[Formulajones]

Yes, tons of charts and plenty of info out there. I'm only opening the door. Do the research and educate yourselves. Oils are constantly changing too, as are oil filters. It's always something to keep an eye on. Lots of good stuff out there.

[78w72]

thats fine if thats how you see it... my statement applies to normal oils in the normal price range, like the brands you buy at walmart or local auto parts stores that the majority of street cars use. not specialty oils that cost 2-5 times as much,. or a synthetic to a conventional... lets keep this apples to apples, not apples to watermellons!

not "boasting" about anything, im making a true statement about one weight vs another... obviously all brands will not be the same & differ in their additive packages & "yada yada yada" im not sure what that has to do with comparing weights which is what the original question was about.

for the most part, a 10/30 oil will flow better than a 20/50. just trying to share good information of fair comparisons.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by 78w72

one weight vs another... obviously all brands will not be the same & differ in their additive packages & "yada yada yada" im not sure what that has to do with comparing weights which is what the original question was about.

It's all directly related to each other and pertains to the original question.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by 78w72

.. my statement applies to normal oils in the normal price range, like the brands you buy at walmart or local auto parts stores that the majority of street cars use. not specialty oils that cost 2-5 times as much,. or a synthetic to a conventional... lets keep this apples to apples, not apples to watermellons!

It is apples to apples, the OP is already running Brad Penn oil, a very high quality oil. Then we have others throwing in their 2 cents trying to compare Walmart oil. I didn't start that, you guys did. Hence my reasoning for throwing up just one of many charts showing that not all oils are the same regardless of viscosity and that making statements trying to compare viscosity without brands and types isn't really grasping the whole picture.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

It's all directly related to each other and pertains to the original question.

actually no, its not directly related... the OP asked about changing oil weights, didnt mention additive packages at all. additives dont have anything to do with weights of oil.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

It is apples to apples, the OP is already running Brad Penn oil, a very high quality oil. Then we have others throwing in their 2 cents trying to compare Walmart oil. I didn't start that, you guys did. Hence my reasoning for throwing up just one of many charts showing that not all oils are the same regardless of viscosity and that making statements trying to compare viscosity without brands and types isn't really grasping the whole picture.

again no, the chart & your statements are not apples to apples. you are saying "some" 20/50's pour better than other 10/30's.. BUT the chart shows expensive synthetics pouring better than conventionals... how is that a fair comparison? i fully agree that some, (very few) 20/50 oils may pour as good as 10/30 but most are no where near equal. & chilled pouring numbers have very little to do with WARM flow of an oil which is what my comments were pertaining to...

& nobody mentioned walmart oils... i said walmart is a place many people buy common brand oils. if brad penn is being used here then lets compare brad penn 20/50 to brad penn 10/30... THAT is the only equal & fair comparison in this example.

bottom line is with 2 equal oils the thinner one will pour, pump & flow better. & for most engines in this section that is what matters. thats all im trying to say, lets save the nit picking of additives & other unfair comparisons for another thread.

[Formulajones]

You're pulling things out of context that has nothing to do with the OP, and missing the whole point of the statements and information given.

I'm officially relieving you of your man card and filing your name with the others.

[1968GTO421]

This thread somehow reminds me of a camshaft thread

[Formulajones]

It's pretty typical of anything on here. There are groups that can't seem to wrap their head around a simple concept or idea, very narrow minded in their ways, and then get a kick out of trying to discredit or disprove everyone else, even when pertinent information with links are provided. Then there are those that are followers that would lose their heads if the other made a sharp turn.
There is sometimes good info found if you can weed through the garbage. It's comical most of the time, but also sad that some very smart people now seldom waste their time posting here. That's the internet for you. Hopefully the OP got some useful information either way.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

You're pulling things out of context that has nothing to do with the OP, and missing the whole point of the statements and information given.

I'm officially relieving you of your man card and filing your name with the others.

LOL! im not taking anything out of context here & not trying to argue with you at all, i even agreed with part of what you said. my statements were directly related to the OP's question regarding weight of oil, not side tracked unrelated things like additives or chilled pour ratings. nothing more.

you showed a chart with comparisons of chilled pour #'s, (when the OP said he drives in the summer) with basically only synthetics being better than conventionals, obviously taking my general comments wrong & out of context that a thinner 10/30 will flow better than a thicker 20/50 with all things being equal. that is a fact & im not sure why you feel the need to critique it.

as a final effort to keep this on track, please, tell us your thoughts on equal comparisons... you said he's using brad penn, does brad penn 20/50 pour, flow or cool better than brad penn 10/30? as was suggested by others??? the answer is a very simple no.

so you can do what you want with my or other peoples "man cards" based on comments in an oil thread, trust that we couldn't care less!

[Dick Boneske]

Sorry I crated so much controversy. I thought the OP was a simple question, but obviously, opinions run strong and varied on this subject.

I was going to inquire about oil filters, but that may create even more controversy. I've used up the AC PF31's I had, and plan to change to the Purolator L30005. Both of these are the long style, and I know the Purolator has an anti drain-back valve.

