[opeliac]

Originally Posted by KEN CROCIE

I agree with ELARSON, Once you put a pair of canted calve heads on a Pontiac 'looks similar ' block, in my opinion, it's a rat Chevy in a Pontiac costume

That line of thinking is exactly why Pontiac was held back for so many decades...There were never enough people willing to think outside of the box so the aftermarket world could get on board...

Chevy people didnt care about silly stuff, and they got all sorts of things that kept them evolving...Factory 4.84 bore space was traded for up to 5.3 bore space...Head designs all over the map...If factory parts didnt bolt on, they made new stuff that did, and people bought tons of it...

This conversation has been beat to death, with zero results...I remember back in the late 80s and early 90s, people were so adamant about original parts, it drove the demand for round ports to the point that new people never gave Pontiacs a second look, and bought the other brands...That also kept the demand for fast parts to such a minimum that they had to be special runs that werent cost effective for anyone...Thankfully there are some people that no longer care about any of that, and the parts are slowly coming...Tommy Youman's GTO is PONTIAC powered, no matter what some say...Same with Richard's 63...

[67Fbird]

It was refreshing to see that I am not the only 1 who thought the Milidon gear drive set up is a PITA!!!. I GET it but jeez. I recall back in 91 when I first build the 400 I bought, (previous owner installed the drive) degrreeing in the cam...awesome but not fun!

[Dragncar]

Pontiac did have ideas on a canted valve engine.
They made less than a dozen of them.

https://www.hotrod.com/features/expe...d-october-1970

[Nobuddy]

That is not a cant valve but a SOHC semi-hemi. Would be pretty cool if someone in the aftermarket was to do a modern version.

But I'm kinda weird, I wish someone would make a "Pontiac" RAIV style wedge head for the LS blocks.

[Dragncar]

Just because its a SOHC Hemi head does not mean the valves are not canted, they are.
They had a 2.40 intake valve and a 2" exhaust valve......think about that !!

[steve25]

Kaufman makes a Hemi head that could be a great starting point for a SOHC motor, but in the world of boost and making over 2000 hp where you need to possibly tare the motor down in between runs a overhead Cam motor is a pain.

This is why non of the top fuel car run overhead cams.

[Nobuddy]

I don't pay attention to the Pro classes any more but last I knew, NHRA rules forbid overhead cams in Top Fuel and Silly Cars.

Geared cam drive like most race engines have would make head change easier. Old Ford SOHC chain would be a nightmare.

[BILL BOWMAN1]

Originally Posted by Nobuddy

I don't pay attention to the Pro classes any more but last I knew, NHRA rules forbid overhead cams in Top Fuel and Silly Cars.

Geared cam drive like most race engines have would make head change easier. Old Ford SOHC chain would be a nightmare.

The last time I remember an OHC motor was the McGee car, driven by Gary Beck in the late 80’s.

[RA462]

Checkout the gear drive on this Pontiac build.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvH6btEP3S0&t=77s

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by RA462

Checkout the gear drive on this Pontiac build.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvH6btEP3S0&t=77s

Thanks.

I see in the comments that nothing has changed. There is GTO George telling them what is wrong and how to make it better. lmao

Stan

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Thanks.

I see in the comments that nothing has changed. There is GTO George telling them what is wrong and how to make it better. lmao

Stan

Too funny

[Elarson]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Thanks.

I see in the comments that nothing has changed. There is GTO George telling them what is wrong and how to make it better. lmao

Stan

He criticized the AllPontiac solid cast block. They performed flawlessly in the Boss Bird. How bad can it be??

LOL,
Eric

[opeliac]

Originally Posted by Elarson

He criticized the AllPontiac solid cast block. They performed flawlessly in the Boss Bird. How bad can it be??

LOL,
Eric

Dont forget he has a blown race car that barely runs in the 7s...That should play a role when trying to evaluate his opinions.

[BILL BOWMAN1]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Thanks.

I see in the comments that nothing has changed. There is GTO George telling them what is wrong and how to make it better. lmao

Stan

I surely don’t miss that D bag.

[Nobuddy]

Originally Posted by RA462

Checkout the gear drive on this Pontiac build.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvH6btEP3S0&t=77s

That is good stuff. For race engines with no passenger car legacy, check out the gear drives on an old Honda F1. At 6:00 for just the gears.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWwUhxcZyqI

[Mr Anonymous]

ELarson: preponderance of original architecture

"I have George Washington's axe. Replaced the handle six times, and the head five times, but its still the same axe." For more info, google the "Ship of Theseus paradox".

[Dragncar]

It does not have a KRE billet block, so it must be bad ?

[Dragncar]

So watching some of Morris's vids its apparent he "hates" timing chains. Thus the reason he is going with Milodon gear drives on both of these builds.
But here in the real Pontiac world we rarely use them.
What do you guys think ?
Most of us just get a good chain. My last engine has billet caps and a 3/4" wide Morse chain was tighter than than a Rollermaster .004 short chain so I ran it. (cam needed to be straight up) For short chains the Rollermaster and Cloyes use the same chain, Iwis. You can get a Cloyes "Z" chain but only in standard.
Why the hate for chains ?
That guy is a good a builder as they get so his opinion is worth a lot.
The BOP belt drive is great and all but only for max effort deals. Is it possible to make us one that fits under a stock timing chain cover ? Or maybe use a Chevy water pump and some sort of bolt on cover for the front of our oil pans ?

[Elarson]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

So watching some of Morris's vids its apparent he "hates" timing chains.

Different strokes for different folks.

But the Cloyes timing chain was simple and awesome in the Boss Bird. It got way more abuse than normal:

valvesprings over 1000# open
exhaust valves opening against combustion pressure
driving a 26 gpm fuel pump
and driving an MSD 44 amp magneto (the magnets are so strong in these that you need an 8" wrench on the shaft to turn one "by hand")

FWIW,
Eric

[opeliac]

Originally Posted by Elarson

Different strokes for different folks.

But the Cloyes timing chain was simple and awesome in the Boss Bird. It got way more abuse than normal:

valvesprings over 1000# open
exhaust valves opening against combustion pressure
driving a 26 gpm fuel pump
and driving an MSD 44 amp magneto (the magnets are so strong in these that you need an 8" wrench on the shaft to turn one "by hand")

FWIW,
Eric

How many of the fittings, on the timing cover, were used to oil the chain? I'm trying to determine which to use.