marks on the oil pump shaft. Gas was added to the tank and the knocking was still there. The motor was then sent to Arizona.

The gas was 30 minutes old when the motor was first started and the knocking noise was present. This is a brand new gas tank. The heads were inspected and got a clean bill of health.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[grivera]

Good points Mike as a process of elimination. Can the same be accomplished with Seafoam down the carb?

On the other hand, Joe says when using a listening device the sound seems to be concentrated in the dizzy area. This, coupled with the witness marks on oil pump shaft begs of further exploration there. Based on all that is known, the wear on dizzy bushing vs the oil pump shaft witness marks is a chicken/egg scenario as to what occurred first.

[HWYSTR455]

Ah, the tanks was installed later, I wasn't clear on when that exactly happened.

So was going back over the thread some, listening to the slowed down vids, and looking at the dizzy pics Paul posted. It certainly appears to be half crank speed, and the wear on the bushing is to one side.

So the distributor gear was replaced when the shaft/bushing issue was discovered?

Then maybe it is the gear on the cam, but wow, I have never seen that, though guess it is a possibility, and that could possibly explain why this has been overlooked.

I say swap the dizzy and while it's out, turn the engine over and look down the hole, see if there is a noticeable wobble to the cam gear. It's a stretch, but guess it's still something that should be checked/eliminated.



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