My wife has an identical Tripower 434 Whitmore engine in her car, so the correct oil & filter choice is doubly important to me.

That being said, I've run Brad Penn 20W50 for the 7000+ miles I've put on my engine and my wife's with about 4000 miles since Dan Whitmore built them. I wish he was still with us so I cold discuss this with him, the most knowledgeable person I've known about Pontiac engines. I do remember he provided 20W50 for the initial fill.

[SIX8YAK]

Speaking of synthetics... That Mobil 1 15w50 has been piquing my interest. I use VR1 10w-30, but my new 461 has me contemplating going the synthetic route.

How many of you use it?

[64speed]

I didn’t want to hijack this thread so I started one about Lucas oil stabilizer. Navy Horn 16 didn’t like it but read the question and tell me what you think

[Cliff R]

For sure Oil and Oil Filter threads get all sorts of varied opinions.

Kind of related but a lot of my friends ride Harley Davidson touring bikes, and not just occasionally, they will ride tens of thousands of miles all over the Country to ralley's and such. Most of them are very particular about lubricants for them, and insist on very expensive Harley Davidson full synthetic, and a few of them use Amsoil dedicated HD V-Twin oils, and most also use Lucas stabilizer additives in all three places.

There is one of the group that is a cheap-ars so only uses the lowest price Walmart brand, and no additives whatsoever. He claims it's all "snake oil" and refuses to pay close to $100 for lubricants at service intervals.

Guess what? He had ZERO issues anyplace with his motorcycles, whether it be the engine, primary or transmission. He's went thru three touring bikes (trades them out between 60,000-80,000 miles) since I meet him back in 2003 and never had the first issue once engine, primary or transmission related.

I'm not quite convinced that his mentality is the right thing considering the cost of one of these motorcycles despite the perfect track record. I use dedicated primary oil, full synthetic HD engine oil with Lucas additives and Lucas 80W90 gear oil in the transmission. I also have zero issues anyplace, but my wallet is certainly lighter than my friends after service is completed.

I will also comment on this: "There is sometimes good info found if you can weed through the garbage. It's comical most of the time, but also sad that some very smart people now seldom waste their time posting here".

This problem has become considerably WORSE in recent years, and many very knowledgeable folks that I know REFUSE to be a part of this Forum for those reasons. I'm hanging in there despite finding myself being criticized and belittled by folks with less total direct experience with Pontiac engines as I spent on the crapper last week. For sure it's not much fun to argue with idiots, or to be chastised by folks who are trying to feed their ego's more than anything else.

I come on this (and other) Forum's to help folks out. For sure I don't know everything there is about all these topics, but at this point in my learning curve I certainly know what doesn't work well and how to build and tune one of these engines. I am DIRECTLY involved with some of the fastest Pure Stock and FAST Pontiac powered cars on this planet, and not just with carb stuff. I've done distributors, intakes, camshaft selections, transmissions and torque converters for a number of them as well.

Despite having to take some flack a little too often for my liking, I stick it out. Dave at SD told me years ago to quit wasting my time here, and recently I'm really beginning to understand why he doesn't post here. For now I'll keep putting some time in, but to be perfectly honest it'd really I don't like the way things are going on here and will be spending more time watching my 3 year old grand daughter and throwing sticks for my dogs instead as they are always glad to see me and appreciate my involvement in their lives........FWIW.......Cliff

[glhs#116]

Cliff,

Appreciate your sticking around. You've often been a great help to me personally. It's valued. I don't think it is just PY. I think the Facebook Twitter era has overall increased snark and shortened attention spans. There's no cure-all for that. On the flip side, I'm often impressed how very civilised a lot of the threads on PY can be. I sure do appreciate all the good manners and generously shared experience that I experience here most of the time.

Sam

Originally Posted by Cliff R

For sure Oil and Oil Filter threads get all sorts of varied opinions.

Kind of related but a lot of my friends ride Harley Davidson touring bikes, and not just occasionally, they will ride tens of thousands of miles all over the Country to ralley's and such. Most of them are very particular about lubricants for them, and insist on very expensive Harley Davidson full synthetic, and a few of them use Amsoil dedicated HD V-Twin oils, and most also use Lucas stabilizer additives in all three places.

There is one of the group that is a cheap-ars so only uses the lowest price Walmart brand, and no additives whatsoever. He claims it's all "snake oil" and refuses to pay close to $100 for lubricants at service intervals.

Guess what? He had ZERO issues anyplace with his motorcycles, whether it be the engine, primary or transmission. He's went thru three touring bikes (trades them out between 60,000-80,000 miles) since I meet him back in 2003 and never had the first issue once engine, primary or transmission related.

I'm not quite convinced that his mentality is the right thing considering the cost of one of these motorcycles despite the perfect track record. I use dedicated primary oil, full synthetic HD engine oil with Lucas additives and Lucas 80W90 gear oil in the transmission. I also have zero issues anyplace, but my wallet is certainly lighter than my friends after service is completed.

I will also comment on this: "There is sometimes good info found if you can weed through the garbage. It's comical most of the time, but also sad that some very smart people now seldom waste their time posting here".

