[north]

Going through my 69 dealer sales album I noticed this sheet which lists the weights of every 69 Pontiac model. These weights are for wet weight (all full fluids including gas but no optional equipment).

Kind of interesting but I have my doubts about how well Pontiac did it’s homework when calculating this table.

For example it says that the difference in weight between a 2 door post and 4 door post is 43 lbs on a Tempest but only 25 pounds on a Custom S. This makes no sense since the structural weight difference between 2 and 4 doors should be the same regardless of trim level.

Also interesting that a GTO weighs 270 odd pounds more than the same bodystyle LeMans.
I wonder how that difference breaks down...

V8 versus in-line 6 is obviously the biggest factor,
Dual exhaust standard on GTO
HD Dearborn three speed versus light duty Saginaw
Endura nose versus chrome
Buckets versus bench
Bigger tires on GTO

That about covers it (some minor stuff like the slightly bigger sway bar and die cast hood scoop bezels etc) since basic body, frame suspension and brakes etc are the same.

[north]

Here’s the page, sorry it’s sideways

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

The cargo space between Fbird Hdtp and GTO Hdtp is suspicious too.

14.3 cubes Bird -vs- 14.7 cubes GTO
thats only about a loaf of bread difference , approx

[north]

That may have to do with the fact that the Firebird had a compact spare as standard equipment and the GTO would have had a fullsize spare.

Another oddity is that the GTO ragtop has 10.3 cubes of trunk versus 10.0 for the LeMans. They have identical trunks and if anything the larger standard spare tire on the GTO (G78 vs 8.25) should give the LeMans a slight edge if anything.

A bigger question mark on weights is noticeable between the common bodystyles of the big cars. Going from the lightest (2dr hardtop to a four door sedan to the 4 door hardtop the differences vary a lot when you compare the Catalina, Executive and Bonneville:

------------------4door sedan extra weight over the 2 door hardtop------------4door hardtop extra weight over 4 door sedan
Catalina-----------------------20 lbs------------------------------------------------------------------60 lbs
Executive---------------------75 lbs-------------------------------------------------------------------20 lbs
Bonneville--------------------100 lbs-----------------------------------------------------------------0 lbs

So a 4 door sedan Catalina weighs 20 pounds more than a Catalina 2 door hardtop but the Executive 4 door sedan is 75 pounds heavier than an Executive 2 door hardtop?

This makes no sense since the difference between two bodystyles on all 3 cars should be a constant. The extra trim and wheelbase of the executive means it will obviously weigh more than the Catalina and the 428 and extra trim of the Bonneville should weigh more than an Executive but the changes between bodystyles should be constant across the three models.

[ponyakr]

I have absolutely no idea how accurate or inaccurate these numbers might be, or how they were calculated.

But, the NHRA legal weights are listed for lots of Pontiac models. You just click on a year & specific engine, and go to the list of all models that engine was available in. Example: 1968 Pontiac 330hp 400 cube engine in a Firebird Coupe --weight = 3300lbs

http://www.classracerinfo.com/Engine...9&MAKE=Pontiac

http://www.classracerinfo.com/Engine...px?ENGINE=2009

If this info is out of order for this thread, please ignore.

[north]

Thanks for the link, interesting tool, noticed there are some mistakes about which heads were used on some 69 engines btw...

[north]

By the way when comparing the weights from your NHRA link to the the ones I posted from Pontiac for the fullsize cars the weight difference is always about 200 pounds (sometimes 200 exact, sometimes a few pounds either way), so they must be based on the factory numbers with a correction factor for probably fuel?

[dataway]

I think the 350 blocks are a few pounds lighter than the 400s because the bores are smaller and cylinder wall thickness is about the same. If you see what I mean .. more empty water jacket space between cylinders. Also ... T400 vs T350 or power glide? Dual exhaust vs single?

[north]

I think the 350 may actually be heavier, unlike the 428 and 400 which share the same bore area casting the 350 has different water passages (you can't bore a 350 out to the bore of a 400 (they share cranks and stroke). Just looking at a 350
with the heads off it seems to have more iron in it.

The difference in auto trans weight should play no role since no 69 pontiac was equipped with an automatic as standard equipment. Dual exhaust (only standard on GTO and Grand Prix) should be calculated in those two cars. Firebird 400 and 350 HO had standard duals but since the engine was just an option package the Firebird weight should be just for the one bbl six with a 3 on the tree manual trans.

All options should not be considered in those weights. So a typical GTO with an automatic (40 lbs), power steering and brakes (50 lbs), A/C(115lbs), radio (10 lbs) etc would probably weigh a few hundred pounds more than listed.

One exception is a muncie 4 speed in a GTO, it weighed about 20 pounds less than the standard equipment Dearborn HD 3 speed manual.