This problem has become considerably WORSE in recent years, and many very knowledgeable folks that I know REFUSE to be a part of this Forum for those reasons. I'm hanging in there despite finding myself being criticized and belittled by folks with less total direct experience with Pontiac engines as I spent on the crapper last week. For sure it's not much fun to argue with idiots, or to be chastised by folks who are trying to feed their ego's more than anything else.

I come on this (and other) Forum's to help folks out. For sure I don't know everything there is about all these topics, but at this point in my learning curve I certainly know what doesn't work well and how to build and tune one of these engines. I am DIRECTLY involved with some of the fastest Pure Stock and FAST Pontiac powered cars on this planet, and not just with carb stuff. I've done distributors, intakes, camshaft selections, transmissions and torque converters for a number of them as well.

Despite having to take some flack a little too often for my liking, I stick it out. Dave at SD told me years ago to quit wasting my time here, and recently I'm really beginning to understand why he doesn't post here. For now I'll keep putting some time in, but to be perfectly honest it'd really I don't like the way things are going on here and will be spending more time watching my 3 year old grand daughter and throwing sticks for my dogs instead as they are always glad to see me and appreciate my involvement in their lives........FWIW.......Cliff

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by 78w72

thats fine if thats how you see it... my statement applies to normal oils in the normal price range, like the brands you buy at walmart or local auto parts stores that the majority of street cars use. not specialty oils that cost 2-5 times as much,. or a synthetic to a conventional... lets keep this apples to apples, not apples to watermellons!)

FWIW - WalMart carries Mobil 1. Not sure if they carry 15W50 (I don't shop at WalMart), but enough of the other box stores do - and the price is the same for all the oil weights where I shop.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by SIX8YAK

Speaking of synthetics... That Mobil 1 15w50 has been piquing my interest. I use VR1 10w-30, but my new 461 has me contemplating going the synthetic route.

How many of you use it?

Obviously I do - and have been since 2013 when I had my 462 built.

My engine builder recommended 20W50 and I originally used Brad Penn after the break in period. But I couldn't buy Brad Penn locally - I had to order it.

I had been running Mobil 1 0W40 (also has good ZDDP numbers) in my wife's Camaro with the 350 for about 10 years.

So I contacted Mobil Oil and asked them for their recommendations on oil for my 462 with a flat tappet cam - and the 15W50 is what they recommended.

I liked the idea that it was rated 15 at the low end - because I actually do drive my GTO in cold weather at times. The pour point being so low is an excellent benefit. As Pontiacs run hotter than Chevy's - I like the 50W on the top end.

Add the fact that I can go into most box stores and pickup a quart or a case at reasonable prices makes it a solid choice in my mind.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Cliff R

I will also comment on this: "There is sometimes good info found if you can weed through the garbage. It's comical most of the time, but also sad that some very smart people now seldom waste their time posting here".

This problem has become considerably WORSE in recent years, and many very knowledgeable folks that I know REFUSE to be a part of this Forum for those reasons. I'm hanging in there despite finding myself being criticized and belittled by folks with less total direct experience with Pontiac engines as I spent on the crapper last week. For sure it's not much fun to argue with idiots, or to be chastised by folks who are trying to feed their ego's more than anything else.

I come on this (and other) Forum's to help folks out. For sure I don't know everything there is about all these topics, but at this point in my learning curve I certainly know what doesn't work well and how to build and tune one of these engines. I am DIRECTLY involved with some of the fastest Pure Stock and FAST Pontiac powered cars on this planet, and not just with carb stuff. I've done distributors, intakes, camshaft selections, transmissions and torque converters for a number of them as well.

Despite having to take some flack a little too often for my liking, I stick it out. Dave at SD told me years ago to quit wasting my time here, and recently I'm really beginning to understand why he doesn't post here. For now I'll keep putting some time in, but to be perfectly honest it'd really I don't like the way things are going on here and will be spending more time watching my 3 year old grand daughter and throwing sticks for my dogs instead as they are always glad to see me and appreciate my involvement in their lives........FWIW.......Cliff

That's the best way to look at it. I don't care much what people think anyway. Can't let that stuff bother you. I'm busy enough with what I do here restoring cars from all over the Southwest, reputation speaks louder than words. Family is most important and I gain nothing in either category posting on here. It is what it is.

[Dick Boneske]

My 20W50 vs SAE30 Brad Penn question was handled for me by fate. The store that handles Brad Penn had no conventional 20W50 Racing Oil by Brad Penn. They only had 20W50 Penn Grade Partial Synthetic and Brad Penn 20W50 motorcycle oil, so I bought SAE30 Brad Penn Racing Oil. I was tempted to try the 20W50 semi-synthetic, but stuck with conventional oil.

Now, to put the Purolator L30005 filter on and I'm ready for the summer, at least with my wife's GTO.

FWIW, all the newer cases were labeled Penn Grade, not Brad Penn. There must be a change in Brad Penn corporate structure.

[TCSGTO]

Originally Posted by Dick Boneske

FWIW, all the newer cases were labeled Penn Grade, not Brad Penn. There must be a change in Brad Penn corporate structure.

Brad Penn was sold a few years back. Same oil,different name.